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Can a sin eater make the bargain from a death be childbirth ’

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  • Can a sin eater make the bargain from a death be childbirth ’

    Also what would a Geist of martanal death be like? Will the child if suseeful born be special

  • #2
    The mother could for sure, if she died during birth. The baby, probably not, but the 1e Geist book talks a lot about being born with a caul and seventh sons of seventh sons, and there's plenty of stories about weird kids who can see dead people. Maybe the ghost powers don't fully kick in until the kid is more aware? I played a Sin-Eater kiddo once and it worked, their life just kinda sucked.

    It would be cool if the Geist took the form of an absent parent, a dark presence that's coldly comforting but isn't really known personally, a shadow of a deceased mother or father. Like a pipe-smoking dad or ominous Other Mother that represents parenthood as an archetype more than an actual person.


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    • #3
      Some times babies survive there mothers death and I find the idea of a mother how love of there child let’s them make a bargain Romantic ,I think that the kid would be touched be the dead

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      • #4
        That will depend on how they spin the metaphysics of The Deal (of which we have only seen glimpses of for 2nd Edition).

        I see a few ways it could play out.

        Scenario 1: In order for The Deal to be made, the potential Bound must know Death. The wisdom that life must eventually end must be present in order for the Deal to be struck. An infant has no such knowledge, and wouldn't have the sense to agree to or even comprehend such an offer. Which is probably for the best, considering what the other possibilities would be...

        Scenario 2: All that is required for The Deal is a desire to Live that burns even after the flesh has technically passed on. In this case, the deal could be made on instinct, and a infant is an almost pure bundle of instincts. How the life of a Bound by Birth would play out would be the question. Consider the Life of a Bound is a struggle between the will of the Bound and the Will of the Geist, there would be very little that would prevent a Geist from completely dominating the child, whose personality hasn't even been truly formed yet. I have a hard time picturing anything other than a dreadful child monster - there potential to develop there own goals, drives, and desires utterly crushed by an otherworldy will.


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        • #5
          That seems like it would be a good angenoist I can see some Geist internally trying to make the bargain witch children because that there personalty aren’t as strong yet to have almost complete control

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Caladriu View Post
            The mother could for sure, if she died during birth. The baby, probably not, but the 1e Geist book talks a lot about being born with a caul and seventh sons of seventh sons, and there's plenty of stories about weird kids who can see dead people. Maybe the ghost powers don't fully kick in until the kid is more aware? I played a Sin-Eater kiddo once and it worked, their life just kinda sucked.

            It would be cool if the Geist took the form of an absent parent, a dark presence that's coldly comforting but isn't really known personally, a shadow of a deceased mother or father. Like a pipe-smoking dad or ominous Other Mother that represents parenthood as an archetype more than an actual person.
            That gives me Beyond Two Souls vibes.

            I played a Sin-eater child who made the bargain when they were six, the Geist is question being their paternal Great-great grand father who was said to haunt/ watch over the family.

            But being a Sin-eater from birth? Imma say no. The soon to be dead infant lacks the cognition to even understand.

            And those people who are saying that the parent could make the bargain, I’d again so no... unless it was an extremely rare portent, even beyond seventh son- of- seventh son bullcrap
            Last edited by Korogra; 03-03-2018, 05:32 PM.

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            • #7
              I was thinking about the MOTHER BECOMING THE SIN EATER

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Konradleijon View Post
                I was thinking about the MOTHER BECOMING THE SIN EATER
                For what it's worth, that's totally the impression I got from your question ^^;; And yes, that would be entirely plausible. Her touch with a Geist affecting the child would be good reasoning for the child having Unseen Sense or one of the other supernatural Merits. As for the mother, I could see her with a La Llorona type of geist, or even a geist with a changeling theme (not the splat, but changelings as shown in mortal mythologies, except here it's the parent who's "replaced"). I could see her miraculous story getting out to the press and giving her a Fame dot or two.

                In order for the baby to survive, the mother would have to either die as it's coming out/after it comes out, or if it's still firmly inside her when she dies, she'd pretty much have to be "resuscitated" [sic] within seconds of her death. I don't know much about deaths during childbirth, but I imagine doctors would be reluctant to use aggressive resuscitation methods if there's a chance of harming the baby before it's out.


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                • #9
                  That seems to be and interesting chronicles dealing with the challges of being a new parent we’ll also being a sin eater

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Chesh View Post

                    In order for the baby to survive, the mother would have to either die as it's coming out/after it comes out, or if it's still firmly inside her when she dies, she'd pretty much have to be "resuscitated" [sic] within seconds of her death. I don't know much about deaths during childbirth, but I imagine doctors would be reluctant to use aggressive resuscitation methods if there's a chance of harming the baby before it's out.
                    Hi, I am a masochist who reads about fatal pregnancy complications for funsies.

                    There are plenty of ways for a pregnant woman to die outside of a hospital -- eclampsia, blood clots, placental abruption, etc. -- in which case, as you say, she'd have to come back awful quick (minutes, though, not seconds) to avoid the fetus suffering a hypoxia injury. (And someone who saved her own life through the Bargain but lost her pregnancy would be interesting in her own right.) On the other hand, perhaps the fetus would be included in the penumbra of the Bargain, allowing the Geist to heal/resurrect it as well as the Bound. For something like a placental abruption, "undoing" the damage would necessarily help both mother and fetus.

                    As for the hospital...There have also been cases where a brain-dead woman was kept of life support for days or even weeks in order to allow her pregnancy to progress to a point where the fetus could be safely delivered. The longer she's on life support, the less likely the baby will come out alive, and more likely it'll be born with serious disabilities, but it's happened. In fact, in some places doctors are actually required to keep a pregnant woman on life support in this fashion even when she had some kind of advanced directive (eg living will) stating otherwise, for the sake of the baby. But 32 weeks is the "official" point of viability, so in any case where the mother is dead/dying and the pregnancy is past that point, doctors would almost certainly perform an emergency C-section rather than trying to revive/save the mother without risking the pregnancy.

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                    • #11
                      Witch will be interesting to doctors if someone who was brain dead and in critical condition wakes up wihile giving birth and is totally healthy!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Konradleijon View Post
                        Witch will be interesting to doctors if someone who was brain dead and in critical condition wakes up wihile giving birth and is totally healthy!
                        Well, that's always been a part of the game. In 1e I remember there being a d-list celebrity who has the cameras follow her as she dies from cancer - then gets better for no particular reason that doctors could see.


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                        • #13
                          Yeah imagine haveing to deal witch a Geist ,baby and noisy doctors papruzzis! Yikes! Also if they are singles mom or married each witch there on challges dealing with your husband/wife who are of course conserned about the fact you where clinical dead and where pregnet.
                          A

                          Sin eater friend (you breast feed I thought you would bottle feed them .sin eater .(a really close and somewhat annoying friend insisted on it
                          And got REALLY anoying tell I just submitted )
                          Last edited by Konradleijon; 03-04-2018, 11:17 AM.

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                          • #14
                            I am actually rather hoping that its possible for Sin Eaters or ghosts to have been such from birth; I can see the reasons against it but I'm rather hoping nothing will rule it out at a minimum.

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                            • #15
                              I would think that, without help, the answer is no. A bargain requires agreement from both parties. An infant couldn't comprehend, let alone agree, to the bargain.

                              On the other hand, who says the bargain always follows the logic of the living? I played a campaign once alongside a player whose character was bound as an infant. His family was a long line of bound who ritualistically passed the same geist from elder to firstborn son after birth using the keystone memento, which was ironically, a ritualistic jade dagger. Elder sacrifices himself, and with his dying breath stabs the infant, allowing the geist to jump over.

                              The books aren't the final word is all I'm saying. Work it out with your ST and see where it goes.

                              It's like Captain Barbosa said - "The code is more what you'd call guidelines than actual rules."

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