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  • Originally posted by The Gentleman Gamer View Post
    Disciplines will not be going above five dots. There's no need for it. It's just as easy to make amalgams.
    Not with the '1 power per dot' limit, and the lack of power amalgams have versus the old 7-9 disciplines, the irony is, we get a book about Blood God's when the system doesn't support that level of power anymore. We no longer have the blot out the sun, turn an entire city into devoted servants etc etc of the Eldest Methuselahs. It's a totally different flavour of setting. Old ST of mine described Methuselah Vs Antediluvian Vs Caine as ground zero of a tactical nuke, ground zero of a the thermonuke, ground zero of the KT asteroid strike, when compared to characters, either way, pcs die when deities walk.
    Last edited by Taggie; 07-07-2020, 05:59 PM.

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    • Originally posted by Taggie View Post

      Not with the '1 power per dot' limit, and the lack of power amalgams have versus the old 7-9 disciplines, the irony is, we get a book about Blood God's when the system doesn't support that level of power anymore. We no longer have the blot out the sun, turn an entire city into devoted servants etc etc of the Eldest Methuselahs. It's a totally different flavour of setting. Old ST of mine described Methuselah Vs Antediluvian Vs Caine as ground zero of a tactical nuke, ground zero of a the thermonuke, ground zero of the KT asteroid strike, when compared to characters, either way, pcs die when deities walk.
      Well you actually got a book about Cults of the Blood Gods, hence why there were no 5 / 5 amalgams in there.


      Matthew Dawkins
      In-House Developer for Onyx Path Publishing


      Website: https://www.matthewdawkins.com
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      • Originally posted by The Gentleman Gamer View Post

        Well you actually got a book about Cults of the Blood Gods, hence why there were no 5 / 5 amalgams in there.
        But to have that 5/5 amalgam, you loose the lvl 5 in 1 of the disciplines involved, and can never, ever under any circumstances learn it. That limit is crippling, at any level, but especially for elders and meths, Also are we talking abilities on the scale of Perfect World, or Draught of Phoenix Blood...
        Last edited by Taggie; 07-08-2020, 01:57 AM.

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        • Originally posted by Taggie View Post

          Not with the '1 power per dot' limit, and the lack of power amalgams have versus the old 7-9 disciplines, the irony is, we get a book about Blood God's when the system doesn't support that level of power anymore. We no longer have the blot out the sun, turn an entire city into devoted servants etc etc of the Eldest Methuselahs. It's a totally different flavour of setting. Old ST of mine described Methuselah Vs Antediluvian Vs Caine as ground zero of a tactical nuke, ground zero of a the thermonuke, ground zero of the KT asteroid strike, when compared to characters, either way, pcs die when deities walk.
          I see that as one of the biggest improvements in the new edition. Vampires as peers of the Great Cthulhu aren't my thing. To me, personally, the point of elders is to have loads of Highlander/Forever Knight style flashbacks, not godlike power. The new edition does a great job of that, even introducing a system - Memoriam - specifically dedicated to it.

          The 1-power-per-dot thing strikes me as overly restrictive for elder characters, especially as there's no limit on the number of amalgam powers you can buy. In some cases it denies you abilities that you had before - you can no longer have earth meld, wolf form, bat form and mist form, for instance, one of them has to go. But you do have greater versatility in Discipline development to compensate.

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          • Originally posted by JezMiller View Post

            I see that as one of the biggest improvements in the new edition. Vampires as peers of the Great Cthulhu aren't my thing. To me, personally, the point of elders is to have loads of Highlander/Forever Knight style flashbacks, not godlike power. The new edition does a great job of that, even introducing a system - Memoriam - specifically dedicated to it.

            The 1-power-per-dot thing strikes me as overly restrictive for elder characters, especially as there's no limit on the number of amalgam powers you can buy. In some cases it denies you abilities that you had before - you can no longer have earth meld, wolf form, bat form and mist form, for instance, one of them has to go. But you do have greater versatility in Discipline development to compensate.

            I loved the meths as actual blood gods mechanics, that credible global threat is now gone, they aren't a threat to civilisations any more

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            • Originally posted by JezMiller View Post

              I see that as one of the biggest improvements in the new edition. Vampires as peers of the Great Cthulhu aren't my thing. To me, personally, the point of elders is to have loads of Highlander/Forever Knight style flashbacks, not godlike power. The new edition does a great job of that, even introducing a system - Memoriam - specifically dedicated to it.

              The 1-power-per-dot thing strikes me as overly restrictive for elder characters, especially as there's no limit on the number of amalgam powers you can buy. In some cases it denies you abilities that you had before - you can no longer have earth meld, wolf form, bat form and mist form, for instance, one of them has to go. But you do have greater versatility in Discipline development to compensate.


              wait does an amalgam take a dot-spot or not? For instance requires Oblivion X Potence y, does that occupy an Oblivion spot?
              Last edited by Taggie; 07-08-2020, 01:50 PM.

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              • I think we're getting pretty far from Justin here...

                Originally posted by JezMiller View Post
                But you do have greater versatility in Discipline development to compensate.
                I don't really think that's going to satisfy people that want a greater distinction between neonates, elders, and methuselahs.

                While I don't have a problem with V5 deciding to cap Disciplines at 5, the cap on powers-per-dot, and the condensing of multiple early Disciplines into single Disciplines in V5 undo a lot of the versatility the core setup could have accomplished. "This vampire is better at being fast, while this vampire is better at balancing," isn't really a strong point of versatility in development compared to what previous editions or VtR can do.

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                • Yes, if people want to discuss Advanced Disciplines they should create a new thread.

                  Or I will:

                  http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...ed-disciplines


                  Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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                  • Originally posted by Taggie View Post

                    It's a totally different flavour of setting.
                    Because it's a totally different setting, on many levels. Simple as that. Everyone could have their own preferences of which they like better, but it's undeniably not the same setting.



                    If nothing worked, then let's think!

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                    • Originally posted by PMárk View Post

                      Because it's a totally different setting, on many levels. Simple as that. Everyone could have their own preferences of which they like better, but it's undeniably not the same setting.
                      If you're referring to V5 then please leave the thread and consider yourself under warning for Edition Warring. We do not tolerate that anymore.


                      Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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                      • Main thing about Justin Achilli, who is mostly associated with Vampire in it’s incarnations after (and including Vampire Revised, is that he isn’t afraid to ignore the rantings of fans of all stripes, and just do things his own way. He is an experienced hand but the memories from the 1990s, when he took over, was as somebody who didn’t suffer fools and had a pretty sardonic wit for dismissing them with cutting remarks and gestures. I don’t know how the WoD setting or rules will develop, but my take is that he’s more pragmatic than ideological about such things.

                        Main thing for me, though, is that Modiphius gets a bit of a move on with its publications. The Onyx Path has been doing well in getting support out for V5 (Cults of the Blood Gods is a really interesting entree for me, and Chicago is as good a campaign book as any for any game), but aside from the Fall of London campaign and a few intro supplements, we haven’t had much from Modiphius recently. The Players Handbook, which is mainly a priority for some because they want to see the rest of the Clans is stalling, but the big supplement I wanted to see was The Second Inquisition book.

                        So, I don’t know what Justin’s role is exactly, but if he can get things moving, get more books on the shelves in hobby shops and generally communicates a clear direction for the line as a whole, then it has to be good news.
                        Last edited by Trippy; 07-09-2020, 10:13 PM.

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                        • Originally posted by Trippy View Post
                          The Players Handbook, which is mainly a priority for some because they want to see the rest of the Clans
                          And Gargoyles!


                          VTM: Dark Shores: Lineages of the Great Lakes
                          VTM: Fingers of the Eldest: Bogatyri
                          WTA: Forgotten Alliances

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                          • Originally posted by SalamanDer View Post
                            And Gargoyles!
                            Errrr I have bad news to you...

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                            • Originally posted by blailton View Post

                              Errrr I have bad news to you...
                              I didn’t realize there has been an official statement about Gargoyles?

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                              • Originally posted by Trippy View Post

                                I didn’t realize there has been an official statement about Gargoyles?
                                They are still a thing in V5 (they are in LA by night) but I don't think they'll include bloodlines in the Players Handbook

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