Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Antagonists for Mortals

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Antagonists for Mortals

    So, I'm running a CofD game in the style of Supernatural. One of the PCs is a private eye and the rest have normal jobs. They got caught up in a case together and have stayed close. I'm giving them various story hooks and letting them go in whatever direction they want. Kind of like a choose your own adventure novel. One of the hooks I was going to throw is a demon on the run from the God Machine. I have not introduced any of these aspects up to this point. The group has only had contact with fey, Santa Claus and Krampus. Don't ask. And they are currently trying to track down a serial murderer. I'm not not sure how to handle a fallen angel / demon with normal mortals. Should I use the rules from the Decent book or use the free form powers from the CofD rulebook? Can mortals handle this? I was going to throw them up against a mummy until I read that book. Talk about a no win scenario. They would have to find a really awesome McGuffin to win that one. Anyway, any help or advice would be appreciated. Thanks!



  • #2
    Do they have to win the ultimate encounter, or do you just want them to have a lot of play time with choice and consequences and things for them to do, but they don't ultimately have to come out on top?


    Hayley Margules, historian and Onyx Path writer
    Chronicles of Darkness: Dark Eras and Companion, Beast: The Primordial Ready-Made Characters, and Dark Ages: Tome of Secrets

    Comment


    • #3
      Demons, mummies and mages are often recognized as the strongest beings among playable supernatural creatures. It mostly comes down to a lot of their powers just being plain unfair even from the other supernaturals' perspectives.

      So, yeah... You might want to scale down demons. The various Hunter books include representations of various supernatural splats that mortals can reasonably handle with, although the mortals in question are assumed to be quite extraordinary. Check out Witch Finders for Witches (scaled down mages), and Mortal Remains for similarly toned down mummies and demons. It mostly comes to writing up stats for them using Dread Powers and Willpower rules from Hunter. You could also stat them as Horrors from the Chronicles of Darkness corebook and call it a day.

      Comment


      • #4
        So, is the Demon going to come into direct conflict with the players? What is the Demon's personality and standards?

        The Demon might not be able to act directly against the player, such as if it gets involved in their lives due to making them parts of its Cover (Pacting the elements away from others they knew). It may suspect some of them of being Angels, or involved in an Occult Matrix (and unless they are a reckless Saboteur, they are unlikely to do anything without first getting an idea of how things fit together).

        If the PCs play their cards right, they may have a valuable ally.

        But as far as rule sets? Is this going to (continue to) be a Mortal focused game, or are you okay with adding in other game's rules and themes as needed? Gadgets might help out down the road (either given or stolen), but then you have to keep track of those rules. Just keeping to Dread Powers makes things more manageable, even if it means less options.


        Malkydel: "And the Machine dictated; let there be adequate illumination."
        Yossarian: "And lo, it was optimal."

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by hm8453a View Post
          Do they have to win the ultimate encounter, or do you just want them to have a lot of play time with choice and consequences and things for them to do, but they don't ultimately have to come out on top?

          I would like them to ultimately come out on top but I'm not forcing them into an immediate confrontation. The game is very low key. So far I would equate the tone to the movie "The Strangers" with a little "The Witch" thrown in.


          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by 21C Hermit View Post
            Demons, mummies and mages are often recognized as the strongest beings among playable supernatural creatures. It mostly comes down to a lot of their powers just being plain unfair even from the other supernaturals' perspectives.

            So, yeah... You might want to scale down demons. The various Hunter books include representations of various supernatural splats that mortals can reasonably handle with, although the mortals in question are assumed to be quite extraordinary. Check out Witch Finders for Witches (scaled down mages), and Mortal Remains for similarly toned down mummies and demons. It mostly comes to writing up stats for them using Dread Powers and Willpower rules from Hunter. You could also stat them as Horrors from the Chronicles of Darkness corebook and call it a day.

            I'm trying to stay away from the Vigil line as much as possible. If I have to use some mechanics I will as I have the books. I just never saw a reason for that line when it's fundamentally the same thing as the base WOD / CofD setting but it never stopped me from buying them. I wasn't sure how different the stats would be if I used the Horror build in the CofD book as compared to fleshing the demon out fully using the Decent book.


            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Vent0 View Post
              So, is the Demon going to come into direct conflict with the players? What is the Demon's personality and standards?

              The Demon might not be able to act directly against the player, such as if it gets involved in their lives due to making them parts of its Cover (Pacting the elements away from others they knew). It may suspect some of them of being Angels, or involved in an Occult Matrix (and unless they are a reckless Saboteur, they are unlikely to do anything without first getting an idea of how things fit together).

              If the PCs play their cards right, they may have a valuable ally.

              But as far as rule sets? Is this going to (continue to) be a Mortal focused game, or are you okay with adding in other game's rules and themes as needed? Gadgets might help out down the road (either given or stolen), but then you have to keep track of those rules. Just keeping to Dread Powers makes things more manageable, even if it means less options.

              I was thinking of them finding the demon in the middle of a confrontation with angels intent on returning him to the machine. They would think he/she was being mugged and help him out. Unknowingly drawing the attention of the God Machine. I don't want the demon to be all Castiel to the group. Just someone they can rely on from time to time.

              The mummy thing is just a colossal nightmare. I had an idea all worked out but when I got the book and started reading I was stunned. The only real way to kill it would be to keep it awake as long as possible and wait it out. Bide their time till it's weak and out of power... OR introduce an artifact that would put the mummy back to sleep. Hmm...
              Last edited by karpomatic; 04-07-2017, 11:19 AM.


              Comment


              • #8
                The stats are going to be different, but you'll actually want that if you want the non-hunter mortals to overcome them without too much intervention from the Storyteller.

                As for Hunter's merit, it's about facing the darkness and defying it (hence the "Vigil," and many references to candles lit in the night), unlike standard mortal games that are usually about facing the darkness and trying your best to survive. The difference between Lovecraft's Dreamland stories (Randolph Carter and all that) and his other ones (where the protagonists all die, go mad, or relatively fine but still traumatized)

                Comment


                • #9
                  For higher powered beings and Mortals, the best bet is to minimize contact with the super-power - deal with their cultists, proxies, etc. When there is a confrontation, care should be towards making sure the super-power is disincentivized towards killing the Mortals (it is counter-productive, or they just could care less). Another option is to employ equally powered rivals to even up the field - then the Mortals can be the valuable, behind-the-scenes tipping point that resolves the conflict.

                  As far as Splats go, Mummies are probably the worst Mortal Antagonists. Sure they are vulnerable to Fire and Relic weaponry, but Sybaris can end a fight before it begins, to say nothing of their Affinities, Utterances, and raw Attribute boosting.
                  Mages, with their many options are almost as bad - at least they go down like normal if you catch them off guard. For Mages, though, the big problem is Dissonance/Quiescence - Mortals can't even remember they did any magic without picking up Sleepwalker (Merit or honorary status via a Supernatural Merit) or Fitful Slumber.
                  Demons, for all their power, at least don't have auto-mind-screwery auras/effects. And normal investigation can unravel their Covers, no special weaponry or tactics required.


                  Malkydel: "And the Machine dictated; let there be adequate illumination."
                  Yossarian: "And lo, it was optimal."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by karpomatic View Post


                    I was thinking of them finding the demon in the middle of a confrontation with angels intent on returning him to the machine. They would think he/she was being mugged and help him out. Unknowingly drawing the attention of the God Machine. I don't want the demon to be all Castiel to the group. Just someone they can rely on from time to time.

                    The mummy thing is just a colossal nightmare. I had an idea all worked out but when I got the book and started reading I was stunned. The only real way to kill it would be to keep it awake as long as possible and wait it out. Bide their time till it's weak and out of power... OR introduce an artifact that would put the mummy back to sleep. Hmm...
                    That would mean that the demon is compromised already, an humans stumbling upon angels doing their tasks... Well, let's just say the bodies of such individuals are seldom found.

                    Also, being so compromised, if the demon was a tempter, let's dub him Quid Pro Quo, all his helping would come with the ulterior motive to gain a new cover. But a soul-pact won't do: The characters have been flagged, so using their skins would take him to square one all over again.

                    The only alternative would be laying low and use these people to craft himself a patchwork cover. Maybe get them into the cult.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Malus View Post

                      That would mean that the demon is compromised already, an humans stumbling upon angels doing their tasks... Well, let's just say the bodies of such individuals are seldom found.

                      Also, being so compromised, if the demon was a tempter, let's dub him Quid Pro Quo, all his helping would come with the ulterior motive to gain a new cover. But a soul-pact won't do: The characters have been flagged, so using their skins would take him to square one all over again.

                      The only alternative would be laying low and use these people to craft himself a patchwork cover. Maybe get them into the cult.
                      I'd second the problems with happening upon a Demon already found out. Unless they have another Cover to hide in, they are in deep crap already. Something similar might be that Angels suspect the Demon is in the vicinity (but don't know who it is yet), and the PCs help the Unchained escaped the Angels' (oh so polite and covert) dragnet.


                      Malkydel: "And the Machine dictated; let there be adequate illumination."
                      Yossarian: "And lo, it was optimal."

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        In the WoD Mortal game I run, for the most part Mortals are their worst enemies.


                        For different game play videos of White Wolf Games from my play group please check out
                        https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBU...IhwsM3kHK56SRA
                        If you want to find White Wolf game play media or subject matter media check out the Facebook page I create to share and post media.
                        https://www.facebook.com/groups/862703457198327/

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Vent0 View Post

                          I'd second the problems with happening upon a Demon already found out. Unless they have another Cover to hide in, they are in deep crap already. Something similar might be that Angels suspect the Demon is in the vicinity (but don't know who it is yet), and the PCs help the Unchained escaped the Angels' (oh so polite and covert) dragnet.
                          For clarification, my scenario is a problem IC for them, but quite feasible and manageable in game.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I second using simplified stats and different mechanics for monsters. Unpopular opinion: they were written with games that feature player characters as these monsters, and thus they emphasize playing a monster, not trying to hunt it or whatever Mortals do. Different purpose, different rules.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by WHW View Post
                              I second using simplified stats and different mechanics for monsters. Unpopular opinion: they were written with games that feature player characters as these monsters, and thus they emphasize playing a monster, not trying to hunt it or whatever Mortals do. Different purpose, different rules.

                              I'm starting to agree with your unpopular opinion. Crossing the game lines and trying to use all the rule is Uber confusing. I may still try and find a way to make the Mummy the main antagonist but maybe she has already been awake for too long. Her power is faded and the group can take her out with the McGuffin...


                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X