Create life; What are we doing?

[MyWifeIsScary]

Edit: I refer to the last power of 'Path of Conjuring'; the wording is vague and simplistic and I don't understand the intended scope/power of this ability.

Interpretation 1
You can create a custom lifeform no larger than yourself, give it 5/5/5 5/5/5 5/5/5 and it's supremely skilled
Interpretation 2
You create a custom lifeform, you give it all the talents, skills and knowledges up to your own rating
Interpretation 2.1
You create a custom lifeform, it learns very fast.
Interpretation 3
You copy someone, hopefully Henry Cavill, who has the talents, skills and knowledges of Henry Cavil.
Interpretation 4
You make the most generic, average person every time you make a person, and the most generic average dog every time you make a dog.
Interpretation 5
Lucky draw.

Or something else...

[jamiemalk]

You create a body looking however you want, with whatever stats you want, but it has no skills, talents or knowlages.

It has no mind or soul, you can't give it memories, it's just a physical shell, perfect for possessing as the power says, but pretty much useless at anything on itself.

[Dwight]

I would say because of their very nature vampires can't create life at best they can twist something already living into the shape they require

[Pnizzle]

By that logic, its pretty powerful to ride that body via dominate possession for max physicals and appearance.

Combine that with necromancy and you can have a very potent vessel for ghost/necromancy possession.

[Thoth]

First off which edition of the power are you asking about?

As for the V20 version it seems pretty clear to me to me that you are just making a custom shaped automaton that just happens to be biological rather than robotic. It has enough of your knowledge to understand commands and actions, but not enough to create answers on its own. Thus you could create a temporary being to play the piano with sheet music, but it couldn't compose its own concerto.

At its base, it just creates custom minions or mooks for your thaumaturgist. With creativity you can create scenarios where people can have alibies or get convicted of crimes. Mechanically the ability to use dominate with it allows for some day light fun. But the fact that the creation breaks down after a week means that using the power to produce necromantic fodder doesn't seem viable. I would say that it doesn't copy a humans knowledge, so if you copy bill gates the copy won't know his passwords or bank account numbers. But since most Tremere know Dominate, getting that sort of information isn't that difficult.

As for how custom the creature is, that depends on what you are doing with it and what your group/ST wants to allow. On one hand 10 bp is a large investment for any power, though it does last up to a week, and the power can duplicate most creatures. On the other hand can you copy something like a Vozhd or create modified things on par with Vicissitude, I don't think so.

So the simplest answer is that you can create duplicates of specific people/creatures and or modify them within the range of reality (thus you can copy a human or an elephant, but not a human with an elephants strength score).

If you have a large enough herd to provide the blood points and a high enough Dominate score, the path of conjuring more or less creates Altered Carbon sleeve technology in the V:tM setting. Sure your duplicate can have 5/5/5 physical stats, perfect hearing and eyesight, and perhaps even physical merits, but it is still restricted to your knowledges and skills. Obviously it is a mortal body as far as damage sources and sunlight, but that has its uses if your want to eat food or have sex.

Though I could easily see some Tremere claiming to have created a ritual of sunlight immunity, using the dominate and duplicate combo to present false proof and then con some kindred who lack Auspex into walking out into the sunlight. Even a limited reading of the power gives great potential to a creative player.

[maekkel]

Nr 4.
If my memory not betrays me any creations via Path of Conjuring are always generic and as the creations are mindless , they are without skills. Additonal successes increasy the quality of a copy.
i.e. a generic human just got attributes of 2 dots each, no skills, no advantages, no flaws - i´d say not even a navel.
Even if the conjured human looks like Henry Cavill and can maybe mimic his awkward smiling, that empty minded Henry Cavill looking thing still got only 2 dots in it´s attributes.

[MyWifeIsScary]

They tend towards being generic, but they are not generic by law. if You try to create 'bobs knife' or a 'model 7' whatever you don't get a generic knife or a generic phone, you get roughly wgat you want.

almost certain your creation would have a belly button just because everyone else has one.

(also, WoD conspiracy time: 'normal' attributes are at 3 dots, but the average is at 2 because people live stunted and controlled lives with shitty diets and soul crushing jobs and... but then there's the gnostic argument which says we should be 10/10/10 like gods if it werent for reality being a prison)

[Thoth]

almost certain your creation would have a belly button just because everyone else has one.

Ah, but would it default to an "innie" or an "outie" without either the conjurers specific choice or knowledge of the subject?

(also, WoD conspiracy time: 'normal' attributes are at 3 dots, but the average is at 2 because people live stunted and controlled lives with shitty diets and soul crushing jobs and... but then there's the gnostic argument which says we should be 10/10/10 like gods if it werent for reality being a prison)

Unless you delve into Mage and its less of having a reality prison that keeps you from being max statted, and more of reality keeping your avatar from awakening and thus reshaping reality at will.

[maekkel]

Path of Conjuration - is not well constructed - and imho - as it is not a mage game - to open - especially as a Thaumaturgy power - which are mostly quite specific. It´s regarding to game design quite overpowered.
I tend to rather restrict the usage than expands indiviual path powers, in comparison to a standalone disciplines.
In the end use the interpretation, with which your table is the most happy.


-- --

My assumptions of navelless conjurations, is the point, that conjurations don´t have flaws, like scars, scratches and the like. A navel is technically a scar.

As Thoth says: Reality prison is Mage: the Awakening, The roadblocked Soul is M: the Ascension.
Regarding npc stats: if you look at generic npc stats I also tend to see the average is closer to 3 dots - than 2 dots.
But I take on the attributes desciptions that state that 2 dots is "generic" while other dot ratings are outstanding.