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  • How might a Demon Pact affect a Supernatural?

    For instance, a Vampire wanting to cure their Vampirism. In my head it separates the Beast from their body as a personification of Vampirism unleashed. So while the Vampire is now human, a monster is created that can only be stopped by destroying the Pact.

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    • Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
      How might a Demon Pact affect a Supernatural?

      For instance, a Vampire wanting to cure their Vampirism. In my head it separates the Beast from their body as a personification of Vampirism unleashed. So while the Vampire is now human, a monster is created that can only be stopped by destroying the Pact.
      From demon core book:
      "demons cannot “patch in” supernatural aspects (effectively because their supernatural abilities aren’t compatible with a demon’s abilities to affect the world — a vampire’s blood-based “hardware” won’t work with a demon’s Aether-powered “software”). A demon cannot take away a vampire’s vulnerability to sunlight, for example, nor can she patch in a werewolf’s ability to change forms."

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      • Originally posted by Neos01 View Post

        From demon core book:
        "demons cannot “patch in” supernatural aspects (effectively because their supernatural abilities aren’t compatible with a demon’s abilities to affect the world — a vampire’s blood-based “hardware” won’t work with a demon’s Aether-powered “software”). A demon cannot take away a vampire’s vulnerability to sunlight, for example, nor can she patch in a werewolf’s ability to change forms."
        I always read that as Demons couldn’t incorporate other splats into their cover. Or piecemeal away their weaknesses or abilities.

        Though I guess he removing sunlight weakness kind of confirms that that may be the case. They do mention becoming human version of the target if they do a soul pact with them.

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        • Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
          They do mention becoming human version of the target if they do a soul pact with them.
          Right, but that's not the vampire becoming human, that's the vampire being annihilated and the demon gaining a Cover of "this vampire, but without actually being a vampire."

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          • Good day, quick question:
            The merit resonance sensitive from flowers of hell states "Additionally, this Merit allows your character to identify demons on sight without spending Aether."
            Do you think this can bypass Cover protection?

            And also:
            Even if embeds doesn t cost aether do you think they can be seen with aetheric resonance?
            If not shouldn t angels be able to detect their uses?

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            • Originally posted by Neos01 View Post
              Good day, quick question:
              The merit resonance sensitive from flowers of hell states "Additionally, this Merit allows your character to identify demons on sight without spending Aether."
              Do you think this can bypass Cover protection?
              Yes, but the demon still gets to try to spoof.

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              • Originally posted by Stupid Loserman View Post

                Yes, but the demon still gets to try to spoof.
                It doesn't note if Demons spoof in reaponse to it or not

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                • IIRC Resonance Sensitivity simply modifies the Aetheric resonance sense that all demons have access to. It removes the Aether cost (and makes it reflexive if it isn't already, I believe; not at my books right now). Check the rules for Aetheric resonance sense for details.


                  Bloodline: The Stygians
                  Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
                  Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

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                  • Hello, maybe this is an old question, anyway I'm here!

                    Demons are often depict as wary and selfish beings, and also the manuals tells tath's not so easy for them to make team work.

                    Do you have any plot hook to suggest me about how to put together a Ring of Unchained in spite of their lonely nature?

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                    • Originally posted by Ipergigio View Post
                      Hello, maybe this is an old question, anyway I'm here!

                      Demons are often depict as wary and selfish beings, and also the manuals tells tath's not so easy for them to make team work.

                      Do you have any plot hook to suggest me about how to put together a Ring of Unchained in spite of their lonely nature?
                      Why not get your players to help you? Ask them how they met, and why they decided to trust each other. Otherwise it might feel a bit forced if you give them a reason that you made up. You can throw them some suggestions:
                      • One player might have helped the other right after they Fell.
                      • They might have been brought together by a superior in an Agency.
                      • One might have saved the another from a hunter Angel.
                      • They each have a person or cause threatened by a common GodMachine activity.
                      • There is a low but steady Aether source that requires several demons to operate.

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                      • Demons don't seem that much more durable than Mortals and don't really have a weakness as far as I can tell, mainly because it seems like they are harmed by the same thing that harms a Mortal.
                        • What is stopping a Mortal from killing a Demon in one on one combat?
                        • What is the Demon equivalent of sunlight and silver bullets?
                        • How might Hunters hunt Demons?
                        • What is stopping a Hunter/Spurned Pactbound from exposing a Demon as one and causing a cascade of compromise checks?

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                        • What is stopping a Mortal from killing a Demon in one on one combat? - Nothing if they do not use their powers. This is roughly equivalent to Mages too btw. Demons have reflexive healing Wound healing (Demonic Form), shifting damage to something else (Embeds like Sift Consequence or On the Mend), or use an Exploit like Break to Heal. Otherwise, they can be more offensive using Blade Hand, Merciless Gunman or Hellfire.

                          What is the Demon equivalent of sunlight and silver bullets? - The biggest weakness for a Demon is getting caught. Pulling down the wrath of the God-Machine in either a direct Angelic attack, blowing his cover or having other agents (cults, etc.) come after the Demon. Doing things outside the Cover's normal behavior can weaken Cover, thereby having to lose whatever they have built up (money, identity, status, etc.).

                          How might Hunters hunt a Demon. - Maybe they become Cultists of the G-M? Maybe they pick up on the shifting Covers and know he/she is a supernatural? Aetheric detector invented of some type?

                          What is stopping a Hunter/Spurned Pactbound from exposing a Demon as one and causing a cascade of compromise checks? - Who's going to believe them? If a Demon can shift Covers to give an alibi, separate from Demonic form from the Cover to seem like someone else (Terrible Avatar), or just rewrite the minds of those he's "affected" (Memory Theft/Without a Trace) or even write it into the Pact to void the advantages of the Pactbound? You have some options.

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                          • Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
                            Demons don't seem that much more durable than Mortals and don't really have a weakness as far as I can tell, mainly because it seems like they are harmed by the same thing that harms a Mortal.
                            • What is stopping a Mortal from killing a Demon in one on one combat?
                            • What is the Demon equivalent of sunlight and silver bullets?
                            • How might Hunters hunt Demons?
                            • What is stopping a Hunter/Spurned Pactbound from exposing a Demon as one and causing a cascade of compromise checks?
                            Hunter can track demons by investigating glitches and low rating cover, as explained in the demon core.
                            At pag 114 it states "Only new information counts; if that information is disseminated to several people at once, like a hunter telling his cell that he’s identified a demon, it still only counts as one compromise. "

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
                              What is stopping a Mortal from killing a Demon in one on one combat?
                              Embeds, Exploits, Demonic Forms and usually being geared toward avoiding such encounters.

                              Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
                              What is the Demon equivalent of sunlight and silver bullets?
                              Nothing. A demon is already living a precarious existence having to hide from a seemingly omnipresent entity hunting it. Having specific weaknesses would detract from that.

                              Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
                              How might Hunters hunt Demons?
                              With difficulty since a good demon wouldn't be discovered by hunters in the first place. If a hunter would find out about a demon, it would either be by seeing its Demonic Form or finding something unusual about one of its Covers. The Demonic Form is only used situationally so it's not something that can be actively hunted. If the hunter has found out about a particular Cover, it's probably a Burner and not used often enough for it to be able to be tracked.
                              If it's somehow the demon's main Cover, the hunter finally stands a chance of actually hunting (rather than just reacting to chance encounters) because the demon may not want to burn that Cover. Then it's a matter of the hunter just confronting the demon while they're doing their Cover routine (working a job, doing a hobby, maintaining appearances) and then hope the demon doesn't have any nasty Embeds, Exploits or Demonic Form abilities.

                              Originally posted by DontEatRawHagis View Post
                              What is stopping a Hunter/Spurned Pactbound from exposing a Demon as one and causing a cascade of compromise checks?
                              A good demon would be anonymous enough to not have their Cover's identity be exposed to their mark. You can't expose someone if you don't know anything about them, such as their (Cover's) real name, address, phone number, etc. Alternatively, it's just a burner Cover that the demon doesn't care about.


                              Bloodline: The Stygians
                              Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
                              Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Neos01 View Post

                                Hunter can track demons by investigating glitches and low rating cover, as explained in the demon core.
                                At pag 114 it states "Only new information counts; if that information is disseminated to several people at once, like a hunter telling his cell that he’s identified a demon, it still only counts as one compromise. "
                                There are lots of excellent answers to this question already. I just want to add one more point: demons are ultimately playing a clandestine spy role. They are (nearly( indistinguishable from humans, are perfect liars, and have lots of abilities to confound someone who thinks that they aren't. If your Hunters are killing civilians simply on the suspicion that they might be connected to the supernatural, then they're already monsters themselves. And that means that someone else is probably already hunting them.

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