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  • #76
    Originally posted by ArcaneArts View Post
    And I'm sure if I thought about it, I could answer why a Blood Talon would join the Rosetta Society.
    All werewolves place high esteem on the importance of tales and the First Tongue, so each and every Auspice, Tribe, and Lodge has a really damn good reason to join the Rosetta Society. Ditto with all Mages and all Demons.

    Or...

    *Hears NDA ninjas land on the roof*

    Or [REDACTED]. I'll circle back to this when I can talk about it.


    Freelancer (He/His Pronouns): CofD - Dark Eras 2, Kith and Kin, Mummy 2e, Oak Ash and Thorn; Scion - Mysteries of the World

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    • #77
      What are they feeding them?


      Sean K.I.W./Kelly R.A. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Sean, Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
      The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.-Keiichi Sigsawa, Kino's Journey
      Male/neutral pronouns accepted, female pronouns enjoyed.

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      • #78
        With Vectors chapter preview we have official spread of monster groups for modern Sworn and False. As I pointed I want for the Byzantine Era groups to be partial different – but having logical connections to those – I will repost sum up of modern Sworn spreads to compare them with mine ideas for Byzantine Sworns.

        Modern Sworns from Contagion Chronicle preview:
        • Cryptocrats – Authority Vector – Typical members are: beasts, demons, mages and vampires. Joins them Winter Court, Cheiron Group, Task Force: Valkyrie, Maa-Kep, and Undertakers from Sin-Eaters.
        • Jeremiad – Frevor Vector – Typical members are: beasts, hunters, mumies and Prometheans. Joins them Integrators, Lancea et Sanctum, Long Night, Lucifuge, and Malleus Maleficarum
        • Rosetta Society – Semiotics Vector – Typical members are: mages, demons, changelings, hunters and werewolves. Joins too them Circle of the Crone, Sesha-Hebsu, Mourners from Sin-Eaters and Tammuz.
        • Ship of Theseus – Realignment Vector – Typical members are: Prometheans, demons and Sin-Eaters. Joins to them Free Council, Carthian Movement, Ordo Dracul, Iron Masters, Spring Court and Network Zero.
        • Zero Hour – Realignment Vector – Typical members are: Forsaken werewolves, hunters, Deviants – and members of Adamantine Arrow, Saboteurs, and Furies from Sin-Eaters.
        Last edited by wyrdhamster; 04-02-2019, 01:51 PM.


        My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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        • #79
          Now, let’s move back to the Western Empire CoD setting and it’s Sworns. Remember, we talk here about years 330–1453 A.D., mainly years 600-1100s in context of this Dark Era. It’s too early for Ship of Theseus Sworn to exist – and at least half of groups in it are non-existing for time being ( Free Council, Carthian Movement, Ordo Dracul and Network Zero ).

          Because of Themata administrative model, in Byzantium there is no clear distinction between military and administrative rulings – they all follow great Strategos. As this, Zero Hour predecessor is unnecessary – all administration and military related Sworn are in massive Athanatoi Sworn. It nicely connects how Legio Mortuum was just a Wing in Camarilla, what Athanatoi are direct decedents. It does lead to Athanatoi being really massive in nominal numbers ( having most of monster groups of CoD as it’s members ), but it’s also rather backstabbing in feel – all that joins them is need to sustain stability of Empire and protecting it against Contagions. Once that ensured, inner fights for domination and ‘rat race’ against factions return.

          Without Theseus existence, most of Iron Masters and Spring Court, naturally, join Athanatoi. From non-existing (yet) Zero Hour comes Adamantine Arrows, Summer Court and Furies. Yet it’s Jeremiad, after Justinian Plague, are maintain ‘moral center’ of the Sworn in Empire – Athanatoi are pointed as most of time fighting with themselves. Jeremiad have plans (connected mostly with Church ) and are more effective in enforcing them. Probably in late Empire ( probably from 12th century onward? ) from Athanatoi are spread those that will be later known as Machiavelli Gambit. Rosetta Society can easily work as it is pointed being called Omphalos – a bit weird is only usage of this world for more spiritual werewolves – but it’s perfect for Greek-based setting of Byzantium.
          Last edited by wyrdhamster; 04-02-2019, 01:50 PM.


          My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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          • #80
            Hold up. The Ship of Theseus can exist if you want them to. Hell, even if you wanna stick to the text, all you gotta do is have an earlier version of them (since the Ship of Theseus is just the current incarnation of a recurring trend across history), which is solved by giving them a cool new name. Problem solved.


            Sean K.I.W./Kelly R.A. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Sean, Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
            The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.-Keiichi Sigsawa, Kino's Journey
            Male/neutral pronouns accepted, female pronouns enjoyed.

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            • #81
              I started to listen podcast about history of Russia - In this episode is described founding of Kiev by Vikings of Askold and Dir - and their later attack on Constantinople in 860 AD. I advise to listen whole podcast, as in it's previous episodes describe history and culture of various ethnic groups that build future various Rus kingdoms - and next conflicts with Byzantium of those, in coming centuries.
              Last edited by wyrdhamster; 04-03-2019, 12:15 PM.


              My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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              • #82
                I started separate topic on sole society of Kindred in Byzantine Empire - for official stuff and fans musings. Here are my main ideas from there:

                Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
                • In VtR 2E corebook setting of Athenes ( Polis of Erabus ) is mentioning of chtonics gods vampiric priestess Despoina, Mother of Bones. She worship Echidna, mythological Mother of Monsters, so works as cult for proto-Circle of Crone in area. I would even more gladly use here, as I wanted to use some beasts crossovers – and worshipping Mother of Monsters certainly works here. 8-) So I would probably use Cult of Echidna as proto-Circle of Crone in setting, replacing Cult of Augurs, centuries before great unification. As I use Sworn from Contagion Chronicle, this cult will join probably Omphalos, predecessor to Rosetta Society, in place of CoC.
                • Athanatoi, as particular human unit idea, was created in year 970 AD. However, Themata Refrom, where Byzantium was divided between between military-administrative provinces – was done in 640s and spread as idea around Empire. By 700s it was popular model or ruling in Byzantium. By 750s there was created Tagma military units around Empire, that were de facto long arm of Emperor. I think that creation of Adamantes Athanatoi as Kindred Covenant on late 690s /early 700s is okay in that context.
                Last edited by wyrdhamster; 04-09-2019, 11:35 PM.


                My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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                • #83
                  Reading more materials from Contagion Chronicle previews and Vampire gameline, I wanted to prepare semi-final sum up how various monsters organisations are fitting the puzzle in Byzantium. We start with Plague…

                  Sworn of Justinian

                  In 6th century after Christ, first Plague hit Byzantium. It started vicious cycle of sickness and death that took tall of almost one third of Eastern Roman Empire, across next three centuries. And it bring Sworn to fight it.

                  At the rules of Emperor Justinian I, in one year, from 541 to 542 – pandemic of Plague killed 40% of population of Constantinople. What mortals did not known, was that (later called ) Black Death had also supernatural dimension. Some of those that died from illness, had return to life. And then died again. And return to life. And died again. Being locked in this miserable cycle, they still spread the disease, adding next to damned army of living dead. Numbers were not enough to call the open battlefield – but those of night-dwellers races known they need to respond or the secret of their existence will be broken. They need to eradicate this sickness.

                  Lancea Sanctum ruling Constantinople - joined by newly formed Legions of Damned from previous Legio Mortuum regiments - is trying to solve epidemic on it’s own. Sanctified need to do this, because from over century Camarilla de facto is no more – even when few in Kindred society still use it’s name. Finally, sickness pass from Rome of East – was it workings of vampires, God Machine or mages – is to this day hotly debated. Most would agree it was will of God ( or gods ).

                  Convention and Splitting

                  Sensing that Death can return to Empire, Aelia Scaevola, a Nosferatu researcher with few others children of the night started secret convention of scholars to seek ways to stop the next outbreak. They found under city ancient tomb that foretold great disaster. And those researchers spill over Empire, to look clues for the secret.

                  It was Aelia who remembered 25 years later that sigil found in tomb to come from times of Cyrus in Achaemenid Empire, twelve hundred years earlier. Mage from Cyrus times, Vishtapa, found first signs of Contagion in their country. As Scaevola was from Lance and Spear, she was versed in Scriptures – and instantly remembered the prophecy of Jeremiah about the Fall of Babylon. She spread the idea with her colleagues and soon joined by other of monsters believing that Plague of Justinian was God’s Judgment – and only faith, zeal and morality can save night-dwellers and mortals from next outbreak. They quickly infiltrated the Church and lesser cults in Empire – or rather were there from beginning - looking over ways to please the God ( and gods ). Jeremiad Sworn were created.

                  But not every researcher from convention of the tomb agreed with Aelia. Some mystics were looking inside their own mind and souls for answers. Mages and beasts that seen discovery and sigil from tomb looked a lot like Omphalos Stone inside Astral Space they visit routinely on their journeys. They focused on understanding it’s meaning and how dreams can help cure the Plague. Both rivalry Orders of Awakened, Panscryptia and Keepers of the World, agreed ( for the first time ) on importance of Sacred Stone. Joined by Despoina, the Mother of Bones, chthonian vampires priestess of Echidna from Athens, adversary of Scaevola, they started their own group. Omphalos Sworn were created.

                  Athanatoi

                  Those two Sworn groups were unchallenged by few decades, where last remnants of Camarilla were trying to rise up in Night Society, however without success. Curse of Hasdrubal hanged on everything that originated from Rome itself. Ayzebel, sister-in-law to Carthages general that Curse take it’s name – the same women that became creator of those that in modern night we call Cryptocracy – was Embraced and joined Camarilla in Eternal City and strive to end Contagion in Italy with like-minded. She felt with the Senex itself, but her disciple went to Byzantium with Constantine The Great. Chaos in the city did not let them took their roots. Until Senex was no more. Kindred needed new system of ruling – mortals in Empire gave them.

                  Themata province system was created in the mid-7th century in the aftermath of the Slavic invasion of the Balkans and Muslim conquests of parts of Byzantine territory. It overturned older Roman system the strict division of civil and military offices. With new ruling system forming on their eyes, disciples of Ayzebel went for power and to control Plague, for the good of Empire. New group stated they want to stable society and give victories with Contagion for the Byzantium. They become nation sensitive leaders monsters. At the dawn of year 700s. they called themselves Athanatoi, Immortals. New Sworn were created in Byzantium.

                  10th century, mortals elite military under this conspiracy would call themselves the same.

                  Sworn and False of Byzantine Empire
                  In brackets are names for modern counterparts of those groups. Historical factions use mechanics the same as their nowdays decendents.

                  Sworn of this Era:
                  • Jeremiad -
                    Religious and morality-centred monsters. Connected to mortal ( future ) Orthodox Church. After 6th century and it’s Plague of Justinian – most influential Sworn faction. Typical members: Lancea et Sanctum, beasts, hunters, mummies and Prometheans. Joins them Integrators, Hunters in Darkness and Lucifuge.
                  • Athanatoi (Cryptocracy) –
                    Monsters sustaining government and rules in Empire. They are remnants from original Camarilla of Rome – and future part of Invictus. Connected mostly to Themata province system. Typical members: Athanatoi Convenat ( rests of Camarilla, future Invictus ), beasts, demons, mages and vampires. Join to them Adamantine Arrow, Blood Talons, Iron Masters, Storm Lords, Winter, Spring & Summer Courts, Maa-Kep, and Undertakers from Sin-Eaters.
                  • Omphalos (Rosetta Society) –
                    Researches of sacred and secret, they name comes both title for mythological stone letting to communicate directly with gods – and Astral Space barrier that many mages and beasts find in their journeys. Typical members: mages from Keepers of the Word and Pancryptiates Orders ( in 12th century they merge into modern Mysterium, but in this Dark Eras they compete inside Sworn ), beasts, demons, changelings, hunters and werewolves. Joins too them Bone Shadows, Circle of the Crone, Mekhet vampires, Sesha-Hebsu, Mourners from Sin-Eaters and Tammuz.
                  False of this Era:

                  ·Horde (Naglfar’s Army) –
                  Literal ‘barbarians at the gates’ – and on the inside. Over centuries, Easter Roman Empire had many enemies – Huns, Khazars, Arabs, Vikings, Ottamans and many, many others. Each of this groups was coming with next war that could ‘end the world’. What was joining them was secret support of night-dwellers, wanting to tear down Empire, once and for all. However Horde was not only on the outside – but was infiltrating Night Society in the inside. From the times of Ancient Rome, at least handful of monsters were doing their own ‘Saturnalia’, preparing for the end of world. With enemies on the outside and inside – Byzantine Empire finally was no more. In 900’s Horde dogma mixed with Vikings legends of Ragnarok – and modern Naglfar’s Army was created from there.
                  Last edited by wyrdhamster; 04-10-2019, 05:50 PM.


                  My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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                  • #84
                    I create second Byzantium Contagion Outbreak - Iconclasm, Contagion of Being. It's creation is formation of 700s and onward Sworn factions. Here are early drafts of Jeremiad and Athantoi in them.

                    The Sworn

                    Sworn see Iconoclasm Contagion as possible end of their living – or at least history. They strife to not forget about their comrades and their own secrets.

                    700-900s

                    In first years of Contagion, newly founded Sworn in Byzantine Empire did not even noticed it. It fell between the cracks, as the whole alliance was looking for the signs of next Plague of Justinian outbreak in that time. Unfortunately, disease has settled within Eastern Roman Empire. From then, it was mostly crisis management and hoping to cure the patients. However, each of Sworn groups tried, from time to time, some revolutionary way for stopping the disease. After few decades they observed that because the Contagion was sourced from Iconoclasm and destruction of the visage – the way to stop it was to created many visages of the patient and then to mark the worship of image on it. To say that those practiced seemed to look heretical, even to eyes of Iconludes, was to put it mildly. And then Sworn still looked for other ways stopping this outbreak.

                    Jeremiad

                    Connected most with the Easter Church itself, the Penitents are in the centre of Iconclams Contagion.

                    Vampires

                    Lancea Sanctum is doubling down on separation of worship in Empire, leading to their members distance themselves from the center of infections. Seeing how this Contagion is striving from destruction of icons, Sanctified in Jeremiad are hoarding holy images and statues, persevering them, so the new sources of disease would not spread more. They also most ardently worship them, to undo existing infections.

                    Werewolves

                    Hunters in Darkness and Fire-Touched inside Church’s holy places are defending icons before destruction with their own claws. They know that once Contagion will set in area, they are first to get the worst of it. It also lead to unusual alliance – Hosts also do not want to be in area of this Plague. As both physical and ephemeral beings like Meninna and Izidakh – they know they are most venerable to the gruesome effects of it. Hosts separated from their species simply decomposes and die.

                    Beasts

                    Begotten in Church are trying to preach – by word and Nightmares they send – that you must see and confront what you are afraid off. And by this, images helps us prepare to life we lead. Often, it ends with unofficial, private visages of mythological horrors that haunts particular painter or sculptor – but it sustain particular beast from Contagion if she became infected.

                    Athanatoi (Cryptocracy)
                    Athanatoi, as predecessors of Cryptocracy we know now, try to fight with problem systematically. It’s their secret support in in the elites of society that lead to support Iconludes in stopping the destructions of icons. Whenever they can, Immortals try to hijack commands that leads to more damages and possible spread of Contagion. It’s Athanatoi influence on the Emperor’s Court that maybe ended Iconclams madness. Started from vampires Covenant mission to secure Empire, movement quickly spread to whole new Sworn faction.

                    Vampires

                    Themata province system was created in the mid-7th century in the aftermath of the Slavic invasion of the Balkans and Muslim conquests of parts of Byzantine territory. It overturned older Roman system the strict division of civil and military offices. With new ruling system forming on their eyes, disciples of Ayzebel from Cathage went for power and to control Plague, for the good of Empire. New group stated they want to stable society and give victories with Contagion for the Byzantium. They become nation sensitive leaders monsters. At the dawn of year 700s. they called themselves Athanatoi, Immortals. New Sworn were created in Byzantium.

                    Athanatoi Covenant of vampires is rising sect, building on the remnants of Senex that was powerful only 3 centuries earlier. They are following the Oaths of various Strategoi to Dominus Noctis Imperator ruled over a council of Prisci, the eldest members of each Kindred clan. Reconnecting old infrastructures of crumbled Senex to new conspiracy under Night Emperor, they usher new Vampiric Empire inside Easter Roman Empire, with moral support of Sanctified. Set on the idea of feudalism and securing the stability of Both Empires, after centuries of unrest in lands, many neonates are flocking to the new faction – counting also on the power and influence in coming centuries.

                    Werewolves

                    ( For the Uratha section of Athantoi, I use nikink idea for Themisine Protectorate of Pure. )
                    Originally posted by nikink View Post
                    In the late 3rd Century AD the Romulan Protectorate is stretched thin across the world, and the Magna Mater, huge, bloated and self cannibalizing, is raving mad. The Protectorate separates with the Roman Empire. This has the fortunate side-effect of quelling the Magna Mater's agony for a brief respite in the local hisil. The Eastern Protectorate is led by a more equitable arrangement of Fire-Touched and Ivory Claws, with the Poenii claiming authority over all matters spiritual, and the Claws over mortal affairs - much like in the Romulan Protectorate, but with more power and recognition granted to the Fire Touched.

                    This new Protectorate is called the Themisine Protectorate. The Fire-Touched, with authority from the gods, and their Ur-Father, and Father Wolf himself, and touched with divine fevers and insight, guide the more mortal policies enacted by the Ivory Claws. Together they act in (supposed) balance. They have no Magna Mater to appease, or contend with - packs of Uratha squabble over territory until the Protectorate is threatened by packs of 'barbarian' Forsaken. The Themisines bargain heavily with the local Predator Kings, whom they dubbed 'Naturae', in order to combat the rising Forsaken threat, and the constant threat of rogue spirits bolstered by beliefs from dozens of nations and all seeing an opportunity to become the new Protectorate's 'Mater'.

                    Over the decades the three tribes of Pure further divide the Themisine Protectorate among triadic councils - the Horae. Each council holds three Pure - one of each tribe - and each of the three councils is led by a different tribe.

                    The First Council is led by a Fire Touched in the seat of 'Xarpo', with The Ivory Claw in the seat of 'Thallo' and the Predator King in the seat of 'Auxo'.
                    The Second Council is led by an Ivory Claw in the seat of 'Eirene', with the Predator King in the seat of 'Dike' and the Fire Touched in the seat of 'Eunomia'
                    The Third Council is led by a Predator King in the Seat of 'Orthosie', witht he Fire Touched in the seat of 'Euporie' and the Ivory Claw in the seat of 'Pherusa'

                    These three councils shared authority over the Themisine Protectorate, supported by a Fourth Council of Nemeses. This council held limited authority - it was convened to lead Themesine packs to war, and membership was fluid. The Atropos seat was for the Predator King, the Clotho seat was given to the Ivory Claw, and the Lachesis seat was given to the Fire Touched. In times of great conflict multiple 'Fourth Councils' were created to cover different fronts, and only rarely was any 'Fourth' council completely filled. Most often, one tribe would fill their seat and take command of the local packs while another tribe would take command elsewhere.
                    Themisine Protectorate is looking for the stability of Empire and spirit world. Iconoclasm Contagion is clearly threaten it, so it should be eliminated. With the help of few Iron Masters joining their ranks in Athanoi, Protectorate is trying to solve spiritual sickness by edicts and commands in Themata.
                    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-01-2019, 04:14 AM.


                    My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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