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Changeling/Werewolf Crossover?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Madhatter View Post
    How spirits view Cu Sith would depend on the spirit's relationship with the Hedge, and even the True Fae and Arcadia. In 1e, Equinox Road, we learned that spirits will turn into hobgoblins if the spend enough time in the Hedge (this was the inspiration for the spirit part of the werewolf being transformed into Fae).

    Also, I don't think it would be as difficult for a True Fae to capture a werewolf after their change and they join a Tribe. In 1e, if a werewolf enters the Hedge, they lose access to their spirit gifts unless the spirit enters the hedge with them (and risks the transformation into the Hedge). From what little has been revealed about the Hedge in 2e, I can see a similar thing happening. As such, I see spirits being very hesitant to follow the Werewolf into the Hedge. Forsaken might also find that Luna's mark does not protect them in the Hedge. Also, the wolf might be tricked into following a changeling into the Hedge, where the True Fae could capture them. Another example is that the werewolf might be given to the True Fae by other werewolves.

    Depending on how strong the True Fae are in 2e, the might be able to take a werewolf on, even in beast man mode.
    I imagine that most spirits have little awareness or knowledge of the Hedge or the Gentry, much less an active opinion. I say that they'd treat the Cu Sith as magath or the servants of the idigam because all the average spirit would know would be that this was a combination of things that should not be combined. A wolf made of fire won't be welcomed any more than a swarm of bees made of fire would.

    As far as the spirit portion becoming fully fae goes, I'd see that as a lose condition for the Cu Sith. To maintain the balance of all 3 worlds, the Cu Sith would need to work hard. They'd need to spend time out of the Hedge. Staying too long would result in them evolving into something else entirely (briarwolves perhaps?).

    As far as werewolves against the True Fae go, I'd say that in Arcadia and probably in the Hedge, the wolves would be screwed. Ironside might be a different story. The reason that I think that Cu Sith made from existing wolves would be rare isn't because the Gentry would lack the ability, but rather that most wolves don't go running through the Hedge on a regular basis. A Pure pack or a Lodge that are handing over wolves to the Fae would be great justification for a larger number of Cu Sith in a given chronicle, if the Storyteller wanted them to be a running theme rather than a freak of the week or a unique NPC.

    Currently working on: DtD Night Horrors: Enemy Action
    Projects I've contributed to: C20 Anthology of Dreams ("No Such Thing As Dragons")


    • #17
      They'd need to spend time out of the Hedge. Staying too long would result in them evolving into something else entirely (briarwolves perhaps?).

      Maybe they turn into something similar to the Lunar Exalted's Chimera. An insane ever shapeshifting monster


      • #18
        The reason that I think that Cu Sith made from existing wolves would be rare isn't because the Gentry would lack the ability, but rather that most wolves don't go running through the Hedge on a regular basis.

        Most humans don't go running through the Hedge, either, though the True Fae still kidnap them. I can see a True Fae stalking werewolves if the True Fae has concepts and themes associated with the Werewolf tribe or if the True Fae had once been a Spirit, themselves.


        • #19
          True, humans don't generally go running through the Hedge. Humans don't present the same challenge that Uratha would, though, so they're the more logical prey. Taking a wolf is trickier and more dangerous. With wolves, they need to worry about their target turning into a fuzzy nigh-unstoppable killing machine, plus his nigh-unstoppable killing machine buddies, their strange alien spirit ally, and the collected weird powers of the group. Your average human is a simple grab. A Fae specializing in werewolf related things or desperate for a Cu Sith might find it worth the added effort, but most probably wouldn't.

          Currently working on: DtD Night Horrors: Enemy Action
          Projects I've contributed to: C20 Anthology of Dreams ("No Such Thing As Dragons")


          • #20
            The True Fae might resort to trickery to lure the werewolf into the Hedge. Also, we don't know how strong the True Fae are in the Mortal world. They might be able to take a werewolf one on one and might be able to use pledges contracts made with the mortal world to keep away their spirit allies. Though I see such pledges are rare and used only by those True Fae who have some connection to spirits and the werewolf tribes in some way.


            • #21
              Is there any particular reason you guys aren't going with the First Change happening during a changeling's escape?

              I call the Integrity-analogue the "subjective stat".
              An explanation how to use Social Manuevering.
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              • #22
                Originally posted by Errol216 View Post
                Is there any particular reason you guys aren't going with the First Change happening during a changeling's escape?
                The main reason that I'm going that route is that in my head canon a person who has been fully made into a changeling loses touch with any wolf blood they may have once possessed. I went with the First Change occurring at the same time as the transformation into a changeling as the most common origin for the Cu Sith because it seemed to me that that would be the moment when all the factors would come together, the moment when the person is not fully changeling or wolf, but still has the chance to become both.

                Currently working on: DtD Night Horrors: Enemy Action
                Projects I've contributed to: C20 Anthology of Dreams ("No Such Thing As Dragons")


                • #23
                  An interesting question just popped into my mind. In Changeling 1e, it states that spirits that spend enough time in the Hedge, it will turn into a hobgoblin. If this concept is kept in 2e, what would happen if a marathon or Idigam entered the Hedge. Could an Idigam potentially become one of the True Fae? Or would they corrupt the Hedge into something worse?


                  • #24
                    Hey White Oak Dragon, I am not sure how fully you have developed your Cu Sith, but I found some entities that I think would be good sources of inspiration. In Inuit mythology, Akhlut is a spirit that takes the form of both a wolf and an orca. It is a vicious, dangerous beast. Its tracks can be recognized because they are wolf tracks that lead to and from the ocean. Often, dogs seen walking to the ocean and/or into it are considered evil. Little is known of this spirit, other than that it shapeshifts from an orca to a wolf when hungry. Not many myths relate to this creature but a great number of myths tell of creatures that shift their shape. It is normally portrayed as a mix of an orca and a wolf.

                    It has been said that this a dangerous creature but, most of the Inuit did not know what was attacking them while trying to get fish out in the arctic sea. The only thing they could think of was the wolf tracks coming out of the water. The Akhlut is very vicious, and even attacks you if you have fallen asleep near the edge. Sometimes it goes as far as the Inuit camp to snatch them up. It has a furious appetite and would eat anything that's close by.

                    There are many stories of how the Akhlut came to be but, this legend is the most popular: It’s about a man who is obsessed with the sea and wants to be with it all the time. After coming off the shore, he returns to his village, but his people don’t recognize him; because he has become too obsessed with the ocean and he gets banned from the village. While out on his own, he finds pack of wolves, and because he is so hungry, like a wolf, for revenge; he becomes one with them. One day, his affection for the ocean becomes so insane that he jumps into the ocean, to be with it. He then, transforms into an orca. Thus, he now swims as an orca, being at ease; but whenever his hunger for revenge is once again awoken, he comes to land and transforms into a wolf.

                    Arctic wolves can swim in icy water, this would be an explanation as to why there are always footprints leading out of the water. There's as the explanation of the chunk of ice the arctic wolf was coming from/ going to, simply broke off. Either with the wolf still on it, or with the wolf already having left, but a few meters away. The second solution is somewhat more mysterious, and still some kind of myth. It says that sometimes, when alder arctic wolves are being rejected by a pack, they would commit suicide by jumping in the cold, icy water and drown themselves. This is rather odd, however, because survival instincts should prevent them from doing that, because it’s very strong with animals.

                    The Cadejo (Spanish pronunciation: [kaˈðexo]) is a character from Salvadoran, Belizean, Nicaraguan, Costa Rican, Honduran, Guatemalan and southern Mexican folklore. There is a good white cadejo and an evil black cadejo. Both are spirits that appear at night to travelers: the white to protect them from harm during their journey, the black (sometimes an incarnation of the devil), to kill them. The colors of the cadejo are sometimes exchanged according to local tradition. In some places the black cadejo is seen as the good one and the white cadejo the evil one.
                    They usually appear in the form of a large (up to the size of a cow), shaggy dog with burning red eyes and a goat's hooves, although in some areas they have more bull-like characteristics. According to the stories, many have tried to kill the black cadejo but have failed and perished. Also it is said that if a cadejo is killed, it will smell terrible for several days, and then its body will disappear without a trace. Some Guatemalan folklore also tells of a cadejo that guards drunks against anyone who tries to rob or hurt them. When the cadejo is near, it is said to bring about a strong goat-like smell. Most people say never to turn your back to the creature because otherwise you will go crazy. Speaking to the cadejo will also induce insanity.

                    he cadejo ranges in size according to different tales in various regions. It lurks in graveyards and dark alleys, waiting to attack a passing victim. It has a distinctive smell of concentrated urine and burning sulphur. It rattles with a jerking motion, contracting its pharynx. Its gaze freezes anyone who makes eye contact. It glitters in the pitch dark with skin and short hair, similar to that of a pig.
                    There are three types of black cadejos:
                    The first is the devil himself in the form of a large, wounded dog with hoofed feet that are bound with red-hot chains. It is said that not even the white cadejo is able to completely stop him. Unlike the regular black cadejo it is not likely to pursue and attack a passing human, as it is a scout - the eyes of evil. Instead, anyone who spots him will have a sad event. In the short story "Leyenda del Cadejo" ("Legend of the Cadejo") by Nobel Prize laureate Miguel Ángel Asturias, this variety of cadejo terrorizes a young abbess and robs her of her braid.

                    The second type of cadejo is the regular cadejo, the mysterious evil dog. It kills and savagely tears through its victim. First it demoralizes him with a series of sounds and other signs that it is nearby. Then, after the victim is scared, it leaps forward, and will kill him if the white cadejo is not near.
                    The final, and least powerful type of black cadejo is the offspring of a normal dog and the "regular" cadejo. It is a mortal hybrid and can (with difficulty) be killed by a strong man (bearing in mind that most men in those regions only carry a machete for protection). Once dead, it will completely rot in a matter of seconds, leaving behind a stain of evil, on which grass and moss will never grow again. This cadejo will never bite its victim. Instead, he kicks and pecks them with his snout. After this happens, people say "Lo jugó el cadejo" which means "he\she was handled by the cadejo". The victim goes mad. This term is sometimes applied to people that are born with a mental illness.

                    A fairly popular version of the legend in El Salvador talks about two brothers who walk into the house of a black magician. During a storm, he asks the boys to help him with some logs for a fire. Both boys slack on the job but eat the man's food. Once he finds out the little bit of food he had is missing and that there is not enough wood for his fire, he puts a curse on the road that leads to the boys' village. Voices bother the boys and when they turn their backs on the voices they get turned into creatures: a white cadejo and a black one. After going back to their village in their cursed form they get kicked out and have no choice but to wander.

                    In the early 1900s, Juan Carlos was a guardian who lived in a thatched house near Los Arcos, in the country fields near La Aurora in Guatemala. He worked near Parroquia Vieja and arrived at his house at midnight. Almost all the time, his wife and small children spend the whole day alone, in the middle of the fields. Juan found a white dog when he arrived at his house one day. When the dog saw him coming, it would shake, turn around and disappear. Juan always tried to follow the dog, but he could never reach him. One day, when he arrived, the white dog never moved, and when he approached the dog, it did not make a single sound. But then Juan touched his paw, and all of a sudden it opened his eyes. Juan was scared; the dog said, 'you do not need my help anymore'. Frightened, Juan exclaimed,'what help'? And the dog said, in pain, 'I am a dog sent from above. My mission was to protect you from any danger. But you had showed me you do not need my help anymore.' Right after that, the white dog closed his eyes. Juan buried him, and every time he came home, he remembered the white dog.