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  • War of the Dragon Kings Discussion

    Have to say I found the "War of the Dragon Kings" one of the most unique ideas, in the entire Shattered Dreams PDF.

    felt it deserves its own thread to discuss things, many things

    If it says anywhere tell me, but does it offer an explanation on why Dracid Bones never got found by Paleantolagists.

    Is it safe to say the Mnesis Background isnt purchasable at the time.
    Last edited by Prince of the Night; 10-02-2016, 05:25 PM.



  • #2
    First of all, thanks, I'm very proud of that section. I'm proud of the whole book, but the Dragon Kings are something new and unique in the WtA universe.

    Regarding Drachid remains - we didn't have the word count in a book that necessarily focused on the Wars of Dragons and not every nuance of their life. My draft thoughts on this are (1) Chance, (2) Burial rituals (3) Mnesis, and (4) Wait. 2 and 3 are somewhat combined.

    The first - chance - recognizes that fossils are a pretty lucky thing to find surviving so many hundreds of millions of years. The fossils we've discovered have been estimated to maybe account for 1% of the number of creatures that lived through the enormity of the time period.

    2 and 3 - Rites and Mnesis - the Dragon Kings had procedures for dealing with their dead, much like we do today. This may have included rituals that dissolved the body back into nothingness. The Dragon Kings possibly had Mnetic 'coffins' and 'crematoriums' that dissolved the bodies and gave them back to the Mnesis. This kind of religious dedication would be consistent with the awe and reverence the Kings held the Mnesis. Another possibility was that they entombed the bodies within the Mnesis, in grand imaginatory structures that would still be there if not for the collapse of the realm.

    The last - wait - ties into the previous explanations and acknowledges that even if the Dragon Kings did destroy bodies on death, they couldn't have gotten every one, with all their wars and chaos. One day fossilized Drachid remains may be found. Wouldn't that be an interesting shake-up for the world?

    Another idea is to take the creation of Drachid as 'born from Gaia's dreams of what could be' more literally. The Drachid survived and bred true because Gaia's dreams were intimately connected to the Mnesis. Once the Dragon Kings killed the Mnesis, the remains of Drachid simply dissolved into nothingness. Survivors continued on, as Gaia's gift of life spark triumphed over the Mnesis's gift of form, but once life escaped the body, the shell dissolved away. Much like Mnetic creations themselves.

    So there's a few ideas. Yes, I've spent some time thinking about it. If we ever get the chance to write an entire source book around this era, I'd expect that we'd dedicate some word count to covering these aspects of Dragon King life, and what became of the Drachid.

    I'm happy to discuss this, other questions about the War of Dragons, or other questions about the book in general.


    Aims to write stuff you like. WoD | Changing Breeds, Umbra, Book of the Wyrm, Shattered Dreams CofD | Werewolf: The Forsaken 2nd ed, Idigam Anthology, The Pack, Demon Storyteller's Guide, Hurt Locker, Dark Eras Companion, Beast Player's Guide, Deviant: The Renegades The Trinity Continuum | Æon

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    • #3
      Am I devaluing the setting from the book if I want to play IN the setting, not through its Fall?

      How central to life would the Dragon Kings be.

      would gains, or losses of Rank, or ROP's be relatively public ceremonys, in your opinion.


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      • #4
        Not devaluing it at all. We tried to give enough info that you could play in setting - though you'll have to fill in a few gaps and holes yourself. (Like figuring out which Gifts apply, and which don't.)

        How central Dragons Kings are depends on what kind of game you want to play. And IMO, Dragon Kings are into pomp and ceremony and reputation - rank increases would be rather public. (There's a reason we included Blazonry as one of the substituted skills!)


        Aims to write stuff you like. WoD | Changing Breeds, Umbra, Book of the Wyrm, Shattered Dreams CofD | Werewolf: The Forsaken 2nd ed, Idigam Anthology, The Pack, Demon Storyteller's Guide, Hurt Locker, Dark Eras Companion, Beast Player's Guide, Deviant: The Renegades The Trinity Continuum | Æon

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        • #5
          Hmmmn one question on the Anasni, How much do you think they'd be culturally by the fact that the Triats in Balance at this period of time.think they would still have aspects or what?


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          • #6
            Hi Prince of the Night! I co-wrote War of Dragons with Bunyip, and I can't tell you how pumped I am to see you're enjoying it!

            I absolutely second Bunyip, too, in that it's not devaluing it AT ALL to want to play "in" the setting. I really want to play it myself!

            Re: the centrality of Dragon Kings - good question! Personally, I tend to run very "street-level" games, so I wanted to make sure that the Drachid were *as* important, story-wise, as their Gaia-blessed cousins (don't try to tell the Kings that, though!)


            Freelance OPP. Dark Eras, Shattered Dreams, and counting!

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            • #7
              Thank you NateD

              Any thoughts on my question on the Anasni, think they'd have Aspects, or what?

              As the triats in relative balance at this point in time.


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              • #8
                Good question! We really didn't have enough words to give much time to the Ananasi (and they really weren't the focus of the Chapter, of course), but I DO have thoughts (extremely non-canon, untested, and not overly thought-out thoughts, that is).

                In short, though, I think of the Mesozoic Ananasi as a very alien, separate race to the Dragon Kings and Drachid. Without humanity to bridge the gap, the two species really didn't have much to unite them. Similarly, the Dragon Kings believed they ruled the world - by divine right, really - while the Ananasi were left to scuttle in the darkness, out of sight.

                If I got to write more (and who knows, maybe one day we will?), I'd have that carry over to their religion and spirituality, too. While the Drachid revered Gaia, but didn't think too much about the Triat (I *hope* that came across in the chapter?), I'd like for the Ananasi to focus a lot more on the Triat. They were the strange, exotic, mysterious occultists of the Mesozoic era, hoarding secrets that the Drachid only glimpsed.

                All of that is to say: yeah, I think that Aspects would definitely remain. I'd have loved to explore what exactly serving a (relatively) harmonious Triat would look like, too.


                Freelance OPP. Dark Eras, Shattered Dreams, and counting!

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                • #9
                  Maybe it just gave them specialization when hiring themselves out as viziers, or assasins?


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                  • #10
                    Is it possible these Dragon Kings could be the same as the Dragon Kings from Exalted?


                    Colleen


                    My name is Colleen. My favorite song is "Wildwood Flower." My ambition is to write the complete history of the White Wolf/Onyx Path universe.

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                    • #11
                      Wait a minute. Shattered Dreams takes place in the MESOZOIC ERA??? This is going to really mess up my crossover timeline. My timeline has the first Mokole being created by the Exalted-era Dragon Kings around 13,000 BC, which is a lot more recently than the Mesozoic Era. This is not good.


                      Colleen


                      My name is Colleen. My favorite song is "Wildwood Flower." My ambition is to write the complete history of the White Wolf/Onyx Path universe.

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                      • #12
                        If its important to your home cannon....just bend it to your will

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by JulianMoon View Post
                          Wait a minute. Shattered Dreams takes place in the MESOZOIC ERA??? This is going to really mess up my crossover timeline. My timeline has the first Mokole being created by the Exalted-era Dragon Kings around 13,000 BC, which is a lot more recently than the Mesozoic Era. This is not good.


                          Colleen

                          only the part with the Dragon kings takes place in the Mezoic Era.

                          and the PDF has rich details on a lost prehistoric civilization, which while advanced in its own way never felt the need for the written word.

                          Oh?

                          ideas on how to involve Rokea?
                          Last edited by Prince of the Night; 10-13-2016, 06:54 PM.


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                          • #14
                            Change the timelines to your own desires. That's the beauty of timey-wimey adventuring, house games, and non-canonical settings.

                            The Dragon King War is even easier due to taking part, largely, in undefined other-realms of dreams, time, and minds. Is any of it 'true'? Or was it all created whole-cloth five minutes ago as a memory of events that didn't happen by Wonderworkers?


                            Open the gates of Hell: Random Demon Generator.

                            Shapeshifting Historian
                            Freelancer - Shattered Dreams, Dark Eras Companion - Forsaken by Rome

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                            • #15
                              yeah in the mokole book its strongly painted as "uber optional"


                              oh a question?

                              does it go against the spirit of things, for someone to claim a power for their archid form to let them to explore one of the other breeds turfs?

                              e.g. a dino saur becoming airborn, or a pteordectyle deciding to go aquatic, or is that probaly understandable since the setting lets you "Reshape" your archid form.


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