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  • Most overpowerred discipline

    What's in your opinion the most overpowered discipline in V20? I think it is Chimerstry. At top levels, it basically allows you to control reality itself. You can create permanent illusions and at antedilluvian level even create your own pocket universe where you are basically god. I honestly dont think any other disclipline comes close. The ravnos Antedilluvian really hit the jackpot, which is why i find it hard to believe that he is dead. But it's probably less impressive at lower levels then some other disciplines
    Last edited by blackshade; 09-07-2020, 03:48 PM.

  • #2
    Wasn't the word of dev that Zapathasura was basically in a protracted hunger frenzy and didn't have the presence of mind to use any reality bending powers?

    I'd say it's probably a tie between Vicissitude and Obtenebration. I can't be entirely sure which one comes on top of the heap.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Saur Ops Specialist View Post
      Wasn't the word of dev that Zapathasura was basically in a protracted hunger frenzy and didn't have the presence of mind to use any reality bending powers?

      I'd say it's probably a tie between Vicissitude and Obtenebration. I can't be entirely sure which one comes on top of the heap.

      I dont know about any dev but that's certainly what was implied to be happening. He only lost because he was acting like a lunatic. Didn't use any of his reality bending powers, or did he? It could have all been an illusion. The writers really have an escape here, if they ever want to bring him back.

      I guess the only thing that really pointed to his death, is the fact that his clan went mad after he supposedly went down for the count. If the ravnos frenzy was a side effect of his death, then we can conclude that no other ante has died. But lets not forget he has/had animalisme 10 aswell. Maybe he used that to make his clan frenzy and turn on each other to make his own demise more believable.
      Last edited by blackshade; 09-07-2020, 05:18 PM.

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      • #4
        Presence, who needs enemies when everyone will be your friend. Even if they don't want to be.


        You've been playing around the magic that is black
        But all the powerful magical mysteries never gave a single thing back

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        • #5
          This is an easy one, Necromancy. You can have wraiths do things for you like fight, or spy (Sepulchre). You can have zombies and wraiths bound to protect your haven (Sepulchre and Bones). You can create a cloud that forces torpor or suicide (Four Humors). You can become a corpse and walk in daylight (Corpse in the Monster) You can scream and lower difficulty or do agg to anyone around you or summon literally hundreds of spectres (Vitreous). You can dissolve someone (Graves Decay). You can have ghosts haunt someone into torpor or suicide (Path of Haunting). You can kill someone from afar (Level 5 Ritual). It is the best because you have the insane combat potential of instant suicide or torpor of four humors, and the versatility of wraith servants. Finally your haven is always protected.

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          • #6
            Path of Conjuration did not have nearly enough restrictions for the chemically or otherwise scientifically savvy vampire.

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            • #7
              V20 raw? Celerity. Obfuscate is a runner up.

              Rai/some slight house rules/use pre-revised soak rules then nothing is op.


              Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by blackshade View Post
                What's in your opinion the most overpowered discipline in V20? I think it is Chimerstry. At top levels, it basically allows you to control reality itself. You can create permanent illusions and at antedilluvian level even create your own pocket universe where you are basically god. I honestly dont think any other disclipline comes close. The ravnos Antedilluvian really hit the jackpot, which is why i find it hard to believe that he is dead. But it's probably less impressive at lower levels then some other disciplines
                Sadly, can be countered by a single ritual.

                V20 I think it's Thaum. You can do everything with it...

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                • #9
                  Most thaumaturgy is weak. People give it flack because it looks strong if you ignore the costs. It's 7xp for a new path, x4 current level for everything else. A lot of powers are bad jokes too. Path of Mars?

                  The only 'Kaw fookin ell' powers of V20 Thaumaturgy are Dark Thaumaturgy and the Path of Mercury (or Praapti; The one that blink-teleports you) The only ritual of -BanThis- proportions is the Kool-aid one used by New Wave sorcerers in the thaumaturgy supplement.

                  Truly, I think 'Thaumaturgy is OP' is the call of someone who hasn't yet read enough (except for when refering to the powers I just listed. Those are game breakingly strong)

                  Koldunic sorcery's pretty broke though.


                  Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.

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                  • #10
                    I'd fo with thaumaturgy as well,
                    paradigm breaker and synergizes really well with so many other disciplines (temporis, auspex etc...),
                    imo thaumaturgy correspondence is ultimately better than koldun way of spirit,

                    I have thaumaturgy induced PTSD, and I go nuts whenever I have less than 5 in countermagic (which means...always)


                    -

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                    • #11
                      Dominate, since it allows you to make any human do anything. Give me all your money, drop a nuke on Bob's head, your only limitation is other vampires with the same power interfering. If there was only one vampire in the world, and that vampire was a dominate master, then that vampire would rule the world from behind the scenes.

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                      • #12
                        Depends. What levels are we taking into account? Dominate 10 is probably the nastier discipline existing. Literally allows you to take control of anybody, anywhere. Find a safe spot to torpor your real body and go to town.

                        You can make Mages, Wolves, other vampires, and anything that has a mind you. You keep your own godly stat and get an additional body with its own power to do whatever.

                        Did I say that you can use that power without ever being close to your victim? Dominate 8 allows you to Dominate anyone as long as you know where there are. Auspex or another puppet allows you to locate the target. (so you don't even need any other discipline) And said puppet can you use your Dominate powers. (hello making mathusalem your slaves using random humans... or just find where they sleep and distance dominate!)
                        Last edited by Morbus; 09-09-2020, 01:11 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by MyWifeIsScary View Post
                          The only 'Kaw fookin ell' powers of V20 Thaumaturgy are Dark Thaumaturgy
                          Eh? Can you give any specific examples? Because by my thinking, most Dark Thaumaturgy is pretty underwhelming and not worth the side-effects (not even counting the price of getting it).

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                          • #14
                            Fires of the Inferno, V20 RAW, offers up to five levels of difficulty 9 unsoakable damage per turn. That'll incinerate ventrue methuselah and ancient gargoyles alike. It is strictly stronger than Lure of Flames. It's a power of two-turn death for anyone who isn't immune.

                            I really don't like the approach they've taken with DT to be honest. DT shouldn't be about wonderful powers with side effects, DT should be about dealing with the devil for gaining quick power. It's hinted at that in V20 'dark thaumaturgy' is just a shortcut, and yet there they are with fabulous power. I wouldn't mind 'So most people don't practice this path because of ethics' but DT puts up nonsense like 'your aura glows green and so everyone knows to you're dangerous and should be put down' (I can't remember if the 'Price' Of DT was mandatory or not in V20, it wasn't before)

                            I would prefer to balance DT. Make it fair. Fires of the inferno? Sure it does up to five levels of damage a turn but unlike normal fire you can soak it with your stamina... Something like that.


                            Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.

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                            • #15
                              In lore, Dominate and Presence have my vote for the great equalizers, the ones that allow a Vampire to hold their own in the World of Darkness. When other supernaturals think of the threat Vampires represent, they think of their influence over others.

                              In game mechanics, the nonsense blood sorcery disciplines are obviously the only serious competitors for the top spot, with possibly Celerity right behind them.

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