Onyx Path Kicked to the Curb?

[CTPhipps]

Yeah....this is kinda looking like Paradox had in mind to do this for some time so just kept fucking Modiphius over with bullshit excuses to push the PG back further and further until they were ready to just dump them, Hunters W5 team has been disbanded and looks like they have had to play along under NDAs which is why they've been essentially incommunicado for the past 6 months. I mean if I didn't already have a laundry list of shitty behaviour from Parawolf this would be surprising....but its really just more of the same.

I tend to think its probably Modiphius instead of Paradox but I admit I don't know.

[PopeVlad]

Yeah....this is kinda looking like Paradox had in mind to do this for some time so just kept fucking Modiphius over with bullshit excuses to push the PG back further and further until they were ready to just dump them, Hunters W5 team has been disbanded and looks like they have had to play along under NDAs which is why they've been essentially incommunicado for the past 6 months. I mean if I didn't already have a laundry list of shitty behaviour from Parawolf this would be surprising....but its really just more of the same.

Just a heads up...Hunter is Renegade.

https://www.renegadegamestudios.com/...coming-in-2021

[elmerg]

Just a heads up...Hunter is Renegade.

https://www.renegadegamestudios.com/...coming-in-2021

That's a year old, and is no longer applicable based on World of Darkness taking the core material in house, based on what we've seen.

Renegade is also just a publisher and distributor, but they have done the publishing/distribution for Hunters' other games such as Kids on Bikes. They aren't the same company, they just have worked very closely in the past.

[PopeVlad]

That's a year old, and is no longer applicable based on World of Darkness taking the core material in house, based on what we've seen.

Renegade is also just a publisher and distributor, but they have done the publishing/distribution for Hunters' other games such as Kids on Bikes. They aren't the same company, they just have worked very closely in the past.

Thanks for the correction, my apologies. I guess only Hunter got kicked to the curb, after all. Unless it's Vigil or Reckoning though, it's a shame, but I have no vested interest. Onyx Path at least, has NOT been kicked to the curb.

[The Gentleman Gamer]

The nightmare is over! World of Darkness's relationship with OPP remains UNCHANGED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! Thanks Elmerg!

The extent of Onyx Path's role in the new arrangement is still being discussed. We can't clarify or expand on that while we're still in discussion. Thanks!

[Matt the Bruins fan]

Hopefully they'll take into account that OPP work seems to be widely regarded in a favorable light by the customer base.

[tasti man LH]

(But Wraith wasn't spared? I didn't read it, but it sounds like they took liberties)

Wr20 is fine. Only real issue is that it didn't change enough to appeal to old players, or change the minds of non-Wraith-WoD fans that still have their hangs ups on "this game is too depressing, even for World of Darkness".

[Shakanaka]

Uh, they changed how Arcanoi operated and that sparked up some badness/grumbling in the Wraith section of this site if you remember correctly. Change isn't what the old players wanted, they wanted a collage of all the old stuff like the other 20th books. It was just a big sore in a rather good book. It was especially weird because the changes were made in bad faith with the deliberate idea Ghosts "should be the weakest"...

[The Gentleman Gamer]

Uh, they changed how Arcanoi operated and that sparked up some badness/grumbling in the Wraith section of this site if you remember correctly. Change isn't what the old players wanted, they wanted a collage of all the old stuff like the other 20th books. It was just a big sore in a rather good book. It was especially weird because the changes were made in bad faith with the deliberate idea Ghosts "should be the weakest"...

That's not why we made the changes. The reason Wr20 has bigger changes to it than, say, V20, is because it never had a Revised edition. Wr20 was a chance for Richard Dansky and the rest of us to update the game fully to a new edition.

[Trippy]

XD

I think the same could be said of all Mage editions - except maybe the 2nd.

The Mage 2nd edition was a hot mess. The only edition that was really polished, in my view was the MET version of the rulebook - Laws of Ascension and it’s Companion. Very concise, but manages to clearly explain the concepts and world in very good detail.

[Shakanaka]

That's not why we made the changes. The reason Wr20 has bigger changes to it than, say, V20, is because it never had a Revised edition. Wr20 was a chance for Richard Dansky and the rest of us to update the game fully to a new edition.

Well in any case I love Wr20, but I mostly just stick with 2e Arcanoi. The Arcanoi and Dark Arcanoi from the previous edition were moderate and didn't need a nerf.

Oh and from an old interview: ttps://thestorytold.libsyn.com/episode-19-wraith-the-oblivion-20th-anniversary-interview-with-matthew-dawkins

22:15 - 22:35

"Someone gots' to be at the bottom of the food chain."

[tasti man LH]

Well in any case I love Wr20, but I mostly just stick with 2e Arcanoi. The Arcanoi and Dark Arcanoi from the previous edition were moderate and didn't need a nerf.

Except they're not weak:

-Moliate Common 2: Sculpt lets you get Claws and Fangs…which specifically grant you the ability to deal Aggravated. And this is a Common Art, and only at rating 2, meaning any non-Masquer wraith could learn it.

-Usury Common 3: Corpus Conduit lets the users steal health. While it is just bashing damage if you use it on an undamaged target, it still adds up over time. And that yes, you get more mileage if the target is already damaged. However, the Difficulty is always determined by max health level. Which on non-wraith targets, is usually always 7 at the highest. So…in crossover games, Usurers do have a pretty good advantage against the other splats.

-Inhabit Initiate 3: Smith's Tenacity allows the wraith to soak Aggravated damage. Which yes, the caveat is that in order to learn it is that you need to be in the Artificer Guild to learn it, but technically that Guildwraith could still teach it to anyone else (which even then, that's up to the ST on how strict/loose the Guilds are at teaching non-Guildswraiths Initiate Arts).

-Keening Common 4: Crescendo, which is the closest thing to an AoE attack in Wraith. A little bit of a "but…" since it targets everyone in hearing range, including your allies, but still pretty powerful. This is compounded with a new rule when it comes to Keening where using it across the Shroud incurs a -4 to the Difficulty…meaning if you're targetting someone across the Shroud you're always going to be rolling at Difficult 4-6. Which is a pretty good equalizer to it's "two successes count as 1 level of damage". And then there's it's Initiate version Banshee, which swaps it out with aggravated damage.

Since I know this is about Outrage Common 5 - Obliviate: no, I don't think it's a matter of the Big Damage power getting nerfed, it's more about "expanding the other powers so Obliviate isn't the One True Answer to Big Damage". And even ignoring that…it's Angst penalty only went up by 1. 3 Angst isn't that big of a leap from 2 Angst. And someone in your Circle should know Castigate to lower Angst anyways because…why wouldn't you?

If the concern is Pathos cost…well:

1.) Your character should be regularly engaging in their Passions because they should be Things-they-were-going-to-do-anyways and how that's kind of the whole point of the game. Your character has no excuse for not going into an encounter will full Pathos, nor neglecting their Passions.

2.) Even if that isn't the case, your characters should also be stocking up on Soulfire Crystals to pop and gain Pathos back. They have no excuse at not being friends with the local Usurer, or having one in their Circle.

And that's without getting into how INSANELY DURABLE wraiths are:

-Every single wraith starts off with 10 base health, something the other splats can only achieve with either Merits or certain powers.

-Insubstantiality trivializing Skinlands damage to only the 1 bashing damage.

-They're the only splat that doesn't insta-die from aggravated damage overflow. And that they have a chance on coming back from, an option none of the other splats really have.

And even then, looking at the older Arcanoi write-ups, I don't really see any substantial differences in the actual mechanics of the powers, aside from different resource expenditures (Pathos, Corpus, Willpower, etc)

All of which aren't really an issue.

[Resplendent Fire]

This is reassuring.

I also asked Bruce Baugh about this and they said the Arcanoi felt fine in comparison to 2nd. The only person I'd trust more on that is Richard Dansky himself.

[Japheth]

I still have massive reservations on a company that hasn't proven itself, compared to OPP. 6 years vs. RichT's nearly 30 years with WW/OPP (combined)... Seems to me that OPP is the better in terms of quality.

[CTPhipps]

I still have massive reservations on a company that hasn't proven itself, compared to OPP. 6 years vs. RichT's nearly 30 years with WW/OPP (combined)... Seems to me that OPP is the better in terms of quality.

I do have bigger trust for OPP but hopefully they will be able to continue their current relationship. OPP also has its own projects these days.