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Deviant: the Renegades

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  • Originally posted by Master Aquatosic View Post
    However, I wonder how their broken souls interact with Urging Ephemerals.
    "Ew, bloody hell, I'm not touching that."

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    • So it’s like how some animals won’t go near they know is sick

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      • Originally posted by SunlessNick View Post
        "Ew, bloody hell, I'm not touching that."
        Ok, but what about spirits of decay, instability, rot, disease, insanity, etc

        Also, is it that they don't want to do it or that they can't? If the former, what happens if they Fetter themselves to a Deviant out of a desperate need to hide -right now- ?


        A god is just a monster you kneel to. - ArcaneArts, Quoting "Fall of Gods"

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        • Decay and similar spirits would work, but really, for a soul to just be broken must scary for a spirit.

          It should be noted deviants are so filled with hate, things such as mind control have a hard time affecting them, so perhaps possessing a deviant would have the spirit thinking "oh shit"

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          • Originally posted by Master Aquatosic View Post
            I don't think any parts are missing per se. Its all there but its just broken.
            Specifically, they lack a sense of self-identity, of internal independence. They define themselves in relation to other people.


            Scion 2E: What We Know - A wiki compiling info on second edition Scion.

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            • I'm actually kinda confused by that. At the same time as I'm seeing it said that they have no internal self-image, I'm also seeing Dave Brookshaw say that they only relate to other people on a very basic level of friends, enemies and "not important". I don't understand how those interact to create a creature that is close enough to human in thought to be a playable template. Frankly, I'm not sure how that first part even works.

              EDIT: I'm hoping their "friends, enemies, background scenery" mental paradigm is not as immutable as I'm reading. I wouldn't want to play more than a couple sessions of a game where every character has to have a total extreme "screw you, got mine" attitude. I mean, how can you make a doctor who still wants to help people but is on the run from an unscrupulous pharmaceutical company that wants to turn his experiments to long-term profitable palliative therapies? Does the trauma make him lose his higher motivations? Can you put something as wide as "sick people" in the friends category?
              Last edited by Master Aquatosic; 10-19-2018, 09:19 PM.


              A god is just a monster you kneel to. - ArcaneArts, Quoting "Fall of Gods"

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              • Originally posted by Master Aquatosic View Post
                I wouldn't want to play more than a couple sessions of a game where every character has to have a total extreme "screw you, got mine" attitude.
                That's reading a bit more into 'friends' and 'enemies' than I think was implied. It doesn't imply a mercenary mindset, it implies a survivor's mindset. Someone who has pressure on them and can't go around being free with trust.

                I mean, how can you make a doctor who still wants to help people but is on the run from an unscrupulous pharmaceutical company that wants to turn his experiments to long-term profitable palliative therapies? Does the trauma make him lose his higher motivations? Can you put something as wide as "sick people" in the friends category?
                This is something that's shown up in media. I'm pretty sure it, again, has been in the Incredible Hulk (among many, many other places), where David Banner was a doctor, and even though not a medical doctor, had similar training. Someone is injured (often a child) or about to give birth, and the Deviant wants to go, they need to go, but they do feel an urge to help. So they do, and it's a setback, the baddies chasing him catch up, their chance to get out of there is missed. But in the end, the person they helped in turn helps them, helping them get away or distracting the baddies, and everyone learns something.

                Even people who aren't doctors. Angie Spica, in the Wild Storm, for instance developed nanomachines to help people in emergency situations and in general, but is being hindered by the organization that, basically, just wants her to make devices to control humanity. She tests it on herself, wildly against the rules, and when she sees a man being thrown from a 20+ story building she can't help but activate them and go save him, even if it means she's going to lose her job, be hunted by her former employers, and likely be vivisected if she's ever caught.

                But of course you do have people who are entirely willing to let others die in front of them because they find it too bothersome to deal with them or they don't like blood or whatever. Not everyone's made out to do that. I don't think any game so far has restricted actions on that front. Vampires can be generous, werewolves can be pacifistic, mages can be ignorant, prometheans can choose not to try to be better, hunters can try to give up the vigil, changelings can return to arcadia, sin-eaters can disagree with their geist, beasts can choose not to be scary all the time, demons can go loud.
                Last edited by nofather; 10-19-2018, 09:48 PM.

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                • It is a very common trope in fugitive stories, which is why I was worried that this mindset where it sounds to me like most people who haven't had any personal interaction with you are background scenery would make characters like that hard to play.

                  Yeah, a normal human fugitive with an intact Integrity track might do that because of their Virtue, I worry that, as someone who tries to play characters the way the mechanics seem to be driving their story, won't have any willpower-based incentive to help out strangers unless a friend asks them too.

                  I'm struggling for words here, but what I'm trying to get at is that the way the mechanics and the fluff (that we know of) sounds to me, Deviants just don't have the internal drive to help out strangers

                  I probably am over thinking it, so could you explain some more where you think my misconceptions are coming from, it would be much appreciated


                  A god is just a monster you kneel to. - ArcaneArts, Quoting "Fall of Gods"

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                  • Originally posted by Master Aquatosic View Post
                    I probably am over thinking it, so could you explain some more where you think my misconceptions are coming from, it would be much appreciated
                    I did expand on it (i'm big on editing my posts and I looked through a comic I'm reading at the moment to find an example), but really I'm a bigger proponent of waiting for the book. I love getting spoilers, but I think the book will go into it more than a post would.

                    That said, without knowing anything about the mechanics, a doctor character might have an aspiration to help someone in need. And presumably there will be a reward for doing something that helps you, but hinders your ability to get away from whoever's coming after you. I think something like that has been confirmed.
                    Last edited by nofather; 10-19-2018, 09:57 PM.

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                    • I parsed the "friends and enemies" comment through the lens of Borderline Personality Disorder, personally. Though obviously it's touchy comparing a real-life disorder to a fantasy monster, BPD is defined as "...marked by an ongoing pattern of varying moods, self-image, and behavior" and "a pattern of intense and unstable relationships ... often swinging from extreme closeness and love (idealization) to extreme dislike or anger (devaluation)." (Source)

                      So when a Deviant likes you, they really LIKE you, and may develop very strong feelings about you very quickly (even if it's mostly projecting their own stuff onto you, like the need to be A Good Person or because you remind them of someone they lost). But they're also always on high alert for any possible sign of danger, no matter how slight or ambiguous, and pre-emptively lash out or withdraw from anyone who pings their danger sense, even (maybe especially) if it's the same person they were obsessed with two days ago.

                      Not so much "Anyone I don't feel strongly about is just scenery" as "I feel strongly about anyone that's not mere scenery." But we'll see if the corebook bears this version out.

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                      • In terms of identity, think the punisher. Sure he has his own personality and way of doing things, but ultimately, unbridled, pure hate drives his living. Similarly he has a hard time trusting people, just like a renegade

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                        • Ah, sorry Nofather. Didn't catch the edit


                          A god is just a monster you kneel to. - ArcaneArts, Quoting "Fall of Gods"

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                          • http://theonyxpath.com/halloween-bon...comment-466517


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                            • Now that is some great news to hear. Origins actually seem pretty dang useful now that they are explained, and the volunteers can make for some tragic AND utterly selfish monsters.

                              As for overt and covert, I'm geussing overt shows yours obvious deformities and can increase scars easier, while covert is weaker but hides yourself better and makes it harder to get a scar

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                              • Yeah but I'm having trouble figuring out why mentality determines that


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