Meaning of "ride out a frenzy"

[Mu_]

Hi guys.

I am an Spanish person, thus English is not my native language. I don't have normally problems in reading material written in English, but sometimes the meanings of verbs with prepositions are difficult to me.

I am currently working in a translation of Dark Ages Companion roads, because the official Spanish translation is filled with big mistakes.

The level 10 sin of Road of Metamorphosis is "Failing to ride out a frenzy". I've searched the meaning of "ride out" and wiktionary says: " To tackle a difficult problem and survive". This is quite clear to me, but I am not sure what it means in game terms. It is the same of "to ride the wave of a frenzy" or more like when you avoid entering a frenzy because the difficulty is less or equals to your Instinct trait? Can you give me an example situation in which you would enforce a Conviction roll?

Thank you.

[Theodrim]

It's the same as riding the wave. In other words, a Tzimisce at Metamorphosis 10 would be committing a sin against the path for trying to avoid frenzy.

Some of the older books have dodgy writing.

[HOD]

Riding a frenzy is vouluntarily failing the willpower check to resist frenzying and instead using willpower to direct your actions during the frenzy, until everything that triggered the frenzy is dead.

Thus, Failling to ride out a frenzy means deliberately attempting to avoid frenzying, in other words attempting the check to resist frenzy (and/or spending willpower to remove yourself from the object/person that triggered the frenzy).

Kindred with Instinct who have ratings higher than the difficulty of a check, don't even have to do the roll, they are simply so in-tune with their beasts that such minor triggers doesn't even set the frenzy off at all.

[lustral_star]

From a language perspective:

"Ride out" can mean "to tackle a difficult problem and survive".

This gives the impression or meaning that you actively try to work out a problem, fix a problem, or deal with a problem. This definition can work, and it makes sense to an English speaker.

However, when it's used as "Failing to ride out a frenzy", they are using a more colloquial and common interpretation of "ride out".

Here, they use it with a more passive meaning: "ride out" is commonly used to imply that you don't actively tackle a situation, you just wait for the bad situation or problem to pass. Where I am from, we commonly use this to describe bad weather: we "ride out" a bad storm, which means we wait for the storm to pass over us and go away. This is the same meaning they intend when they say "Failing to ride out a frenzy".

In this instance, it means "Failing to let a frenzy just happen". The intention is that it is bad for a vampire on this Path to try and interfere with their frenzy, or to try and resist their frenzy when they feel it happening.

[Telgar]

Riding the Wave is a specific, mechanical term. It has a whole little rules section. If you fail to use Instinct to control the entire duration a Frenzy ("Ride the Wave" of it) then you've Sinned against Metamorphosis.

[Mu_]

Thank you all very much. This kind of expressions can be too subtle for me, but now it is clear.

[HOD]

Riding the Wave is a specific, mechanical term. It has a whole little rules section. If you fail to use Instinct to control the entire duration a Frenzy ("Ride the Wave" of it) then you've Sinned against Metamorphosis.

Well, technically, one isn't using Instinct to control the frenzy, you use Willpower. It's just that unlike Kindred with self-control, Willpower is used in order to direct the frenzy, rather than resist it.

[Mu_]

Well, technically, one isn't using Instinct to control the frenzy, you use Willpower. It's just that unlike Kindred with self-control, Willpower is used in order to direct the frenzy, rather than resist it.

I think is Telgar who is right. It is Instict what you roll to direct the frenzy during as muchs turns as successes of the Instict roll. If you have Self-control yo can spend Willpower to control the frenzy for a turn, and if you don't you can't use Willpower that way, you have to use Instict.

[Just John, Forever...]

Mu_ is correct (as is Telgar) -- you use Instinct to ride the wave of frenzy (directing destructive urges/actions in a "constructive" manner, so to speak). This is as opposed to Self Control, which is for *resisting* the frenzy in the first place. HOD is likely cross-remembering how a vampire can use WP to guide/mitigate (for a turn) an ongoing Frenzy; that, however, is a separate game mechanic from using Instinct to ride the wave/guide the frenzy.

[HOD]

Uh, hrm. I may have...yes. I hate when that happens. And I don't have my books at hand to check. Damn moving business.

Fine, disregard anythign I've said. *sulks*