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  • Rite of Passage

    What are some good examples for a Rite of Passage quest for a pack of four or five cubs?


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  • #2
    Originally posted by wonderandawe View Post
    What are some good examples for a Rite of Passage quest for a pack of four or five cubs?
    Personally, this really depends on the Pack's purpose and how in depth you want to go with it.
    Off the top of my head, I've seen/played:
    Locate and return missing kinfolk (this happened in 2 different games - in 1 the kinfolk ran away with a Garou from another Sept, in the other they went missing in the city and a Vampire had eaten them)
    Hunt down a corrupt creature stalking the woods (turned out to be an escaped Vampire animal. would work just as well with a formori)
    An Umbral quest to the Totem's Realm to ask it for patronage
    One time the pack's work while Caern being assaulted (during the start of the Rite of Passage) ended up counting. But I think that was just to get a combat intro to the game and then get straight into the game proper.


    Tailor the Rite of Passage to the group if you can help it. Anything can work if you put effort in. They can have to recover a Fetish, or destroy a Vampire (hopefully a minor one). Just try and stay away from having them face Spirals. Spirals are thematically the Garou's equals and a Rite of Passage should be something less deadly imo.


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    • #3
      To emphasize what idpersona said, your rite should really depend on pack makeup. I actually ran short, separate rites for each player as they were inducted into their respective tribes. The Get Ahroun had to fight a big spirit monster that had risen near the edge of their protectorate, the Iron Rider Theurge had to track down a friendly gaffling in a dangerous game of hide-and-seek in a penumbral city. The Bone Gnawer Galliard protected a leper colony from a predatory vampire (and met his future wife, haha). The Shadow Lord Ragabash parlayed with his own tribe mates and engaged in a running battle with would-be traitors to Grandfather Thunder.

      I was lucky in that I had enough one-on-one time to tailor a lot to each tribe and auspice, and we all had a blast. Even if you don't go super in-depth for each individual, some aspect of the rite should shift the spotlight onto each character in turn.

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      • #4
        I always wondered about the sheer lethality of Rites of Passage, for Garou who do not even have a RANK yet.

        As far as I understand, before completing the Rite of Passage, you do not have ANY Gifts (as you are "Level Zero") or the ability to step sideways, which could potentially be a HUGE liability for Metis Cubs who have to juggle staying hidden from Human Surveillance AND fighting Supernatural Threats with no supernatural assets of his own.

        Being thus ill equipped, how are cubs who can't step sideways and use gifts going to survive the trials of The World of Darkness that they are about to step into?

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Lin Liren View Post
          Being thus ill equipped, how are cubs who can't step sideways and use gifts going to survive the trials of The World of Darkness that they are about to step into?
          No Gifts, but they can Step Sideways. A Garou going through their Rite of Passage has had all the training they need to join the Nation and serve as a warrior. They should know how to use all of their innate powers. Buildup to the Rite should be at least a few months (up to a year or 2) of training.

          Per the lethality, the Rite does sometimes kill the cub. It happens. I just don't think it's common.


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          • #6

            You shouldn't overly depend on gifts. All werewolves should be capable of defending themselves without the need of fancy-pants magic, and if you can't figure out how to communicate with enigmatic spirits through interpretive dance, you ain't meant to be a Theurge.

            Originally posted by Lin Liren View Post
            Being thus ill equipped, how are cubs who can't step sideways and use gifts going to survive the trials of The World of Darkness that they are about to step into?
            Now that I think about it, a couple of the cubs going through the rite voiced similar concerns, but they still made it through mostly intact.
            Last edited by The Laughing Stranger; 01-09-2017, 06:45 AM.

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            • #7
              -------------------------
              Last edited by The Laughing Stranger; 01-09-2017, 06:46 AM. Reason: posting at 6 AM is a bad idea. You make daft mistakes.

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              • #8
                No Tribal Gifts. IME, Cubs usually have their Breed and Auspice Gifts before they're considered ready to go on the Rite of Passage.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by etherial View Post
                  No Tribal Gifts. IME, Cubs usually have their Breed and Auspice Gifts before they're considered ready to go on the Rite of Passage.
                  They shouldn't. They lack the required Rank to learn them.

                  And echoing The Laughing Stranger, Garou shouldn't overly rely on Gifts. Even without them a Garou should be more than capable.


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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by idpersona View Post
                    They shouldn't. They lack the required Rank to learn them.
                    Originally posted by OPP, on p. 151 of W10,
                    Level One Gifts are the weakest, taught to cubs and cliaths...
                    The game designers would seem to disagree with you on that one.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by etherial View Post
                      The game designers would seem to disagree with you on that one.
                      I can do that too:
                      Originally posted by OPP, pg.144 of W20
                      Benefits of Rank
                      Rank among the Garou has many privileges.
                      • Gifts: When a Garou reaches a new rank, she can
                      petition spirits to learn new, more powerful Gifts. To learn
                      a new Gift, a character must not only have the required
                      experience points, but also the Rank equal to the level of the

                      Gift.
                      And with you as well it would seem. In any case, this has always been my understanding of it. If you want cubs with Gifts, that's fine (and can be supported by fluff text like you just did). But to present it as clear and straight forward is incorrect.


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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by idpersona View Post
                        I can do that too:

                        And with you as well it would seem. In any case, this has always been my understanding of it. If you want cubs with Gifts, that's fine (and can be supported by fluff text like you just did). But to present it as clear and straight forward is incorrect.
                        By definition, cub PCs are nonstandard. They are never clear and straight forward.

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                        • #13
                          I generally went with the three starting Gifts being what the 'cub' learns while learning about his place in their society. Gifts bought with freebies are between the RoP and start of the game.

                          Keep in mind that even Kinfolk can learn first rank Gifts.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by etherial View Post
                            By definition, cub PCs are nonstandard. They are never clear and straight forward.
                            You cited a place in the book that agrees with you and disagrees with me. I did the same. I prefer to lean on the section on "Benefits of Rank", as I feel takes precedence over a line of fluff. Neither of us is wrong and to each their own. I have never had (and seen) cubs learn Gifts in game because I look at Rank as being required since that is how it has always been presented (to my interpretation) in the books across editions.

                            Personally I try and make sure the PCs play by the same rules as NPCs (and vice versa). PCs being PCs shouldn't have them using a different set of standards.

                            Originally posted by EvilTyger View Post
                            I generally went with the three starting Gifts being what the 'cub' learns while learning about his place in their society. Gifts bought with freebies are between the RoP and start of the game.
                            Again, to each their own. This isn't a thing where someone is right and someone is wrong, since a single book disagrees with itself in 2 different sections.

                            Originally posted by EvilTyger View Post
                            Keep in mind that even Kinfolk can learn first rank Gifts.
                            The Kinfolk thing is a better argument imo, but Kinfolk with Gifts has always been a weird gray-ish special snowflake situation in world. (well until the most recent book that seems to change that)


                            Technically speaking, nothing rules-wise stops any Ranked Garou (cub of otherwise) from learning whatever Rank Gifts they want if you take such an open interpretation of the rules (as long as they can find a teacher; Spirit or otherwise). There is no place where it states that Rank 1 Garou cannot learn Rank 5 Gifts except the "Benefits of Rank" section, which is being viewed as a lower authority than the fluff sentence in the beginning of the Gifts section. I wouldn't run it that way, but that doesn't really matter for any other ST's games.



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                            • #15
                              The old Rite of Passage book described it similarly: "Usually, but not always, the time before the rite of passage is spent in study with the elders of the tribe or sept. It is during this time that Garou are taught their gifts and their inner nature, and taught to respect Gaia." (Rite of Passage, p. 16) Similarly, W20 includes in their Coming of Age section: "Once a cub has been found, the rescuing Garou take her to a sept. There, she prepares for the Rite of Passage. Part of this preparation is learning the ways of the Garou common to all the tribes — the Litany, stepping sideways, controlling the Change, and even learning a Gift from a spirit. ... Once these cubs return, they become cliath, join their respective tribes formally, and learn their first tribal Gifts." (W20, pp. 42-43). That might suggest that breed and auspice beginning Gifts are allowable, but not the tribal Gifts (since they're not a true member of that tribe). Later, W20 again repeats that same restriction of just the tribal Gift, saying the following: "Once a Garou completes his Rite of Passage, he is welcomed into one of the Thirteen Tribes of the Garou Nation. Before the completion of this rite, he is a cub, and therefore treated as little more than a child. He may not learn tribal Gifts or receive the tribe’s deepest secrets." (W20, p. 46). What about breed and auspice starting Gifts? Do those fall under the previous quote, from 42-43? Perhaps.

                              As idpersona pointed out, that's all thematic text instead of an outlined system rule. However, I don't think the two have to be contradictory. The "Benefits of Rank" and its authority isn't belittled by the inclusion of an exception, which is how I interpret all of that. I more or less see it similarly to how EvilTyger described it. To me, those "beginning Gift" options are selected as those that are okay for cubs to have. Perhaps that's why the beginning Gifts are restricted beyond just all of the Rank 1 Gifts.

                              Anyway, I agree with idpersona's sentiment in that there isn't a right or wrong. These seem like valid options, but just that. Each tribe/sept/individual elder may have their own take, in-game. Each Storyteller may have their own interpretation and their own reasoning for it. WoD is notorious for leaving things fuzzy, and for intentionally giving conflicting information (or at least info biased by the particular narrator) when presented thematically (as opposed to presentation of straight-up rules). I think part of that purpose is to say, "Hey, run with it. No one Garou has all the answers on even any single topic, so don't stress it too much."

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