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  • Alternative Clan Weaknesses / Banes

    Hi.

    Yesterday I was reading the V5 Clan Banes and realized I have always thought the Setite one (Ministry or whatever) would work better on the Lasombra (in addition to the classical no-reflection effect).

    Then I started thinking about a replacement for the Setite one (to give theirs to the Lasombra in my games), without any results. And then, I started thinking "has anyone ever changed or altered these weaknesses as homebrew?".

    Well...have you? Anyone using alternative clan weaknesses / banes (specially for the Setites) on their games?

  • #2
    I dropped the Salubri third eye because it looks stupid. Though that's more a Valeren flaw than a Salubri one. I think someone watched too much manga.

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    • #3
      I’ll definitely be dropping the Ravnos bane for something a little closer to the Toreador one (only vice instead of beauty-related) if I convert my existing campaign to V5 at some point. The nightly move-or-die is just too disruptive to my campaign world to be useful.

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      • #4
        List of Clan Advantages and Disadvantages in my homebrew rules. The morality/degeneration system is a little different than RAW, so I've added some explanations where I think it's necessary. "Advantage" under my mechanical system is very roughly equivalent to getting an extra die to your dice pool and dropping the difficulty by 1. So it's pretty powerful.

        Brujah:
        Advantages:
        · Brujah begin with an additional point of Willpower
        · Brujah get an additional rank in Attributes to start.

        Disadvantage:
        · Brujah give away Advantage on all Frenzy rolls.

        Gangrel:
        Advantages:
        · Gangrel ghouls begin with both Fortitude and Potence, and may purchase both disciplines at half normal cost.
        · Because of their greater affinity for the instincts of their Beasts, Gangrel gain Advantage on all hunt rolls.

        Disadvantage:
        · Buying off Beast Ranks costs Gangrel characters double the normal experience point cost. ("Beast" is a separate 10-point trait that coordinates with but is independent of Humanity.)
        · Over time, Gangrel ghouls invariably develop both the Lunacy and Vulnerability to Silver Stigmata. (Stigmata are roughly equivalent to "Banes" or certain flaws.)

        Malkavian:
        Advantages:
        · Because of their being so deeply in touch with their own inner darkness, Malkavians receive Advantage on all Frenzy checks, regardless of the trigger.

        Disadvantage:
        · Malkavian Humanity begins at 6 instead of 7.
        · Malkavians begin the game with a Monstrous Inhumanity trait. (Inhumanity traits add particularity/color to a character's moral degeneration and carry some minor penalties)

        Nosferatu
        Advantages:
        · Nosferatu begin play with two additional Ranks to place in their Home Lores.
        · The Nosferatu, because of their patience and experience with suffering, are able to buy off their Inhumanities and Beast Traits for half the normal experience costs. (Beast Traits add particularity/color to a character's Beast, and give both additional frenzy triggers and some minor penalties)

        Disadvantages:
        · Nosferatu begin play with three Stigmata: Eerie Presence, Pallor, and Permanent Fangs.
        · Nosferatu have a starting Appearance of 1, and can never have more.

        Toreador:
        Advantages:
        · Toreador begin play with one additional Rank in the Herd Background.
        · Toreador begin play with one additional Rank in the Masquerade ability.
        · Toreador receive Advantage on the first roll of an Inhumanity Check. No other clan is quite so adept at feeling guilty for a few minutes. (An "Inhumanity Check" is the same as a Degeneration roll)

        Disadvantage:
        · Toreador must spend double the normal amount of XP to buy off Inhumanity Traits or to purchase Humanity. Once you fall off the wagon, it’s even harder to climb back on.

        Tremere
        Advantages:
        · Tremere are the only clan that has Thaumaturgy as an in-clan discipline. It is a potent and flexible set of powers.
        · The Tremere can rely on their clan’s support network for assistance in extremis. They may always haven at the city’s chantry, or any local clan safehouses if they know the location. Other services are also available, at the GM’s discretion.
        · Tremere begin play with two free dots in the Mentor Background.

        Disadvantage:
        · Tremere have to live in their clan, locked within a rigid and stifling caste structure. They must perform services for the clan or risk punishment. Many have weekly or monthly duties that they must fulfill.
        · Tremre must spend at least one of their Lore dots on Tremere Lore.
        · As part of their initiation, all Tremere have several points (between 4 and 6) of their vitae taken by the clan and stored away, available to their elders as needed. Two are usually in the chantry, while others are distributed up the Pyramid.

        Ventrue:
        Advantages:
        · The Ventrue blood is strong; Ventrue only spend one permanent Willpower when creating True Childer. GMs should also give special consideration to players of Ventrue who wish to purchase the True Childe trait in character generation. (Creating full-blown progeny rather 13th generation near-thin-bloods requires spending permanent willpower)
        · Ventrue begin play with one additional rank each of the Resources and Status Backgrounds. Rank hath its privileges.

        Disadvantage:
        · The Ventrue are very discriminating — about everything. They start play with the Selective Feeder Stigma.

        Setites:
        Advantages:
        · Setites begin with two additional ranks of Lore, and treat all Lores as Home Lores.
        · Setites start with a Beast rating of 2, rather than 3.
        · Followers of Set also have access to various ancient schools of Egyptian magic as an in-clan discipline... if they are able to find a teacher. (See Page XX.)

        Disadvantage:
        · Setites begin play with both the Ultraviolet and Light Sensitivity Stigmata.

        Lasombra
        Advantages:
        · Lasombra begin the game with one Rank of Sabbat Esteem.
        · Lasombra begin play with two additional Ranks in Backgrounds.
        · Lasombra gain Advantage when attempting to recover daily Willpower.
        · Lasombra have access to an exclusive discipline: Obtenebration, the power to command darkness itself.

        Disadvantage:
        · Lasombra begin play with the No Reflection stigma.
        · Lasombra start with Humanity 5.
        · Lasombra start with two Inhumanity traits, at least one of which must be Monstrous.

        Tzimisce
        Advantages:
        · As they swim in the Beast, Tzimisce gain Advantage on all Animalism contests.
        · Tzimisce have deep occult and mystic roots in their past, and if a Tzimisce can locate a teacher, he or she may learn Koldunic Sorcery as an in-clan discipline.
        · Tzimisce gain a +1 to their Contest Values whenever using any type of magic or sorcery.

        Disadvantage:
        · Tzimisce begin play with the Earthbound and Aura of Evil stigmata.
        · Tzimisce start with Humanity 4.
        · Tzimisce gain a stigma each and every time that they gain an Inhumanity Trait.
        · Tzimisce receive a –10% penalty when attempting to create progeny. This penalty is waived if the childe is a True Childe.

        Cappadocians
        Advantages:
        · Cappadocians are all but dead inside; their remote aloofness does not make a comfortable home for a Beast. They pay half cost when buying off Beast or Beast Traits.
        · Cappadoccians are skilled Necromancers, and gain a +1 bonus to their Contest Values on any and all rolls to activate Necromantic powers or rituals (or against attempts to resist their powers).
        · Being all but dead inside already, Cappadocians receive the level 4 and 5 Stamina Health Level bonuses regardless of their Stamina Rank.

        Disadvantage:
        · Cappadocians are all cursed by their blood with a stereotypically vampiric, corpselike appearance. Like the Nosferatu, they begin with 3 Stigmata: Pallor, Eerie Presence, and Satanic Eyes.
        · Cappadocians begin Chargen with an Appearance of Zero (they do not receive the initial dot) and their Appearance may never exceed half of their Humanity, rounded down. If their Humanity drops, their Appearance may as well.
        · As creatures whose essence is even more strongly of Death than most vampires, Cappadocians have difficulty awakening during Daylight Hours. They give away Advantage on all rolls to awaken or remain awake.
        · Cappadocians are despised and hated by the elders of the Nosferatu. The Nosferatu all but wiped out the clan centuries ago, and their hatred is such that if word were to surface of a known Cappadocian (was not under the protection of a Prince) the clan would go to great lengths to destroy it.

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        • #5
          I've long ago replaced the Tzimisce clan bane with one that makes them suffer damage equivalent to sunlight if they enter a private dwelling uninvited. They're creatures of custom and hospitality to the core.

          I prefer the old Salubri, Tremere, and Ravnos weaknesses over the new ones.


          Blood and Bourbon, my New Orleans-based Vampire chronicle.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by False Epiphany View Post
            I've long ago replaced the Tzimisce clan bane with one that makes them suffer damage equivalent to sunlight if they enter a private dwelling uninvited. They're creatures of custom and hospitality to the core.
            I like this, I think it's a pretty fair trade as both an be incredibly inconvenient.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Vamps Like Us View Post
              I dropped the Salubri third eye because it looks stupid. Though that's more a Valeren flaw than a Salubri one. I think someone watched too much manga.

              Pfft. That flaw predates the prominence of manga in America by a long time. It's a play on the Eastern mysticism 'third eye' of enlightenment, which was Saulot and the Salubri's big thing back when they were initially introduced as healers.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by False Epiphany View Post
                I've long ago replaced the Tzimisce clan bane with one that makes them suffer damage equivalent to sunlight if they enter a private dwelling uninvited. They're creatures of custom and hospitality to the core.
                Originally posted by Vamps Like Us View Post
                I like this, I think it's a pretty fair trade as both an be incredibly inconvenient.
                It's a good idea for a major clan weakness (not just an obscure Flaw like it has been in the past), but for the longest time my preference has been to give it to the Ravnos. I feel like the inability to enter dwellings uninvited ties back nicely to the original 1st Edition Ravnos portrayal as "social nomads" who crave for companionship but are rejected by humans again and again. Giving the Ravnos any sort of psychological compulsion is incredibly suspect because of the their history of racial stereotyping in past White Wolf products, but giving them one of those classic, supernatural vampire weaknesses that everybody even outside of this fandom knows about? It makes the Ravnos feel more like a vital part of the setting, which is, personally speaking, a feeling they sorely need.

                Another alternative clan weakness that I really like was suggested by CTPhipps a while back. It's always been debatable whether the Lasombra's original lack of reflections was a weakness at all, but giving the clan a hefty mechanical penalty and using existing game mechanics to do it elegantly solves the problem in one stroke:

                Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post
                Repulsed by Reflections: A Lasombra does not cast a reflection or create their own shadow. Any mirror, photograph, or video larger than a car rearview mirror or handheld one that should show their image but does not results in them having to make a self-control roll. They will also need to make one to allow themselves to be filmed or a photo taken. In short, they react to mirrors and recording devices like most vampires do fire.
                Last edited by Elphilm; 01-11-2021, 02:31 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Elphilm View Post
                  It's a good idea for a major clan weakness (not just an obscure Flaw like it has been in the past), but for the longest time my preference has been to give it to the Ravnos. I feel like the inability to enter dwellings uninvited ties back nicely to the original 1st Edition Ravnos portrayal as "social nomads" who crave for companionship but are rejected by humans again and again. Giving the Ravnos any sort of psychological compulsion is incredibly suspect because of the their history of racial stereotyping in past White Wolf products
                  Eh. I don't care about the racial stereotyping history because I'm not playing with (those) past White Wolf products, and I'm not publishing my games as books for a larger audience.

                  The (Latina) Ravnos PC in my current game had a compulsion to humble the prideful. That was fun. I like how the clan's compulsions to indulge their vices make them outcasts and nomads among Kindred society too. The V5 clan bane is interesting but feels like it could be a chore to deal with in games.

                  Another alternative clan weakness that I really like was suggested by CTPhipps a while back. It's always been debatable whether the Lasombra's original lack of reflections was a weakness at all, but giving the clan a hefty mechanical penalty and using existing game mechanics to do it elegantly solves the problem in one stroke:
                  Oh wow, this is great. It even has precedent in the 1931 Dracula being repulsed by mirrors.

                  I'm making it the new Lasombra clan bane in my games. The original bane was too weak and I don't like how the V5 update makes the clan uniquely unable to interact with technology.


                  Blood and Bourbon, my New Orleans-based Vampire chronicle.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by False Epiphany View Post
                    The (Latina) Ravnos PC in my current game had a compulsion to humble the prideful. That was fun. I like how the clan's compulsions to indulge their vices make them outcasts and nomads among Kindred society too.
                    That sounds good to me. My intention certainly isn't to pooh-pooh anyone's home games.

                    The reason I like to give the inability to enter dwellings uninvited to the Ravnos instead of the Tzimisce is that I feel like a Ravnos character (or their Beast, depending on how you interpret the weakness) might actually respect a human being's claim on a building enough to ask for permission to enter, or at least play mind games to garner an unwitting invitation.

                    The Tzimisce, on the other hand? Given the way they have been written for the past 30 years in Vampire products, the idea that a Tzimisce would care about the inviolability of some peasant hovel doesn't quite gel for me. Tzimisce characters would certainly respect the intimate domains of their vampire peers, but humans rarely rise above foodstock or raw materials in their eyes. I feel like the proposed weakness clashes with the core inhumanity of the clan.

                    Then again, my Tzimisce are more Necroscope Wamphyri than Stoker's Dracula, so that colors my view on the issue.

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