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New System: Organization Rules (Cults, Conspiracies, Orders and Covenants)

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  • New System: Organization Rules (Cults, Conspiracies, Orders and Covenants)

    [Migrating old material I've created to the new forum]

    So, the Cult system in Mummy was probably one of my favorite things in the book, and I've long since used Shadow Cults from Clanbook: Mekhet in my crossover game. So I decided to make a single, unified system for organizations, a single system that can incorporate everything from a newly-formed changeling Motley to the Consilium.

    What follows is derived from the Cult rules in Mummy with a bit of Trail of Cthulhu's
    Bookhounds of London. I wrote most of it, with the able assistance and guidance of Isabella (TinkerMoth). Let me know what you think?

    Two comments. This is for my London game, and uses examples from that. And when I refer to a character's Rank, pretty much figure the Spirit 1-5+ Rank system transposed to non-Spirit supernaturals as a way of estimating power. So a 150-year old elder vampire is Rank 3, and a 2000-year old elder vampire is Rank 5.


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Every organization has a few elements associated with it:

    Rank -- This is how powerful the group is, and is a number that goes from 0 to 6+
    Attributes:
    Reach & Grasp -- These two scores represent how good the organization is at getting things done.
    Benefits -- Miscellaneous benefits that accrue to the organization's leaders/members
    Drawbacks -- The downsides or weaknesses of the organization

  • NeoTiamat
    replied
    Interesting. I looked at Primacy back when I was making the Organization Rules. It's good stuff! Just not precisely what I'm working towards here. But yes, you can dress up Organizations via Covenants, Orders, Agencies, what have you, the rules should be flexible enough for that. The whole idea was to establish a kind of common ground for understanding how these guys rank.

    I may glance at Princess, for all that I am a trifle afraid.

    Leave a comment:


  • Michael Brazier
    replied
    If you're interested, the Princess fansplat has a set of organization rules that's basically a mashup of GMC's social maneuvering and Primacy (for which, ahem, I am responsible.)

    Leave a comment:


  • FallenEco
    replied
    I thought so, but it is always a good idea to get a second, more seasoned opinion.

    As for what we were focused on...I was somewhat distracted by my shiny metal flower so I haven't had time to go over your updates. On the plus side, the Agency 'rules' basically add 'fluff' meat to your mechanical 'bones'.

    Edit: Though it might be better to call the suggestions about Agencies frameworks, rather than rules.
    Last edited by FallenEco; 07-01-2014, 04:37 AM. Reason: Afterthought

    Leave a comment:


  • NeoTiamat
    replied
    Let's see... Geist Krewes...

    <> Tiers and Ranks
    A Cult is a Rank 1-2 Organization
    A Faction is a Rank 3-4 Organization
    A Conspiracy is a Rank 5 Organization. Given Geist's somewhat more open nature, I could see a really large and united Conspiracy as being Rank 6, though it would need a high degree of organization and centralization. On the other hand, I could also see a Conspiracy being run as a set of allied Rank 3-4 Organizations (ultimately, it depends on how independent the branches are)

    <> The Experience system and the Founding System are a bit extraneous, though still not a bad idea to do them from a roleplaying aspect. (Figure out Bans, Duties, etc).

    <> Most of the basic benefits of the Krewe system, such as the Avatars and Supernatural Merits, can be converted over relatively easy. Call them a Proprietary Magic (in this case, one bought via Merits), or else convert some of them into Organization Benefits or Drawbacks. The Temporal Merits (Pooled Merits, Enhanced Merits, Merit Mastery) I'd remove, as their effect is broadly simulated with Reach, Grasp, and so forth.

    Overall, doesn't look too hard to make a Krewe fit in with the Organization System. Just need to sand away at the edges some.

    Leave a comment:


  • Griautis
    replied
    Alright, seems like that's a great weakness for London's OD And that whole set up sounds cool

    Leave a comment:


  • NeoTiamat
    replied
    Not what I expected people to comment on. Well then!

    First, for the record, this is just how the OD in my London campaign is organized, and not terribly representative of how the OD in general operates, and certainly not representative of how the Dragons in someone else's game would be run.

    Second, the disorganization is not really too related to the size, except insofar as that the Ordo Dracul in the Covenant books had a fairly distributed system of governance which would require a high population to staff fully. The London specifics has more to do with the fact that the person with the most ostensible authority, the Kogaion, is also a character that rather emphatically dumped Social stats (Physical power-house? Yes. Educated scholar? Yes. Seven Coils? Yes. Persuasion of 0? Also yes.) The situation is further complicated by the fact that the relative weakness of the London Ordo Dracul (it's easily the smallest and weakest Covenant) means that it tends to attract more 'insane mad scientists' and less 'canny politicians'. The lone Sworn of the Mysteries in the covenant tries to keep things semi-organized, but it's an uphill struggle with a great deal of cat-herding involved.

    (And truthfully, I figured it's a fun counterpoint to some of the more cohesive factions running around my campaign, especially as the OD are the only vampire faction with PCs in it)

    Leave a comment:


  • FallenEco
    replied
    7 Sworn doesn't mean 7 people. It would be more accurate to say that it means that there are 7 people on the board of directors or in the noble family.

    Except depending on which oath, this can mean 2 Commanders in Chief, 3 Supreme Justices and a legislative body of 2. Still with 20-30 underlings. Plenty of room for the Oreder to be disorganized.

    Leave a comment:


  • Griautis
    replied
    Originally posted by NeoTiamat View Post
    The Ordo Dracul![/FONT][/COLOR]
    Rank: 3rd
    Reach 5; Grasp 4
    Benefits: Scholarly; Proprietary Magic (The Coils of the Dragon)
    Drawbacks[COLOR=#000000][FONT=tahoma]: Disorganized

    Smaller in my game, but they have access to enormous libraries, and of course, the Coils of the Dragon. On the downside, due to the small size, there's only about seven Sworn total, which means that the leadership structures are a bit chaotic.

    As far as my experience says smaller size means better organisation. Among 7 people, one person can effectively organise them... One cannot effectively organise a group of 50. Of course, leadership in such a group probably comes down to 1-2 people tops, but it's much easier to navigate the organisation due to it's small size

    Leave a comment:


  • NeoTiamat
    replied
    So! Updated the system to reflect the rules I am using at present -- still room to tinker (I'm particularly trying to come up with new, good Drawbacks).

    Now for some sample organizations:

    The Invictus!
    Rank: 5th
    Reach 8; Grasp 8
    Benefits: Pull; Well-Paid; Wealthy
    Drawbacks: Treacherous, Stupid, or Both?; The Madness of the Crowds

    Basically, they have lots and lots and LOTS of money, and a great deal of influence should they choose to use it. Members also get to trade on their cachet as members of the local mini-Illuminati. The catch? It's a whole society of Patrick Batemans.

    The Ordo Dracul!

    Rank: 3rd
    Reach 5; Grasp 4
    Benefits: Scholarly; Proprietary Magic (The Coils of the Dragon)
    Drawbacks: Disorganized

    Smaller in my game, but they have access to enormous libraries, and of course, the Coils of the Dragon. On the downside, due to the small size, there's only about seven Sworn total, which means that the leadership structures are a bit chaotic.

    The Temple Guard!

    Rank: 2nd
    Reach 2; Grasp 4
    Totem: Shadow Cipher (Rank 2: Investigation +2, Occult +1)
    Benefits: Influence (Criminal); Where the Bodies are Buried
    Drawbacks: Parochial

    A pack of werewolf information brokers, with links to the criminal underworld and a lot of secrets, but which fades very rapidly outside of London.

    Leave a comment:


  • NeoTiamat
    replied
    I've actually streamlined the system in recent months, so I should put up the newer version. And then I can put up a few sample organizations, certainly.

    I'll also take a look-see at the Krewe material, yes.

    Leave a comment:


  • amechra
    replied
    I definitely would like to see an example organization. Otherwise, I like this quite a lot.

    Leave a comment:


  • FallenEco
    replied
    While not the best written subsystem, Geist's krew mechanics fit the same sort of conceptual space. I don't suppose you'd give them a once over and demonstrate how to model them in your system?

    Leave a comment:


  • NeoTiamat
    replied
    That seems reasonable enough for me. Or I might simply have it be a contested roll between whichever of Reach+Rank and Grasp+Rank seems most relevant, assuming there isn't a handy PC to involve in the investigation.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paddon
    replied
    I'd also be interested in your take on one organization investigating another. I would presume it would be contested via Blocking, with successes leading to learning more about the infrastructure, Reach, Grasp, or Benefits? At least, failing should give *some* information, namely how did they shut the investigation down.

    Leave a comment:

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