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Headcanons on Native American Bloodlines

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  • #46
    Sigh. Look. I get that you don't want to admit that you are wrong, but... you've pulled numbers from a hat. I've cited the comprehensive work of The United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization, showing that the numbers were bullshit.

    Yes, west Africa is not the whole of Africa. Thats not actually relevant. Africa also encompasses vast deserts, immense plains of which is is peppered with glass beads that are vaguely radioactive for reasons no-one has been able to determine. There are remains of immense lakes, ruins from a civilization that mummified their rulers a thousand years before Egypt, pumped groundwater to sustain an urban civilization in the middle of the Sahara, and sustained itself on a slave-maintained network of hundreds of miles of utterly lightless tunnels. There are vast areas that did not see humans until after the Fall of Rome, in all likelihood. Theres a people with a Y-chromosome that converges with the rest of humanity about 300 000 BC, and traces of DNA from an archaic population that may have introgressed as late as 9 000 BC. And a lot more. Egypt, Ethiopia, Punt...east Africa had its civilizations also.

    But the point is that it is West Africa too. If we are talking about population densities and where the carrying capacity was, we are going to talk about the most population dense and fertile areas. (Also don't underestimate the ingenuity of humans. The middle of the Sahara had an urban civilization during the first millennium AD.) I actually do think Jared Diamond has some strong lines of reasoning, but one shouldn't let them get in the way of actual facts.

    And when the Antediluvians dispersed from the Second City, no area was urban like we see it today. Population density was what mattered. And the second city was located in the desert a bit west of Tanis. White Wolf gave out the location in 2004, Time of Judgement pg 156.

    If you find me rude, that is because I am really tired of internet misinformation, and because the whole "Africa was all sparsely populated tribes before the white man" belongs on Stormfront.


    • #47
      What's the relevance? You're clearly looking for some kind of moral victory here, implying that I'm some nazi adamant that africa is all little villages (What is wrong with you? Take a step back for a moment, please)

      Fact is, Africans got to the medieval era on the hypothetical tech tree without breaking into the renaissance. Yeah, they had cities. That's great. I'm not disputing that and I don't fully understand why your imagination is getting carried away with this stormfront nonsense.

      The point, and relevance to vampire, is that Europe had an explosion in wealth and population (plagues aside) around the time of the renaissance. Huge societal uphevals happened in the mortal world, and the vampires followed suit: The Anarch revolt went into swing, Giovanni ate the Capadocians, the sects which went on to dominate the world were formed, all the weird bloodlines are sidelined; Players put down "Vampire: The Dark Ages" and started picking up "Vampire:The Masquerade".

      Africa.. Did not do this at all. The overwhelming majority of sub-saharan Africa remained as-is. And thus there is no overwhelming impetus for anarch revolts, the formation of sects, or other upheavals. The slave trade and Early colonization efforts probably had little impact on the vampire population. An "anarch"-like revolt could be happening now with the explosive growth of the continent giving opportunities, but it's too soon, perhaps too quick, for such a decisive shakeup like the formation of the sects in europe. Thus it makes sense that africa is still this 'nature preserve' of clans and exotic bloodlines and such because mortal society giving vampires the presure to slaughter each-other en-mass is very recent and hasn't run it's course yet.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Trollroot View Post
        If you find me rude, that is because I am really tired of internet misinformation, and because the whole "Africa was all sparsely populated tribes before the white man" belongs on Stormfront.
        Don't make these kind of statements comparing posters to Nazis, even in jest. Consider this an infraction ad leave the thread.

        If you have an issue with posters historical statements, report them.

        Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.