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  • blackhatmatt
    started a topic Beast Storyteller's Guide

    Beast Storyteller's Guide

    So, let's say that the next book I was going to outline was the Beast STG. What sorts of things would you find useful in such a book?

  • Primordial newcomer
    replied
    Originally posted by Heavy Arms View Post
    You don't need sandbox play to get in crossover.

    There's a reason the whole Apex concept exists, and why it can explicitly be something else besides one of the Begotten.

    The ST can just set up the game where there's an active power-struggle between different factions in another supernatural group both including potential Apexes for the area. This immediately impacts any Beasts that live there (so instant call to action rather than waiting for the PCs to decide to explore that part of the sandbox), and easily sets up a story around Kinship, politics, and helping determine the Primordial landscape of the area.
    I didnt say it needed to be a sandbox for crossover. I stated that it is a game that works best through sandbox play than the other gamelines (though, I did originally say you NEED a group who is good with sandbox style play to play a beast only game, which is not true)

    Leave a comment:


  • ArcaneArts
    replied
    True Facts, Beast is basically the Chronicles version of Golden Sky Stories.

    Leave a comment:


  • Heavy Arms
    replied
    You don't need sandbox play to get in crossover.

    There's a reason the whole Apex concept exists, and why it can explicitly be something else besides one of the Begotten.

    The ST can just set up the game where there's an active power-struggle between different factions in another supernatural group both including potential Apexes for the area. This immediately impacts any Beasts that live there (so instant call to action rather than waiting for the PCs to decide to explore that part of the sandbox), and easily sets up a story around Kinship, politics, and helping determine the Primordial landscape of the area.

    Leave a comment:


  • Primordial newcomer
    replied
    I've always found this to be a complaint common to this game (I myself have this opinion)

    beast works really well in both emphasizing
    and contrasting themes of other gamelines when in crossover. by itself it does not have much to do unless you are very good at sandbox play. personally I hope a storytellers guide is made to address this issue

    EDIT: I should add, beast also are very capable of bringing cokpletely new themes to games through crossover too
    Last edited by Primordial newcomer; Yesterday, 09:52 AM.

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  • Sith_Happens
    replied
    Originally posted by milo v3 View Post
    I still feel like Beasts don't really have many things to do aside from "Feed" and "Fight Heroes". They added "Make a cult" to the list, but cults are a thing common to a decent number of gamelines to begin with.
    After pondering long and hard on this question a while back, I eventually came to the conclusion that Beast is secretly a really weird slice-of-life game.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paradim
    replied
    Originally posted by lnodiv View Post
    It's much more generous than that - every dot of Lair above 5 adds 50 years to their lifespan.

    That is really generous! Lot of time there to help build yourself into the immortality of the Beast Incarnate, if that's what someone wants, I suppose.

    Leave a comment:


  • lnodiv
    replied
    Originally posted by Paradim View Post
    Regarding the mortality of Beasts, I think they gain an extra decade to their Lifespan for each Lair dot above 5, extending their life span.
    It's much more generous than that - every dot of Lair above 5 adds 50 years to their lifespan.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paradim
    replied
    Regarding the mortality of Beasts, I think they gain an extra decade to their Lifespan for each Lair dot above 5, extending their life span. And I think some of their Inheritances make them Immortal to time.

    Leave a comment:


  • Heavy Arms
    replied
    On the matter of longevity: While the book isn't entirely clear if a Beast can live up to 250 years, age of Devouring + 250 years, or natural lifespan + 250 years.... that's still plenty of time for the vast majority of stories that want to have a Beast operating over time. I really can't see why we'd need significantly older ones. Vampire and Mummy do that for different but important thematic reasons. And since we already have Kinship Merits as a thing... what more needs to be said than "form Kinship with something with an indefinite lifespan, and life even longer, though possibly through periods of long hibernation."

    Leave a comment:


  • Primordial newcomer
    replied
    Originally posted by ArcaneArts View Post
    Probably not so hard? If I were going to really dive into that, I'd want to pitch an Antagonist Book in the vein of Autumn Nightmares, Pandora's Book, Predators, Book of the Deceived, and so on. I don't think we could ignore some of the societies in the discussions about Beasts and the storytelling for them, particularly covering lightly the antagonists, and I would hope to at least create one or two new models for societies, but the Beast Chapter would be more akin to the Demon chapter in the DSG, and likewise I would want to focus the crossover chapter more on how to help tell stories with the characters and societies of the protagonists.

    NO, outside of the DSG, what I would probably most want are a non-Night Horrors Antagonist Book and a Location Book where it makes more sense to also rally dig into Cults and Cultures for Beasts. For the DSG, the goal is less "here's the opposition" or "here's something more variable" so much as "here's something that will make the ST's job easier, that makes it clearer and easier to see what to do."

    Also a Chronicler's Guide, because Mirrors-style supplements are always awesome.

    *I want it as a hard rule that the Dark Mother is almost always on the side of her Children, and player character Beasts in particular, so she's never an out and out antagonist unless U Dun Fuked Up, but it's worth exploring how the "difference between hugging and devouring is minimal" from the not supportive angle of the argument.
    thanks for clarifying. from every thread that has you talking about beasts, I sincerely hope you are able to be a writer for a beast storytellers guide

    Leave a comment:


  • ArcaneArts
    replied
    Probably not so hard? If I were going to really dive into that, I'd want to pitch an Antagonist Book in the vein of Autumn Nightmares, Pandora's Book, Predators, Book of the Deceived, and so on. I don't think we could ignore some of the societies in the discussions about Beasts and the storytelling for them, particularly covering lightly the antagonists, and I would hope to at least create one or two new models for societies, but the Beast Chapter would be more akin to the Demon chapter in the DSG, and likewise I would want to focus the crossover chapter more on how to help tell stories with the characters and societies of the protagonists.

    NO, outside of the DSG, what I would probably most want are a non-Night Horrors Antagonist Book and a Location Book where it makes more sense to also really dig into Cults and Cultures for Beasts. For the DSG, the goal is less "here's the opposition" or "here's something more variable" so much as "here's something that will make the ST's job easier, that makes it clearer and easier to see what to do."

    Also a Chronicler's Guide, because Mirrors-style supplements are always awesome.

    *I want it as a hard rule that the Dark Mother is almost always on the side of her Children, and player character Beasts in particular, so she's never an out and out antagonist unless U Dun Fuked Up, but it's worth exploring how the "difference between hugging and devouring is minimal" from the not supportive angle of the argument.
    Last edited by ArcaneArts; 04-21-2019, 04:39 PM.

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  • Primordial newcomer
    replied
    ArcaneArts, would you also like to look into the societies beasts have such as the empusae? would you address kinship with creatures such as strix? finally, and this sounds more like a players guide thing to be honest, would explore how Life intertwines with Legend and vice versa for beast and horror

    Leave a comment:


  • ArcaneArts
    replied
    Originally posted by Possessed View Post
    If you do get to write for it, and even if you don’t, here are what I’d like to have added to your points.

    1) Some good discussion on those Beasts who do not believe in the lesson culture and how not teaching lessons does not equal acting foolishly on you hunger.

    2) some discussion on the possibility of not having Heroes be a thing at all. With other Begotten, the Unsatiable the other supernaturals and their Antagonists and the actual Hunters we really do not actually need Heroes as extra Antagonists. Explore the themes of vulnerability that the Heroes bring to a Beast game and how it would affect things to not have them. More options are always for the better after all.

    3) Don’t have anything of note to add here.

    4) Sounds good.

    5) Again sounds good to me but perhaps some discussion on why Beasts are mortal beings with rather limited life expectansies despite their Mythic forbears having either extreme life expectansies or even being immortal or close to it. It os a rare story that has a Dragon dying of old age and they are often easily hundreds of years old, similarly Kraken is either an immortal or just so long loved it doesn’t matter. Etc. Exploration of why is mortality important to themes of Beast the Primordial and how it would affect the game to have the Begotten be immortal, which would also help with crossovers as Vampire game may strecth for centuries and it would be inconvinient for the Beast player switching characters at every time skip.

    6) Sounds good to me.
    Yeah. I've got some issues here.

    1a) I'm really just past the point of giving a shit about non-lesson culture. Either teach or don't, decide to be meaningful or meaningless. Honestly, I still feel like enough hasn't been done with lesson culture and if I were going to seriously address that particular cornerstone of the Eldest family, I would actually build into more distinctive lesson cultures than not.

    1b) Also, books have limited space and I'd rather use that space to make what we have work even better than trying to present options. Maybe if Beast did well enough to justify a Cults and Cultures book of Beasts, that'd be a book where I'd go and explore more of "Well what the fuck do we do" and various ways the Begotten answer what to do with their Hunger, but honestly, Lessons cover that fine in concept and just need to be looked at with more care and sincerity.

    1c) Also, while not teaching lessons does not neccesarily equal acting foolishly, as I have pointed out in other threads, Lessons are a hell of a solid means of managing your Hunger as well as building your Lair and will reliably do so more than not teaching a lesson, and I would definitely not ignore that, again mattering for space. Honestly, a sentence akin to yours is all I need to make the point you made.

    2) Nope. Heroes matter. They are a critical part of the dialogue at the heart of Beast the Primordial. I would make their role as cart upsetter clearer and the hows and whys of that starker. Sure, you might not need them for every game or chronicle of Beast any more than every game of Werewolf needs an idigam, but Heroes need to have their shadows across the dialogue-even when not present, their horror lingers like the shadows of True Fae for Beasts.

    3) Yep.

    4) Yep.

    5) I personally do not give a shit about the mortality of Beasts, nor can I reasonably find a reason that matters to the story set Beast is bringing to the table to waste time and words on mortality or immortality. There's a definite niche in there, but honestly that sounds more like an STV niche. Not everyone needs to live forever, and honestly the reincarnating Horror is a cooler angle for exploring Beast's more cyclical themes than blunt immortality (Stories gain their power through their retelling and reinvention, not their omnipresence), but even that doesn't warrant a whole lot of discussion compared to the meat and potatoes we've got on the table.

    6) Yep.

    With a context of "Beast Storyteller's Guide" I'm more interested in providing the tools a storyteller needs to make a good game of Beast as it is rather than strain the word count and my stress by doing "But what if we want a game that does things that Beast doesn't do?" at this point.

    Leave a comment:


  • Possessed
    replied
    If you do get to write for it, and even if you don’t, here are what I’d like to have added to your points.

    1) Some good discussion on those Beasts who do not believe in the lesson culture and how not teaching lessons does not equal acting foolishly on you hunger.

    2) some discussion on the possibility of not having Heroes be a thing at all. With other Begotten, the Unsatiable the other supernaturals and their Antagonists and the actual Hunters we really do not actually need Heroes as extra Antagonists. Explore the themes of vulnerability that the Heroes bring to a Beast game and how it would affect things to not have them. More options are always for the better after all.

    3) Don’t have anything of note to add here.

    4) Sounds good.

    5) Again sounds good to me but perhaps some discussion on why Beasts are mortal beings with rather limited life expectansies despite their Mythic forbears having either extreme life expectansies or even being immortal or close to it. It os a rare story that has a Dragon dying of old age and they are often easily hundreds of years old, similarly Kraken is either an immortal or just so long loved it doesn’t matter. Etc. Exploration of why is mortality important to themes of Beast the Primordial and how it would affect the game to have the Begotten be immortal, which would also help with crossovers as Vampire game may strecth for centuries and it would be inconvinient for the Beast player switching characters at every time skip.

    6) Sounds good to me.

    Leave a comment:

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