High Wyrd Fairest

[Madhatter]

I know there was criticism of my idea of high wyrd Fairest developing alien beauty and I should stick closer to fairest blessing so, the mechanics don't become too confusing and complex. However, I don't want fairest to simply evolve into epic heroic knights in shining armor or fairy princesses. I want them to become the fae creatures whose beauty drives mortal men and women to madness and self destruction, like the Rusalka, Samodiva, Leanan-Sidhe, and Selkies.

While some fairest would enjoy this power, I can see others feeling a great deal of guilt over the lives they ruin.

This idea was inspired by Junji Ito's Tomie series and Ed Brubaker Sean Phillip's Fatale series, about a seemingly immortal women who has the power cause men to becomes infatuated with her.

Here are some edits I mate to my idea for the evolution of the Fairest seeming blessing. I developed the curse with the idea of your seeming become a danger to your mortal/ lower wyrd allies.

Fairest

Wyrd 7: The fairest never suffers social penalties due to appearance or actions. They also always match their audiences ideal of a fairy princess, knight in shining armor, or prince charming.

Wyrd 8: All seductions difficulties made against a character who feels or romantic, physical, or simple friendship toward the fairest are zero. By Spending a point of glamor and touching a target, the fairest can roll Manipulation+ Persuasion or Subterfuge + Wyrd against a characters Composure + Wyrd. If successful, the target suffers the Swooned Condition, which evolves into Ravished Condition.

Wyrd 9: The fairest gains 4 automatic successes in all rolls where appearance would help. And any wound that would mar the fairest perfect beauty instantly heals, not leaving a scar.

Wyrd 10: Any supernatural power (contracts, disciplines, gifts, spells) that would mentally or emotionally influence the fairest is an automatic dramatic failure.
But Beauty is as much a curse as a blessing.

Wyrd 7: Add a dice for a clarity roll when you accidentally cause misfortune towards your allies.

Wyrd 8: When the Fairest causes the Ravished Condition on a mortal or changeling with a Wyrd below 6, they suffer the Bacchanalia Tilt.

Wyrd 9: Any mortal that gazes on the fairest gains the Fae-Struck Condition

Wyrd 10: Gain an automatic derangement.

Ravished Condition: The character feels waves of ecstasy so great that they are knocked unconscious.

Bacchanalia Tilt: The ecstasy the character feels are so strong it damages their body. The character suffers seven points of damage.

Fae-Struck Condition: The characters feel an all-consuming love for the fairest that overrides self-preservation. They will walk thousands of miles, commit murder, or acts of terrorism just to be near the Fairest.

[Stupid Loserman]

Kind of unplayably powerful for my tastes, but just two things stuck out to me anyway for feedback:

All seductions difficulties made against a character who feels or romantic, physical, or simple friendship toward the fairest are zero.

What is a "difficulty?" Did you mean to say they ignore dice penalties on these rolls? You also say Swooned "evolves" into Ravished, but not how or when. Just instantly? What's the point of Ravished being a Condition rather than just saying they suffer Swooned and also are knocked unconscious?

And any wound that would mar the fairest perfect beauty instantly heals, not leaving a scar.

So they're... immune to damage? Or they take damage normally but it just never shows outwardly until they collapse?

[Madhatter]

Kind of unplayably powerful for my tastes, but just two things stuck out to me anyway for feedback:

I think a chronicle featuring a high wyrd fairest should deal with the chaos their beauty causes and how deals with it. Most fairest would not want to develop their wyrd so high because of how powerfully destructive their beauty is, unless they have a major objective in mind. The fairest might also have been someone who was plane as an ordinary mortal.



What is a "difficulty?" Did you mean to say they ignore dice penalties on these rolls? You also say Swooned "evolves" into Ravished, but not how or when. Just instantly? What's the point of Ravished being a Condition rather than just saying they suffer Swooned and also are knocked unconscious?
Yes, and swooned turns into ravished the next turn.



So they're... immune to damage? Or they take damage normally but it just never shows outwardly until they collapse?

They take damage normally from their frailties and cold iron, but all other damage heals instantly

[Madhatter]

I think a chronicle featuring a high wyrd fairest should deal with the chaos their beauty causes and how deals with it. Most fairest would not want to develop their wyrd so high because of how powerfully destructive their beauty is, unless they have a major objective in mind. The fairest might also have been someone who was plane as an ordinary mortal.

[Madhatter]

What is a "difficulty?" Did you mean to say they ignore dice penalties on these rolls? Yes, they ignore dice penalties to these rolls.

You also say Swooned "evolves" into Ravished, but not how or when. Just instantly? What's the point of Ravished being a Condition rather than just saying they suffer Swooned and also are knocked unconscious? Swooned turns into ravished, the next turn. When the character wakes up, they still have the swooned condition, but not the ravished tilt.

[Madhatter]

What I am thinking of doing is, like the Fairest of Them All True Fae title, emphasize that this blessing will not work on a character motivated by true love or true friendship.

[Madhatter]

[QUOTE=Stupid Loserman;n1446654]Kind of unplayably powerful for my tastes, but just two things stuck out to me anyway for feedback:


I do agree that a high wyrd fairest is almost brokenly powerful, but I want such a high wyrd fairest chronicle to emphasize how their beauty makes it almost nearly impossible to function in normal society and how such a character tries to adjust.

I can also see some high wyrd fairest enjoying the chaos they create. I have an idea for Snow White as high duchess of the Ice-bond heart in Germany and a major antagonist in a changeling chronicle.

[Tessie]

My primary criticism from the other thread still holds true: This forces a very narrow view on a Seeming on everyone of that Seeming, with little to no room for individualisation. In this case the effects themselves are quite generic so they wouldn't be completely out of place on any individual Fairest, but forcing literally all Fairest to gain and suffer the same advantages and disadvantages means you're forcing all of them to go through the same type of story with the same obstacles and likely to only have a few different outcomes of those stories. Look at what high Wyrd gives you by RAW: Frailties. But you don't get specific Frailties handed to you; you pick the Frailties that lost fits the character.

If you want to make powerul NPCs to really stand out from regular changelings, I wholeheartedly advice you to personalise their advantages and drawbacks. Design Snow White according to the character she is in your campaign; not according to what you think a poweful Fairest would become.
Take a look at how Entitlements work. Since each is unique, they grant extreme amounts of flavour, and they explain why a character would transform in ways that can't be replicated by others. I'm not saying you should use Entitlements as is, but the concept of adding a "secondary template" on top of characters to make them powerful and stand out makes a whole lot more sense to me than them gaining a bunch of character defining traits from just having a high Wyrd rating. If we compare to Mage, it'd be like having Gnosis 7 automatically turns you into a lesser Archmaster, with each additional dot giving more Archmaster traits.


As for my criticism of individual advantages and drawbacks:
I like the removal of social penalties as well as being able to inflict Swooning. It's a lot like Awe from Majesty in VtR, which could be really good inspiration if you own that book.

I dislike how Swooning turns to Ravished. It's really weird to me that a social power abruptly ends social situations (because the other party literally falls unconscious) and it's way too easy to use to end combat in a way that puts the opponent at a lethal disadvantage.
Speaking of lethality, since 7 health is very average, Bachanallia risks mortally wounding a majority of everyone the Fairest can use this on. This is particularly egregious in combination with the fact that they're also unconscious and can't do anything to stabilise themselves and are left completely defenseless against you or anyone else who wants a piece of them.
Minor nitpick: Ravished and Bachanallia shouldn't be a Condition or a Tilt since they describe instantaneous effects. When you hit a character with a sword you don't give them the Hit by a Sword Tilt which deals [successes + weapon modifier - general armour] damage; you just deal that damage.

Rather than giving a bonus to all rolls where appearance matters, I'd give them something similar to Striking Looks (but obviously more powerful than the base Merit). It limits when the bonus is applied, but that limit gives some individualisation and thus flavour.

Instantly healing everything that isn't inflicted by frailties is extremely potent. I think you can come up with something less powerful but still fitting. For example, only healing bashing and lethal damage but not aggravated, and only at the end of their turn (stolen from Werewolf) or give them ridiculous armour ratings against anything that would mar their beauty but not other sources of damage. I.e. the best way to bring down Snow White might be to poison her, although that's quite possibly a Frailty of hers.

Fae-Struck is tough but fitting. But it does need some work so it doesn't ruin basically all Touchstones.

Derangements aren't a thing in 2e, thankfully.

[Madhatter]

The way I envision it, your seeming is the identity forced on you by your Keeper. What causes clarity damage as your wyrd get higher and higher is the identity given to you by your Keeper reasserting itself. This is why it makes sense to me that you seeming blessing's evolution would be a bit narrow.

Your kith on the other hand, represents your own talent/potential, skills, even vices that drew your Keeper to you. You can give your character more individualism through a merit like potent kith.

[Madhatter]

A major part of an epic changeling chronicle is the internal struggle between the changeling's TRUE IDENTITY and the identity forced on them by their Keeper.

[Tessie]

I think that makes less sense, imo. It implies all Keepers are trying to form the same six archetypal characters from all of their human victims.
Also, the idea that the role given by the Keeper starts reasserting itself is still fully compatible with individualised advantages and disadvantages. Basically, rather than Snow White being forced into a generic archetype, she gets forced into the specific role her Keeper meant for her.
I can't tell you how to run your game, but I really do think you're doing your game a disservice by developing generic systems that impose limits on how you design your NPCs rather than developing your NPCs directly to make them fit the themes of your game.
Like, imagine that Frailties gained at various Wyrd ratings were predetermined. They're equally as limiting to the characters as personalised Frailties, but having them be predetermined also means they're limiting the way you can design the characters. I don't think you'd gain anything by having predetermined Frailties. That's how I feel about Seeming specific advantages and disadvantages at Wyrd 7+.

[Madhatter]

I don't envision each seeming being an archetypal role and their will be variance in the Seemings; a fairest can be a knight in shining armor, or a succubus, or a ballerina, a wailing banshee who cleans the clothes of the doomed. But it makes sense to me that their Keeper's would give their fairest incredible beauty to glorify their keepers, and themselves. As the wyrd of the fairest rises, it makes sense to me that their beauty would shine/burn more brightly.

Some fairest would relish this. Especially if they were plain or even homely as ordinary mortals. Others would feel a great deal of guilt over this and take steps to prevent this from happening. Keeping their wyrd low would be pretty simply, but some fairest would have an objective that required a high wyrd. As such, it would be more difficult, but not impossible to prevent wrecking havoc with their looks.

[Madhatter]

More thoughts..

A major theme of Changeling: The Lost is identity. Regaining the life and identity the True Fae/ Gentry stole from you, while staying out of the clutches of your Keeper.

A lot of that is literal, such as escaping a huntsman and not falling into the clutches of a loyalist or racketeer.

But another large part of it is the internal struggle a changeling has with their seeming. At lower levels, it is much easier to avoid.

But as the changeling's wyrd reaches a certain level, (I say around 7), the internal struggle is given more focus.

[21C Hermit]

Or maybe give each Seemings several divergences of high-Wyrd growth? So one Fairest becomes the Beauty, the other the Prince, and yet another the Witch, and so on.

Then again, this would end up overlapping with Entitlements... which is part of what Tessie was saying, I think.

Maybe these ‘Wyrd Evolutions’ are Seeming-bound Entitlements available to any high-Wyrd chageling of the corresponding Seeming.

[Madhatter]

Entitlements are one of the ways you create your own story/identity. I envision your seeming being an identity given to you by your Keeper. I CAN see you seeming evolving based on the changeling's actions and how it connects to their kith in some way.