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  • A Huntsman's heart resides within a mortal Bastion.
    A Bastion exists only for the span of a single dream. When the dreamer awakes, the Bastion crumbles and disappears.
    When the heart is destroyed, the Huntsman is no more and its animating Title goes back to its Keeper whence it came.

    Does that mean that a Huntsman only exists for the span of a single dream?

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    • Originally posted by moonwhisper View Post
      A Huntsman's heart resides within a mortal Bastion.
      A Bastion exists only for the span of a single dream. When the dreamer awakes, the Bastion crumbles and disappears.
      When the heart is destroyed, the Huntsman is no more and its animating Title goes back to its Keeper whence it came.

      Does that mean that a Huntsman only exists for the span of a single dream?
      No, for much the same reason that the rules for adding Empathy to kenning rolls to see if a character's Bastion has been dreamwoven within a week aren't unusable.

      The Huntsman's heart may be inaccessible during that time (barring tricky uses of things like the Oathbreaker's Punishment Contract), but being in a Bastion as it crumbles doesn't destroy it, particularly not when navigating a Bastion to find it already indicates it's treated more like a native of the place.


      Resident Lore-Hound
      Currently Consuming: Hunter: the Vigil 1e

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      • Originally posted by moonwhisper View Post
        A Huntsman's heart resides within a mortal Bastion.
        A Bastion exists only for the span of a single dream. When the dreamer awakes, the Bastion crumbles and disappears.
        When the heart is destroyed, the Huntsman is no more and its animating Title goes back to its Keeper whence it came.

        Does that mean that a Huntsman only exists for the span of a single dream?
        There's some obvious problems with the hearts/bastions, but I'd resolve them by saying that the heart resides in the subconcious of the human, which becomes accessible when they dream through the Bastion, or something like that.

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        • when I get a new Touchstone, do I attach it to the Clarity Box on the left or on the right of my existing attached Touchstone?

          also, I'm biased as the thread creator, but why isn't this pinned yet?


          A god is just a monster you kneel to. - ArcaneArts, Quoting "Fall of Gods"

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          • As it says under the Touchstone Merit:
            Write each one beside the next available box to the right of the rightmost box with an associated Touchstone. If the last Clarity box already has a Touchstone, you cannot purchase this Merit again.

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            • So did the Muse Kith in Dark Eras 2 just get designed the wrong way, not getting a exceptional succes on 3 dices for a roll? Every other kith has that specific mechanics and it just seems odd to me.

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              • Originally posted by Vintervalpen View Post
                So did the Muse Kith in Dark Eras 2 just get designed the wrong way, not getting a exceptional succes on 3 dices for a roll? Every other kith has that specific mechanics and it just seems odd to me.

                there was a period between editions where the development team had a shake up and a new leadership team took over 2e. during this inbetween period, some early rules from the previous developer's edition (we'll call it 1.5) made it to some pdf-only releases. a lot of the previous developer's work didn't make it into the final second edition of the game.

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                • Originally posted by Firefly Night View Post
                  there was a period between editions where the development team had a shake up and a new leadership team took over 2e. during this inbetween period, some early rules from the previous developer's edition (we'll call it 1.5) made it to some pdf-only releases. a lot of the previous developer's work didn't make it into the final second edition of the game.
                  I'm pretty sure the entirety of Dark Eras 2 was written after 1.5e was scrapped.


                  Bloodline: The Stygians
                  Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
                  Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

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                  • Is it reasonable to read the "per milestone desired" modifier for Hedge navigation as navigating to a trod from elsewhere in the Hedge, i.e. more powerful trods take longer to reach/find?


                    Resident Lore-Hound
                    Currently Consuming: Hunter: the Vigil 1e

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                    • Originally posted by Satchel View Post
                      Is it reasonable to read the "per milestone desired" modifier for Hedge navigation as navigating to a trod from elsewhere in the Hedge, i.e. more powerful trods take longer to reach/find?
                      I'm pretty sure it's for the number of milestones you wish to pass when travelling on a trod. The further you go, the more difficult it's going to be (provided you're already under pressure from something that makes you roll when on a trod).
                      If you're asking if you can also apply that modifier that way, then that could make sense depending on how you interpret the Hedge. A more powerful trod is more static and concrete in a realm that is remarkable for how psychoactive and abstract it often is. That means, wherever you are in the Hedge, a finding a trod means you need to go from a highly mutable location to a highly static location, and it makes sense that a more static location is "further away" than a less static location.
                      Edit: Actually, the dot rating of the trod would make more sense than just number of milestones.
                      Last edited by Tessie; 11-18-2020, 04:24 PM.


                      Bloodline: The Stygians
                      Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
                      Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

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                      • Originally posted by Tessie View Post
                        I'm pretty sure it's for the number of milestones you wish to pass when travelling on a trod. The further you go, the more difficult it's going to be (provided you're already under pressure from something that makes you roll when on a trod).
                        It's the "desired" that's tripping me up on assuming that reading — if it was milestones between you and your destination, it'd be "intervening milestones" or a similar phrase, and if they're not just places you're passing through then the nature of Hedge navigation obviously precludes having multiple separate goals for the same navigation attempt by the same character.

                        A trod with more milestones (or a higher dot rating) also effectively counts as a destination that is multiple destinations, which (in addition to the find-a-rock-in-a-stormy-sea challenge the Hedge's nature presents) provides a ready reason for this to be a common enough modifier to put on the core chart even for characters that aren't looking for a stable exit point or attempting a very particular recurring journey to Grandmother's house.

                        Meghan Fitzgerald, could you shed some light on this point of confusion?


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                        Currently Consuming: Hunter: the Vigil 1e

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                        • Originally posted by Tessie View Post
                          I'm pretty sure the entirety of Dark Eras 2 was written after 1.5e was scrapped.
                          Correct. The Muse kith's mechanics aren't a "mistake," they're just non-standard because they fit the kith better.

                          Originally posted by Satchel View Post
                          It's the "desired" that's tripping me up on assuming that reading — if it was milestones between you and your destination, it'd be "intervening milestones" or a similar phrase, and if they're not just places you're passing through then the nature of Hedge navigation obviously precludes having multiple separate goals for the same navigation attempt by the same character.

                          A trod with more milestones (or a higher dot rating) also effectively counts as a destination that is multiple destinations, which (in addition to the find-a-rock-in-a-stormy-sea challenge the Hedge's nature presents) provides a ready reason for this to be a common enough modifier to put on the core chart even for characters that aren't looking for a stable exit point or attempting a very particular recurring journey to Grandmother's house.

                          Meghan Fitzgerald, could you shed some light on this point of confusion?
                          If you're traveling on a trod and you're under some kind of duress and thus need to actually make chase rolls, then you're looking to get somewhere on that trod; the number of milestones between you and the place you want to get to is the number of desired milestones. Even if you don't know what's on that trod or where it leads, or you don't have a specific destination in mind, you still need to choose a number of milestones (that's why it's "desired"); the ST has to know how far you intend to travel, and should tell you when you get to the trod what its rating is. (The characters don't necessarily know, but the players have to in order to make rolls.) If it's just "go until we reach the endpoint," then the ST should tell you how many milestones that is. You're not always assumed to be at one end of a trod, either, especially when its endpoints are in the mundane world. You can step onto a trod somewhere in the middle just like any road.

                          If you want to travel to a trod from somewhere else, milestones don't enter into it at all until you get there; it's not multiple destinations, it's just you moving from where you are to "somewhere on that trod." Then if the chase has to continue once you're there, because someone's after you or whatnot, change the numbers to fit traveling on a trod instead of traveling elsewhere. You don't have to start a separate chase, you're just adding to the target number based on how far you want to go.

                          I hope that makes sense!


                          Meghan Fitzgerald | Onyx Path freelance writer & developer
                          Changeling: The Lost developer
                          Mage: The Awakening developer

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                          • Originally posted by Meghan Fitzgerald View Post
                            If you're traveling on a trod and you're under some kind of duress and thus need to actually make chase rolls, then you're looking to get somewhere on that trod; the number of milestones between you and the place you want to get to is the number of desired milestones. Even if you don't know what's on that trod or where it leads, or you don't have a specific destination in mind, you still need to choose a number of milestones (that's why it's "desired"); the ST has to know how far you intend to travel, and should tell you when you get to the trod what its rating is. (The characters don't necessarily know, but the players have to in order to make rolls.) If it's just "go until we reach the endpoint," then the ST should tell you how many milestones that is. You're not always assumed to be at one end of a trod, either, especially when its endpoints are in the mundane world. You can step onto a trod somewhere in the middle just like any road.

                            If you want to travel to a trod from somewhere else, milestones don't enter into it at all until you get there; it's not multiple destinations, it's just you moving from where you are to "somewhere on that trod." Then if the chase has to continue once you're there, because someone's after you or whatnot, change the numbers to fit traveling on a trod instead of traveling elsewhere. You don't have to start a separate chase, you're just adding to the target number based on how far you want to go.

                            I hope that makes sense!
                            Makes sense. Quick couple of follow-up questions:

                            1. So changing the target number mid-chase from changing circumstances (e.g. taking on Goblin Debt or suffering that Hedgespinning effect that decreases your Speed or Initiative) is definitely supposed to happen?

                            2. What kind of stuff serves as milestones on the Dreaming Roads?


                            Resident Lore-Hound
                            Currently Consuming: Hunter: the Vigil 1e

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                            • Beast player guide states that it s possible to watch and interact with a person s dream (or Bastion) while within his Oneiros, but it s like acting through a membrane.
                              Do you think that there are some specific rules or that it s only a cosmetic thing?

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                              • Originally posted by Neos01 View Post
                                Beast player guide states that it s possible to watch and interact with a person s dream (or Bastion) while within his Oneiros, but it s like acting through a membrane.
                                Do you think that there are some specific rules or that it s only a cosmetic thing?
                                I think that the statement of that possibility is filtered through the facts of:

                                • The most common psychic inhabitants are animate scenery that variously ignores you, talks to you like you're the person you're walking around inside, or attacks you if you attract attention.
                                • The individual soul shifts constantly when not in deep sleep or meditation.
                                • The system for changing beliefs and opinions in the Bright Dream, while largely ported from Mage 1e's systems for changing public opinion through the Temenos, does not differentiate between sections of the Bright Dream, and the lowest target number for its extended action is inclusive of a single person.

                                You can influence a person's thoughts and emotions from inside their Oneiros, but it'll take multiple rolls if you don't get an exceptional success and there'll be a penalty commensurate to the strength of the belief you're trying to alter.


                                Resident Lore-Hound
                                Currently Consuming: Hunter: the Vigil 1e

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