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Castigation and Spectres

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Shakanaka View Post
    Also OVERPOWERED for only doing 1 Corpus damage (and at best if we go into specifications, the 1 damage is mostlikely only Bashing at best)? Really? The way OP is letting their player do Purify is LUDICROUSLY overpowered as somesort of psyker laser-beam when it isn't supposed to be like that at all. Unsoakable damage (only OUTRAGE does this), wut? Pulling off a huge cache of damage even theoretically against a Spectre with a flat 10 diff of permanent Angst, wut? That's overpowered, not the former. If users of Castigate were unreliable, the whole Underworld would've fell apart ages ago. The reason FOR their reliability is the reason why they are in the highest demand for services and why their subsequent Guild is given more leeway to show themselves out more "openly" than other Guilds.
    Yes, overpowered. I personally don't take the laser-beam approach, I'm defending that another ST interpreting it that way isn't necessarily wrong.

    Personally I still run castigate as needing a lot of prep time, but that it's Also heavily damaging on corpus. So not a combat power and expensive for those who are on the receiving end.


    Originally posted by Shakanaka View Post
    And also users of Castigate are called Pardoners, not Proctors. Proctors are the ones are the ones that manifest into the Skinlands.

    EDIT: And also flaying the corpuses of other Wraiths... Pardoners? No, definitely not. You must be referencing the Masquers because they specialize in Corpus modification.
    Whoops, was a miss-type on my part.

    Originally posted by Callishka View Post
    And as others have pointed out, players with Outrage could be a little bit annoyed that castigate does insane damage even though it is not known as the damaging Arcanos.
    Yeah, but I doubt pardoners will get that much mileage out of a power that defaults to difficulty 10 vs the enemy you'd want to use it on the most. For a combat oriented game, it sounds fine though. Having multiple offensives powers doesn't invalidate the powers that exist and outrage is still better at damage.
    Last edited by Prometheas; 10-24-2020, 07:27 PM.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Prometheas View Post
      While "technically" accurate, the roll for purify is against the wraith's permanent Angst. As a spectre that permanent Angst is 10 automatically as that's the requirement to be a spectre in he first place. This player shouldn't be getting 6 successes consistently on a difficulty 10 roll unless they've got some seriously powerful difficulty reducing artifacts or loaded dice.
      I somehow completely failed to consider that. The only spectre fight we've had was in the first session, which was mostly a shake-down session, and the player asked me if he could purify the spectre (on the grounds its a shadow) and I couldn't think of a single good reason to say "no," but I only had its starting temporary angst (6) written down and used that as the difficulty. But now that you point it out, you're right. If it only scores on 10s, that really limits its effectiveness.

      The same book descriptions of proctors flaying the corpus of wraiths in a manor that read more like religious flagellation to me than psychotherapy.
      Thank you! I had to write my own set of rules for making Castigation feel like psychotherapy, and even worked it into the storyline that the Pardoner character's mentor is a fellow psychologist fighting against "the old religious nutjobs with their whips and burning brands." Because in 2E, castigation definitely feels like something you could do in combat. What with the whipping people and stuff. Or I don't know, maybe I'm so use to Warhammer's flaggelants that I just didn't question it.

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      • #18
        A Spectre is a Wraith whose Shadow is in permanent control. So depending on how you want to define a Shadow (is it absolutely necessary for the Shadow to not be dominant?), you can argue either way.

        I think this is something different STs will interpret differently. It's a matter of preference whether you want the Castigate Arcanos to work on Spectres. What are the implications of that? Is that something you can live with? If so, go ahead. If it conflicts with how you see the setting, then no.

        I will say that not all of the Castigate levels would make sense if the Shadow was completely dominant. So you want to readjust them by level so it makes sense in your chronicle. That is what I'd most likely do.

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