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Why I Really Miss The Homecoming.

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Konradleijon View Post
    I still hate the devouring it feels wrong , do you know that in W:TO The Process of a Shadow Taking over the Psych is called Devouring.
    two different gamelines, two different worlds of darkness, and different meanings of "Devouring". not be rude, but this proves nothing

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    • #62
      Originally posted by Konradleijon View Post
      I still hate the devouring it feels wrong , do you know that in W:TO The Process of a Shadow Taking over the Psych is called Devouring.
      And in Vampire the Masquerade Beast was the term given to the mindless berserk feeding frenzy kindred risked entering if their humanity got too low (though one of my freinds told me Gangrel tended to live there in his experience) while driven by hunger the Beghotten are hardly mindless and certainly have little to do with monster in one of the Kindred's head.

      Heck the Unchained make Soul Pacts all the time and that doesn't get any closer to claiming a person's soul then you would through normal murder. For added bonus there is a conversion guide because Demons are not Demons by default in Chronicles of Darkness. Not to mention there is a rather large amount of discussion on various threads about what the different levels of the Primordial Dream are refered to in CoD Mage, so not like terminology is an exclusive thing even in the same setting let alone Like Primordial Newcomer says, its not a good argument.

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      • #63
        I would like to add further that, as nalak42 said, Demons make SOUL PACTS. demons will take advantage of you being in a horrible state of life, making you sign a deal that will take away your very existence. Yet this is not "morally black" like beast scaring people to feed like they need to. In fact, soul pacts seem to be treated as morally superior to what beasts do DESPITE being an optional choice to make

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        • #64
          Originally posted by Primordial newcomer View Post
          I would like to add further that, as nalak42 said, Demons make SOUL PACTS. demons will take advantage of you being in a horrible state of life, making you sign a deal that will take away your very existence. Yet this is not "morally black" like beast scaring people to feed like they need to. In fact, soul pacts seem to be treated as morally superior to what beasts do DESPITE being an optional choice to make
          In DtD Soul Pacts result in the utter destruction - not simply death - of the human signee. I am not sure that any other splat goes so far in damaging their mortal victims. Demons are not and never were human and do not (for the most part) aspire to be human, AFAIK. I find the game to be different in an interesting way.

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          • #65
            Originally posted by Konradleijon View Post
            I still hate the devouring it feels wrong , do you know that in W:TO The Process of a Shadow Taking over the Psych is called Devouring.
            Okay, much like before, I can neither help you like or dislike a thing, nor can I particularly help with how your brain plays word association. For me, the word Devouring covers everything from self-ascendance to that thing I keep saying I'm going to do to my roommate's Havanese mop-dog. As others have pointed out, words get used a lot of different ways. As always, about all I can do is explain why it works and why I like it.

            On why it works...being blunt, it's just more in tone for Beast than Homecoming. I mean, I get it, I know why a lot of people liked the power in the word, but in a game of modern supernatural horror paired up with epic mythology and fantasy couched in brutal, primordial, basic imagery and language, Homecoming (and a lot of other word choices honestly in the first draft) stick out like a sore thumb. It kept the piece from feeling cohesive, whole-which is already a problem considering how very piece meal Beast was in tone, language, attitude, etc. It's like if Star Trek always referred to their phasers as "shooter things", or if a Changeling suddenly cast a Quantum Computation. Hell, referencing Demon actually puts a point there, because a lot of the initial backlash to that game did revolve around the fact that people couldn't reconcile their concepts of religious/mystical demons with the quantum clockwork language used to define their heavens and hells (how those concepts actually always worked better than was argued against is a subject for another day). In terms of keeping the game together and getting it to tell and feel like the story it was going to try and tell, something else had to come in. Problem is that there's not a lot of mythic-but-grounded-in-our-common-parlance that conveys what all that was happening when a Beast transcends their old mortality. Ah, but the literal act of change, the final threshold that one crosses-that has it's own power.

            I need to blur the lines here, because where my feelings on Lessons are divorced from their functionality, the reasons why I like Devouring over Homecoming are also very in line with why that word was what won the day.

            First off, it's practical. That's what happens. You have Devoured yourself-but, no, it's more than that. You have found the larger, wholer, more complete sum of self that you are, and it has confronted everything that confined you before. You have found yourself bigger, stronger, greater, fuller than your fears, your faults, your anxieties, your isolations, and you hereby assert this power over yourself and who you were by eating it. It's one part acceptance, swallowing those limitations, coming to terms with them, allowing them to nourish your future self, and one part defiance, conquest, ascendance, by consuming your weaknesses and not being poisoned by them, to gnash them between your teeth and know they've not the power to stop you. The snake has devoured it's tail and has, in so doing, proven itself to be the god it was always meant to be. How can one not come home when one has so readily come to one's self, and left everything confining behind them?

            And for me, that really struck a chord. Not only is it mythic and psychological and carnal-it's really just how I think of my own growth. I didn't quite realize how much I applied teeth to past versions of myself until Beast, but I had always seen growing up into a better person as a means of consuming the person I am and was. There is always a bigger fish for Sean, and that fish is the wholer, healthier, more true "I". I can always be bigger than the small thing I was, I can always swallow my fears. I can so thoroughly own myself that I can feast on myself and come out stronger and wiser for it. It's actualization and transcendence.

            And it won't be for everyone, but I think between the existing background tone the Beast honed in on and the way it's described, it got across the sense that the Devouring is meant to be act of realization- that for the Beast?

            They're okay. This is who they are. That the person who was miserable and alone and confused about what was going on with them, that person is gone, fed to the person they are now. The person who has got themselves, who knows who they are? They're standing here now, with teeth lovely and sharp, tongue wet and red, and eyes sharp and knowing. That those who Devour themselves? Have got this.

            Anyways, that's me. It's not like I don't get the appeal of homecoming, of coming to a place where you are accepted regardless, but eh, it's not as....powerful to me. I want to know I'm okay, I want to know that I accepted me, that I surrendered to my whole self, than stress over other people making a place for me. "Which way I fly is home; myself am home," to misquote Milton.

            ------------------------------------------------

            Now with that out of the way, we're also at the point of the conversation where I need to ask some questions, because the continued angle of attack to this thread is uncomfortably reminding me other people I'd rather not think about, and so it's time we get to the point:

            What, exactly, did you think was going to happen with this thread? What were you hoping for, how did it look going forward from the first post forward?

            Because as is, we know it bothers you and hurts you, and we have offered our sympathies, our understandings, and our explanations, and you still seem to want more.

            Soooooo what are you looking for?
            Last edited by ArcaneArts; 04-10-2019, 09:30 PM.


            Sean K.I.W./Kelly R.A. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Sean, Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
            The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.-Keiichi Sigsawa, Kino's Journey
            Male/neutral pronouns accepted, female pronouns enjoyed.

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