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  • DNFusion35
    started a topic Stepping Sideways and Physical Bodies

    Stepping Sideways and Physical Bodies

    In my game, I've been starting to get more involved into the spiritual, Umbral side of things. A question keeps coming up in regards to the physical body of a werewolf that steps sideways. What exactly happens to a werewolf's body when they go into the Penumbra? I figure they can't use it to say, step sideways and then reappear in a different location in the physical world. Does their body go into the Penumbra with them? Does it stay in the same location where they originally stepped? And depending on the answer to that question, what happens to their body when they go into different Umbral realms? If they use a moonbridge to go to an Umbral realm, is their body still in the physical world? It's always been kind of confusing to me. I ask because the idea I have for my next session, where a prisoner will escape into an Umbral realm, and I'm not entirely sure it makes sense as regards to how the Umbra works. Thanks guys!

  • heinrich
    replied
    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    What exactly happens to a werewolf's body when they go into the Penumbra?
    Nothing. Unlike Lachdanan I would think it is still a physical body, behaving like it. It isn't converted into epherma and back into "normal" matter when leaving the umbra, but it remains normal matter the whole time. Meaning, that gifts working on matter act normally, as do spirit Charms, and those powers working on epherma do not work.
    Same is true for a person brought into the Umbra via gifts (Parting the Veil) or items (Tractor beam) or the W20 gift that combines both somewhat (Grasp from the beyond, iirc).

    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    I figure they can't use it to say, step sideways and then reappear in a different location in the physical world.
    No, Garou can do that.
    The thing is this. Stepping sidewqay (without gifts or rites to augment it) brings a garou into the penumbra. Once there the garou could, even unintentionally, move away deeper into the umbra, so his new position doesn't have a corresponding place in the material world. If that is the case, he can't step out of the umbra there. If returns to the penumbra (or never leaves this area), then his movements in the umbra determine the place he appears in the physical world.

    There is also Peeking. It is my understanding, that a garou who peeks from the penumbra into the material world can move. While prone to attacks within the penumbra, his senses are cast into the material world, allowing to follow a scent trail (according to Core rules revised, iirc). In this case the garou would not unintentionally move into a deeper area of the umbra that has no corresponding material place, for there he could not peek. Stepping sideways while peeking or after having positioned one self using Peeking should allow for very precise determination, where the garou reappears. Meaning, "behind that dumpster, in full cover from the guards"-precise.

    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    Does their body go into the Penumbra with them?
    Yes. Unless they use gifts/rites to alter that.

    Also, all items attached to them with the Rite of Talisman dedication go with him, everything else doesn't.

    However, this isn't a per molecule separation:
    f the garou is stained in the blood of his enemies, the stains will come with him into the umbra. As will all the stuff he ate. If he dedicated his wallet, new change will also come with him into the umbra.

    owever, dedicating a back pack will not allow the step into the Louvre, take the Mona Lisa, stuff it in the backpack and leave with it through the umbra.
    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    Does it stay in the same location where they originally stepped?
    No. See above.
    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    If they use a moonbridge to go to an Umbral realm, is their body still in the physical world?
    A Moonbridge begins and ends with a portal, either in the physical realm or the penumbra or any other part of the umbra. The space between start and end is a bridge made of moon-ligh-lit fog that seemingly stretches the night sky (in an Umbra realm called Atherial Realm) and has it's peak so close to Luna, one might think one could touch it.

    If the portal starts in the physical, everything the garou carries with him goes through the Atherial Realm to the endpoint. Unless you throw something, or someone of the bridge, before exiting.
    Last edited by heinrich; 07-19-2018, 07:17 AM.

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  • Saur Ops Specialist
    replied
    Originally posted by Prince of the Night View Post
    Shame they cant steal Astral Projection with Firebringer.
    They don't need to; it's already a Gift, or at least was in the 1e player's guide, I believe. It also exists among the Mokole Gifts in the form of Dream the Matre's Mind.

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  • Lachdanan
    replied
    Hello,

    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    IWhat exactly happens to a werewolf's body when they go into the Penumbra?
    We don't really know the physics, I think it isn't that relevant in the spiritual matter. It's assumed it turns into spirit-matter, ephemera, while it crosses, wholly into the Umbra. BUT it's never stated or mentioned that it becomes a spirit, so the spirit-related Gifts still won't affect the Garou.


    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    I figure they can't use it to say, step sideways and then reappear in a different location in the physical world.
    They can, but they have to travel to the corresponding penumbral location and step sideways back to the physical reality. And there are realms (Flux, Null Zone for example) which can give you almost instant access to everywheeeeere. Some Gifts, Rites can also help.


    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    Does their body go into the Penumbra with them? Does it stay in the same location where they originally stepped?
    There is no distinction between the body & soul as in the Mage's system. The body goes, where the Garou goes, except when it's stated otherwise.

    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    And depending on the answer to that question, what happens to their body when they go into different Umbral realms?
    Goes, again if not stated otherwise.

    Originally posted by DNFusion35 View Post
    If they use a moonbridge to go to an Umbral realm, is their body still in the physical world?
    Moonbridges bypass two locations (usualy Caern-to-Caern), what can even be physical. The Garou goes, completely.
    Last edited by Lachdanan; 07-19-2018, 05:17 AM.

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  • Prince of the Night
    replied
    Shame they cant steal Astral Projection with Firebringer.

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  • Saur Ops Specialist
    replied
    Changer bodies are half-spirit and half-flesh. Past editions have indicated in places, such as Umbra revised, that you can think of their day to day existence in physical reality as being like spirits clothed in flesh. Stepping sideways inverts and everts this, so that they are flesh clothed in spiritual ephemera. No matter which way it's explained, the result is the same - the Changer appears to blink out of existence to all observers on the physical side, and reappears in the equivalent spot in the Penumbra. Their body always stays with them unless they're astral projecting through specific, other powers.

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