Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer: Changeling Edition

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer: Changeling Edition

    Saw that this is one of the few boards that didn't have one of these. And since Changeling is only rivaled by Mage in the "you will encounter loopholes, fringe circumstances and weirdness" category, I'm thinking it could definitely use one of these.

    I'll probably be asking more questions than I ever get the knowledge to answer, personally, but there are a lot of smart, informed people on this board who can contribute, like ArcaneArts , Charlaquin, White Oak Dragon, etc.

    So, to start off the board, here's my first question.

    A mortal in the Hedge is in a bad way, but what happens to them if a Changeling with a Mien that is easily hideable even when exposed follows them through a hedge gate right into their Hollow? Depending on the Hollow, could they not even realize they're somewhere magical? Or does the Hedge call to them still?

  • Tessie
    replied
    Originally posted by Neos01 View Post
    The elemental fury contract talks about summoning "raging fires", and i think that this means applying the Inferno tilt.
    Do you think that it would be possible to summon a variant thunderous tilt or it would be impossible, requiring a power that imposes extreme environment?
    The Contract applies any Environmental Tilt of your choice, and if one doesn't exist you're both free and encouraged to just make one up. Easiest way to do that is, as you suggest yourself, to just modify one of the sample Tilts.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unahim
    replied
    Originally posted by Neos01 View Post
    The elemental fury contract talks about summoning "raging fires", and i think that this means applying the Inferno tilt.
    Do you think that it would be possible to summon a variant thunderous tilt or it would be impossible, requiring a power that imposes extreme environment?
    It can summon literal earthquakes, supposedly even there where earthquakes don't generally occur. So I don't think there's necessarily a thematic problem. But rules-wise I can see two problems:
    - There is no "Storm" tilt. You need to combine Heavy Winds and Heavy Rain... and then you still don't have lightning. But maybe if it's only lightning, though you'll need to make a new tilt for it.
    - There's an Autumn contract that summons a storm that also zaps people with lightning. It would suck for them if you could just do the same with Elemental Fury. So make sure it's not just better than that Contract.

    I guess I'd allow it, but there'll be no controlling the effects of the lightning strikes, and once you unleash it it may destabilize local weather and lead to unforeseen effects (just like how an inferno, once unleashed, will spread by itself and possibly unpredictably).

    Leave a comment:


  • Neos01
    replied
    The elemental fury contract talks about summoning "raging fires", and i think that this means applying the Inferno tilt.
    Do you think that it would be possible to summon a variant thunderous tilt or it would be impossible, requiring a power that imposes extreme environment?

    Leave a comment:


  • Tessie
    replied
    I say +1 general armour. It's exactly as efficient as a +1 damage modifier. It's also how MtA handles it and it's the one game that has a fairly exhaustive system for improvising/comparing such bonuses.
    Technically it should be a choice between general and ballistics armour, but since the latter is always worse than the former when compared on a one to one basis it's not much of a choice.

    Leave a comment:


  • Vintervalpen
    replied
    There is an argument to be made it is +1 in either general or ballistic in order to balance the merit against itself. A hedhespun weapon gives +1 to damage per dot, meaning a hedgespun firearm, bow, or crossbow would have its damage considerably mitigated by an armour of the equivalent rating if the latter gives +1/+1. Essentially, the +1/+1 double ups on the gain per dot compared to the +1s of weapons/other hedgespun items, and I am not entirely sure why the armour would be more cost effective.

    It is a bit ambiguously written and I'd preferred if it had been more clear in the book.

    Leave a comment:


  • HelmsDerp
    replied
    I would assume +1/+1, but that's based on the rather flimsy precedent of contracts that grant armor give equal amounts of general and ballistic

    Leave a comment:


  • Master Aquatosic
    replied
    I asked this before but it never got answered. When you buy an enhancement dot on hedgespun equipment for armor, are you getting a +1/+1 to both general and ballistic for each dot, +1 to general armor only, or a +1 to either general or ballistic, your choice?

    Leave a comment:


  • Neos01
    replied
    Originally posted by Satchel View Post
    You can't drop the Mask in the Hedge, because the Mask doesn't exist in the Hedge. Scenario 2 is a nonsense scenario.

    The sole ambiguities (in the Huntsman section and the Obliged Condition) can be parsed out easily enough:

    1. The Wyrd rating of a changeling is added as a dice bonus to rolls by fae creatures and Huntsmen to track them.
    2. Scouring away the Mask opens Hedgeways and causes the above rolls to automatically succeed within a range determined by Wyrd, but does not affect the dice bonus outside that range.
    3. The Obliged Condition removes the dice bonus for fae creatures and Huntsmen, forces a Clash of Wills for the Hunter's Senses Dread Power to provide its bonuses, and allows a changeling to hide from Wyrd-touched pursuers at the site of their obligation for a scene once per chapter; it does not affect the act of dropping the Mask (save that it presumably supersedes the automatic success if you are, in fact, hiding).

    Side routes:
    A. The Dull Beacon Merit reduces a changeling's effective Wyrd for the purposes of conveying automatic success to fae trackers and opening Hedgeways when dropping the Mask, but does not affect the tracking bonus.
    B. The Hollow Merit penalizes all mundane and supernatural attempts to track a changeling while they are in the Hollow, which functionally counteracts the bonus to fae tracking.
    I agree, this is in fact the most coherent interpretation to me, unfortunately the rules written on the oblige condition and the huntsman powers had confunded me.
    Also, i was wondering if the wyrd tracking bonus applies also on other creatures linked to arcadia (a changeling tracking a true fae, or another changeling).
    What do you think?

    Leave a comment:


  • Satchel
    replied
    Originally posted by Neos01 View Post
    Have i misunderstood something?
    You can't drop the Mask in the Hedge, because the Mask doesn't exist in the Hedge. Scenario 2 is a nonsense scenario.

    The sole ambiguities (in the Huntsman section and the Obliged Condition) can be parsed out easily enough:

    1. The Wyrd rating of a changeling is added as a dice bonus to rolls by fae creatures and Huntsmen to track them.
    2. Scouring away the Mask opens Hedgeways and causes the above rolls to automatically succeed within a range determined by Wyrd, but does not affect the dice bonus outside that range.
    3. The Obliged Condition removes the dice bonus for fae creatures and Huntsmen, forces a Clash of Wills for the Hunter's Senses Dread Power to provide its bonuses, and allows a changeling to hide from Wyrd-touched pursuers at the site of their obligation for a scene once per chapter; it does not affect the act of dropping the Mask (save that it presumably supersedes the automatic success if you are, in fact, hiding).

    Side routes:
    A. The Dull Beacon Merit reduces a changeling's effective Wyrd for the purposes of conveying automatic success to fae trackers and opening Hedgeways when dropping the Mask, but does not affect the tracking bonus.
    B. The Hollow Merit penalizes all mundane and supernatural attempts to track a changeling while they are in the Hollow, which functionally counteracts the bonus to fae tracking.

    Leave a comment:


  • Neos01
    replied
    I m a little confused by fae tracking ability and the bargains.
    In the bargain (with humans) description the book states that it works by concealing the changeling to the fae senses and this is applied with the Obliged condition.
    The problem is that in the book there are two versions of fae tracking systems.

    1- the wyrd rating of the changeling ALWAYS applies as a bonus to the fae tracking rolls, dropping the mask results in automatic success on this roll.

    2- the wyrd bonus only applies when the changeling drop the mask in the hedge, dropping the mask in the mundane world results in automatic success on the roll.
    OR
    the wyrd bonus only applies in each situation in which the changeling is without the mask

    In each cases i think that the Obliged condition negates the wyrd bonus and forces a clash of will with the Hunter senses power.

    If the scenario 1 is true bargains are very useful, but in scenario 2 the description in the bargain section becomes very confusing, as a changeling could simply avoid to drop the mask in the mundane world to avoid attention.

    Have i misunderstood something?

    Leave a comment:


  • Tessie
    replied
    You don't get to roll again once you've reached the target number unless it's specified. Once you've reached the target number the roll has succeeded.
    The exact wording of the Contract implies you count all successes rolled, meaning a successful activation cannot score a modifier below the higher of the subject's Wyrd or Resolve, and is likely to score a high number of successes regardless provided the target doesn't have terrible stats.
    The more likely way it's intended to work is that you only count the successes on the final roll. Then you get a distribution that fits non-extended resisted activations.

    Extended actions with the number of successes determining the outcome is just a shit mechanism. It goes against the design philosophy of binary rolls being preferable, and fails to take advantage of the fact that extended actions have numerous Exceptional Success results to choose from to reward good rolls. Personally, I would just throw out it being an extended action and just have Spinning Wheel be an instant action that takes 10 minutes. That would trade out the reliability of the Contract (as failing a roll is much more likely than running out of number of rolls before achieving the target number) for a guarantee that it won't take more than 10 minutes to invoke.
    Last edited by Tessie; 10-06-2020, 07:49 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Neos01
    replied
    Originally posted by Vintervalpen View Post
    When using Spinning Wheel, can I keep rolling if I meet the target successes (let's say 2) and go all the way up to the +-5 cap of the contract? The usefulness of this contract kinda depends a lot on whether you stop once you hit wyrd/resolve, or can keep going with the extended action rolls.
    I usually use the last roll in an extended action to determine the successes.
    If a player want to roll again to get better results i let him if he has not reached the maximum numbers of roll, but i don t let him accumulate successes with the previous roll, i only consider the last roll number of successes

    Leave a comment:


  • Vintervalpen
    replied
    When using Spinning Wheel, can I keep rolling if I meet the target successes (let's say 2) and go all the way up to the +-5 cap of the contract? The usefulness of this contract kinda depends a lot on whether you stop once you hit wyrd/resolve, or can keep going with the extended action rolls.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unahim
    replied
    Personally I rule that a Fetch's "Mask" is simply stronger before the Changeling escapes. When the Changeling comes back, there being two of them in Ironsides weakens the claim the Fetch has over that identity and allows anyone who can see past the Mask to see it for what it is. The Fetch only realises it is a fetch generally after the Changeling escapes, so this makes sense to me and smooths over all possible weird cases.

    At the very least it satisfies all the criteria Satchel listed as being integral to the Fetch myth.

    Aside from the "Fetches as measuring sticks for normal" thing... I mean, the book very clearly lays out that there's often something wrong with them in some way or the other, so not sure why we'd use them as a measuring stick for anything. But they'll fool you into believing they're normal enough, sure. That part is important, but that little feeling at the back of a loved one's neck that something is wrong here is an integral part of the mythos and important, too.

    Some 2nd Ed text:
    It is a fetch, a flimsy simulacrum made of sticks and
    string, meaty bits, or whatever other ephemera the True
    Fae chooses to bend to the task.
    "Flimsy simulacrum", not "solid copy".

    You — warped by your durance, changed
    by your experiences in ways even your Mask cannot hide
    — are likely to seem less “you” than the being that has
    experienced your life in your absence. Your fetch knows
    things you missed during your durance, knows the joys
    and pain they’ve shared with the people you once called
    friends over the years. Years that are, for you, filled with
    memories of an entirely different place, different lessons,
    a different life.
    Note how it focuses a lot on actions and experiences. Those are more important than simply what the fetch looks like "for real", so focusing so much on what it looks like is a bit of a sidetrack.

    You see things now, know things, can
    do things that are frankly a danger to anyone around you.
    You’re not “you” anymore, not the you that you were before
    your durance. And while it may not have started as
    the real you, it’s lived the life you couldn’t. Raised your
    children. Worked your job. Paid your bills. Even now, it’s
    willing to fight to protect the things and the people you
    couldn’t. Even if that means fighting you.
    More focus on actions, on role in the story, over looking like a human or not.

    So yeah, let humans be unable to see its true nature (aside from a little feeling of wrongness occassionally), sure, but letting fae see the truth once its changeling has returned is fine.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X