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A Greater Canid Breed

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  • Lian
    started a topic A Greater Canid Breed

    A Greater Canid Breed

    So I wanted to pull this into itsown little thread because I like the idea of trying to combine a greater Canid Breed like Bastet and applying it to Canids, so we have Garou, Nuwisha, Kitsune potentially the same "Breed" along with a variety of others.

    I don't want to call the Breed Garou. I want to leave Garou potentially open for "C. Lupus" alone but its not a hill I'm going to die on.

    So the big issue is Bastet for example their Tribes are strictly Breed based. A Lynx cannot be a Khan. But Garou tribes WHILE generally having some hertege basis aren't as strictly limited. So in combining the two do we limit what a "garou" can be?

    If Kitsune are the mystic tribe do there need to be Uktena? Or can you be a Fox Glasswalker? It seems excessive for there to be 13 tribes of wolves.. 1 tribe of foxes and 1 tribe of Coyotes so something needs to give..

  • Wolf-Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Wilson View Post
    I don't like necro-bumping threads, but have you considered that all Nuwisha are no-moons? In a greater canid breed, would you allow them to have other auspices?
    I was thinking what if they took over the No-Moon Auspice entirely. Garou would no longer have it, they would keep the other four while Nuwisha take No-Moon.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lian
    replied
    Originally posted by Wilson View Post

    Are you converting the Bunyip into dingoes so they're not marsupials? What do you do with the Bonegnawer's ancestral claim to have originated in North Africa before they scattered across the world? Would they include the African sighthounds as well as the famous feral commuter mutts in Russia? Where would you put the Eastern Coyotes and Eastern Wolves, which are probably all wolf-coyote hybrids? Would they claim descent from the Get of Fenris vikings who made pre-columbian contact with North America, or would they be Wendigo, or some of both?
    Bunyip are Dingos. Bonegnawers could have been something long ago but they are Dogs now. Glasswalkers have always been Dogs. The Feral dogs of Moscow are what I am thinking as a solid point.

    So North America-Nuwisha(Coyote) Wendigo (Pure), Uktena (mixed?) this kind of removes Uktena from other parts of the world which is hard.. hmmm

    Children of Gaia let everyone in.


    Leave a comment:


  • Wilson
    replied
    Originally posted by Lian View Post
    Tribe would Come from a particular culture and also GENERALLY provide animal form.

    So Coyote Tribes-
    Nuwisha


    Wolf Tribes-
    Silver Fangs
    Shadow Lords
    Fiana
    Get
    Wendigo


    Jackal Tribes-
    Silent Striders
    Black Furies


    Dog Tribes-

    Glasswalker
    Bonegnawer
    Bunyip

    This is not a complete list but a random idea.
    Are you converting the Bunyip into dingoes so they're not marsupials? What do you do with the Bonegnawer's ancestral claim to have originated in North Africa before they scattered across the world? Would they include the African sighthounds as well as the famous feral commuter mutts in Russia? Where would you put the Eastern Coyotes and Eastern Wolves, which are probably all wolf-coyote hybrids? Would they claim descent from the Get of Fenris vikings who made pre-columbian contact with North America, or would they be Wendigo, or some of both?

    Leave a comment:


  • Lian
    replied
    Originally posted by Wilson View Post
    I don't like necro-bumping threads, but have you considered that all Nuwisha are no-moons? In a greater canid breed, would you allow them to have other auspices?

    It depends on what Nuwisha are in a greater Canid Breed. IF they are a Tribe I don't see why not? I mean Get are Kind of combaty but they have things other than Ahrouns


    So I guess getting back into this:

    Tribe would Come from a particular culture and also GENERALLY provide animal form.

    So Coyote Tribes-
    Nuwisha


    Wolf Tribes-
    Silver Fangs
    Shadow Lords
    Fiana
    Get
    Wendigo


    Jackal Tribes-
    Silent Striders
    Black Furies


    Dog Tribes-

    Glasswalker
    Bonegnawer
    Bunyip


    This is not a complete list but a random idea.






    Leave a comment:


  • Wilson
    replied
    I don't like necro-bumping threads, but have you considered that all Nuwisha are no-moons? In a greater canid breed, would you allow them to have other auspices?

    Leave a comment:


  • Lian
    replied
    Ok lets get back to what is included.

    Wolves
    Coyotes
    Jackals
    Wild Dogs
    Domesticated/Feral Dogs(if you can play a domesticated Rat of Nimh I'm not going to lose sleep over someone playing a were husky)

    This pretty solidly covers everything in Canis.

    I really don't like how Mokole invalidate choice of form as anything but "asthetic" Since there are multiple wolves, jackals they could go back to tribal.

    Leave a comment:


  • Muad'Dib
    replied
    Originally posted by Lian View Post


    Coyote is a trickster this means he is a teacher and a student. He brings new Knowledge to the world but only by finding it and surviving it. So having them have an explorer bent makes sense. The thing is... Raven's also a Trickster God.
    The Coyote as presented in W:tA seems to me to be a full-time trickster, compared to the Raven. For example the Coyote is a trickster who makes pranks and does undertakings that use, play with, and refer to the fact and the idea that he is a trickster. Another characteristic of the Coyote is that all ( or almost all ? ) that he does is related to and involves him being a trickster in one way or another. I don't think that the Raven goes this far ?

    Leave a comment:


  • CeltSPZ
    replied
    Originally posted by Lian View Post


    There are coyotes on the East coast but my understanding is Rabbit is the big player...

    Rabbit is a big player as well...however in terms of Coyote, their traditional range is not East of the Mississippi. Their range expanded as Europeans decimated the wolf populations of the East, as a result they are not really featured in Eastern Native lore (at least none that I am familiar with).

    Leave a comment:


  • Lian
    replied
    Originally posted by CeltSPZ View Post

    Toss in turtles/tortoises fill the trickster slot in many East Coast native lore (no Coyotes or Ravens in these areas) and in many African tales as well.

    There are coyotes on the East coast but my understanding is Rabbit is the big player...

    Leave a comment:


  • CeltSPZ
    replied
    Originally posted by Lian View Post


    Coyote is a trickster this means he is a teacher and a student. He brings new Knowledge to the world but only by finding it and surviving it. So having them have an explorer bent makes sense. The thing is... Raven's also a Trickster God.
    Toss in turtles/tortoises fill the trickster slot in many East Coast native lore (no Coyotes or Ravens in these areas) and in many African tales as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lian
    replied
    Originally posted by CeltSPZ View Post


    actually that would be pretty cool, could go with many myths about how water is the gateway to another world. Also on a neat note there is evidence that early Anatolian cultures saw turtles as guides for the dead as well.

    As for the Nuwisha, for me it was always about being pranksters first. Maybe I missed out on some myths that back up all the umbral stuff for the Nuwisha. Personally I always thought the Corax should have been better then the Nuwisha with that since they are all about finding information and spreading information (granted I maybe missing some Corax stuff, just the Nuwisha always came off as better umbrally).

    Coyote is a trickster this means he is a teacher and a student. He brings new Knowledge to the world but only by finding it and surviving it. So having them have an explorer bent makes sense. The thing is... Raven's also a Trickster God.

    Leave a comment:


  • CeltSPZ
    replied
    Originally posted by Lian View Post

    So to put this on topic. with the Nuwisha joining the Greater Canid Breed maybe some of their "umbral breed' thing could be taken by the Ao, thus why they have more explicitly supernatural features than the Mokole.

    actually that would be pretty cool, could go with many myths about how water is the gateway to another world. Also on a neat note there is evidence that early Anatolian cultures saw turtles as guides for the dead as well.

    As for the Nuwisha, for me it was always about being pranksters first. Maybe I missed out on some myths that back up all the umbral stuff for the Nuwisha. Personally I always thought the Corax should have been better then the Nuwisha with that since they are all about finding information and spreading information (granted I maybe missing some Corax stuff, just the Nuwisha always came off as better umbrally).

    Leave a comment:


  • Lian
    replied
    Originally posted by CeltSPZ View Post


    Alright I could get behind that, granted still access armor
    So to put this on topic. with the Nuwisha joining the Greater Canid Breed maybe some of their "umbral breed' thing could be taken by the Ao, thus why they have more explicitly supernatural features than the Mokole.

    Leave a comment:


  • CeltSPZ
    replied
    Originally posted by Lian View Post


    didn't explain myself so well.

    Ao get the mythic features, they represent perhaps the a connection to the wyld.. or the Gaia who never was.. or the Dreaming or the High Umbra vs the Middle umbra?

    Alright I could get behind that, granted still access armor

    Leave a comment:

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