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  • Originally posted by haren View Post
    So in trying to describe WHY someone would join a Court to a potential player, I came up with the best analogy for them... they're supernatural unions who use collective bargaining power to fight their bosses' power.

    That's a good one.

    The way I'm seeing it is much the same reason that the Lost regularly enter Bargains with Humans. Not being in a Court, in a sense, means being the young dear that breaks off from the pack while being hunted by wolves.

    It's the fear that you (rightly) may not be socially, supernaturally, and (sometimes) physically protected from the predations of the Fae and their agents.

    Being in a court means easier stores for Glamour, easier connections to others that have protective measures you may not have, Support infrastructure for your own sanity, supernatural shielding (ish) from fae senses, rules and other supernatural protections that help, and any number of other benefits depending on the Freehold/Court.

    Essentially, not being in one means being the lone dear without the protection of the herd to help. It's obvi not a for sure thing but there's def that fear, and to be honest, rightly so. A lone changeling without a larger freehold to contend does seem to be a lower hanging fruit for predators. They might end up even more of a target then they otherwise would.



    Frequent Story Teller for the Circle of Five gaming group.

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    • But wait, isn't this conflating being in a Court with being in a Freehold? Unless you can't be part of a Freehold without also being part of a Court?

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      • Wait wait... I was looking at the rules for Bargains while working on my Court Contracts and it suddenly leaped out at me that the hiding system details of them aren't mentioned. Like it says it hides changelings from True Fae and Huntsmen, but the rules don't talk about that at all under System. Is there something elsewhere that I'm missing?



        ​When noise turns to silence, when colors dull and pale, when reality no longer makes sense, there shall you find me. There, in the dreams of the River of Faceless Millions, do I dwell.

        http://harenm.deviantart.com/gallery/ for my art.

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        • Originally posted by haren View Post
          Wait wait... I was looking at the rules for Bargains while working on my Court Contracts and it suddenly leaped out at me that the hiding system details of them aren't mentioned. Like it says it hides changelings from True Fae and Huntsmen, but the rules don't talk about that at all under System. Is there something elsewhere that I'm missing?
          It's in the text of the Obliged Condition in the Appendix/fourth preview draft.


          Resident Sanguinary Analyst
          Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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          • Satchel thank you! I knew I'd seen it somewhere, but I had no clue WHERE.



            ​When noise turns to silence, when colors dull and pale, when reality no longer makes sense, there shall you find me. There, in the dreams of the River of Faceless Millions, do I dwell.

            http://harenm.deviantart.com/gallery/ for my art.

            Comment


            • Satchel So what happens when you have multiple Bargains? What happens if you have a Bargain or two AND you're in a Freehold/Court?

              Does it add bonuses and layers to the fae protection a la Obliged?



              Frequent Story Teller for the Circle of Five gaming group.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by xiongrey View Post
                Satchel So what happens when you have multiple Bargains? What happens if you have a Bargain or two AND you're in a Freehold/Court?

                Does it add bonuses and layers to the fae protection a la Obliged?
                The most obvious outcome is that you have more places to hide, more favors, an extra layer of insulation from fae detection, and possibly more sources of Beats per story. Obliged itself is fairly nongranular in its effects; aside from the particulars a specific deal offers you, the effect is more or less consistent across instances.

                Being in a freehold or court doesn't really add much to that, given that the starting Mantle dot is the benefit of Courtly oath and freeholds give a bonus to navigating their territory.


                Resident Sanguinary Analyst
                Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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                • ...and now I’m sad that a Changeling translation guide wasn’t part of the stretch goals. Would have been interesting to see, even if the two gamelines are polar opposites of each other. Ah well...

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                  • Originally posted by tasti man LH View Post
                    ...and now I’m sad that a Changeling translation guide wasn’t part of the stretch goals. Would have been interesting to see, even if the two gamelines are polar opposites of each other. Ah well...
                    So, devs have stated the the Gentry may not be the original residents of Arcadia...The oWoD Fae? Maybe? Banality hits them not because the world is low on wonder, but because the phenomenal world is just metaphysically toxic to oWoD fairies, because they were cast out from Arcadia where they belong in the first place? And the encroaching Banality isn't the world losing something, it's the resources that the oWoD fae needs just dwindling, and Glamour being a not-quite sufficient substitute for the stuff that they need, and can't rpoduce enough of themselves.


                    Genius: the Transgression 2E is a thing that's being worked on.

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                    • Originally posted by malonkey1 View Post

                      So, devs have stated the the Gentry may not be the original residents of Arcadia...The oWoD Fae? Maybe? Banality hits them not because the world is low on wonder, but because the phenomenal world is just metaphysically toxic to oWoD fairies, because they were cast out from Arcadia where they belong in the first place? And the encroaching Banality isn't the world losing something, it's the resources that the oWoD fae needs just dwindling, and Glamour being a not-quite sufficient substitute for the stuff that they need, and can't rpoduce enough of themselves.

                      I assumed that the huntsmen were like the faerie spirits like Father Christmas, the Seasons, and other fae spirit-like things that are like the original Gentry.



                      Frequent Story Teller for the Circle of Five gaming group.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by malonkey1 View Post

                        So, devs have stated the the Gentry may not be the original residents of Arcadia...The oWoD Fae? Maybe? Banality hits them not because the world is low on wonder, but because the phenomenal world is just metaphysically toxic to oWoD fairies, because they were cast out from Arcadia where they belong in the first place? And the encroaching Banality isn't the world losing something, it's the resources that the oWoD fae needs just dwindling, and Glamour being a not-quite sufficient substitute for the stuff that they need, and can't rpoduce enough of themselves.
                        That's how I pictured things, yeah.

                        That once the Long Winter/End Times hit, some of the changelings managed to figure out how to get back to Arcadia. And as such, were able to survive the wave of Banality and not get Undone. But they still require some kind of sustenance from humanity...but since they can't step into the Autumn World anymore, they have to resort to enticing and kidnapping humans. What was previously the Enchanted start to become the Lost changelings.

                        Not that the Dreaming changelings as abusers wasn't a huge leap: reading through the various methods of gaining Glamour, there was an undercurrent of them engaging in some pretty heinous abusive behavior. Ravaging and Rhapsody obviously, but even Musing, the most encouraged form of the Epiphanies, has the air of engaging in codependent relationships. That the Dreamer can only create art with the assistance of the changeling. In combination of the diminishing returns of Glamour as the Dreamer keeps struggling to create art with the same amount of impact with the same amount of Glamour. It wouldn't take much for a changeling to decide to just abandon the Dreamer and move on to a different one, without really caring about the state of the Dreamer. Also, since the Dreaming can be just as toxic of a place as the Autumn World and actually drives them closer to Bedlam (which in Dreaming is a different thing then in Lost). Which could explain the Gentry's demeanor and reasoning being so inhuman, could explain why they're so incapable of empathy.

                        (also, the Begotten are probably just the current incarnation of the Thallain)

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                        • Yeah, there's a lot that could be done with a conversion guide. Since the two games are so different despite sharing a source of inspiration, it could get a really creative, interesting conversion book, not unlike what Demon got.


                          Genius: the Transgression 2E is a thing that's being worked on.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by tasti man LH View Post

                            That's how I pictured things, yeah.

                            That once the Long Winter/End Times hit, some of the changelings managed to figure out how to get back to Arcadia. And as such, were able to survive the wave of Banality and not get Undone. But they still require some kind of sustenance from humanity...but since they can't step into the Autumn World anymore, they have to resort to enticing and kidnapping humans. What was previously the Enchanted start to become the Lost changelings.

                            Not that the Dreaming changelings as abusers wasn't a huge leap: reading through the various methods of gaining Glamour, there was an undercurrent of them engaging in some pretty heinous abusive behavior. Ravaging and Rhapsody obviously, but even Musing, the most encouraged form of the Epiphanies, has the air of engaging in codependent relationships. That the Dreamer can only create art with the assistance of the changeling. In combination of the diminishing returns of Glamour as the Dreamer keeps struggling to create art with the same amount of impact with the same amount of Glamour. It wouldn't take much for a changeling to decide to just abandon the Dreamer and move on to a different one, without really caring about the state of the Dreamer. Also, since the Dreaming can be just as toxic of a place as the Autumn World and actually drives them closer to Bedlam (which in Dreaming is a different thing then in Lost). Which could explain the Gentry's demeanor and reasoning being so inhuman, could explain why they're so incapable of empathy.

                            (also, the Begotten are probably just the current incarnation of the Thallain)
                            Another thing that makes it easier to go from CtD Changelings to Gentry is the fact that, as explained on page 301 the Sidhe frailty is replaced with Emphatic Blindness when they enter the Dreaming making them unable to think non-Nobles as beings of conseguence and in the Deep Dreaming they can barely tolerate Commoner presented at all preferring to act through proxy since it is a privilidge to hear their beautiful voices and be in their presence. So if they think so little of their fellow Changelings just think how little humans matter to them.

                            And yes I’m all for a well done conversion book, like the one Demon got which is a great book in general.

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                            • Originally posted by Possessed View Post

                              Another thing that makes it easier to go from CtD Changelings to Gentry is the fact that, as explained on page 301 the Sidhe frailty is replaced with Emphatic Blindness when they enter the Dreaming making them unable to think non-Nobles as beings of conseguence and in the Deep Dreaming they can barely tolerate Commoner presented at all preferring to act through proxy since it is a privilidge to hear their beautiful voices and be in their presence. So if they think so little of their fellow Changelings just think how little humans matter to them.

                              And yes I’m all for a well done conversion book, like the one Demon got which is a great book in general.
                              The demon tranlation guide is the only book I ever asked a refund for, so nope not a fan of it.

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                              • Originally posted by Omegaphallic View Post

                                The demon tranlation guide is the only book I ever asked a refund for, so nope not a fan of it.
                                Sorry for the minor derail but could you elaborate why? I found it quite excellent for my purposes, that is I could easily use it to either bring the Fallen into a CofD game or best of all I could play a DtF chronicle using CofD rules since DtFs original rules had so much room for improvement that the best system for it, before the translation guide, was in Devil’s Due which barely resembled the original.

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