Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Balancing Vampires vs. Werewolves in Combat

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by lnodiv View Post
    One thing I'm not sure is included in the hunter only versions is the massive boost to regeneration that the half-wolf warform of werewolves receives. When in this form, splat-werewolves regenerate all bashing & lethal damage at the start of every turn in 2E, making them more durable by default (though specialized vampires can surpass this durability).

    I'll have to take a closer look at the materials you're using and get back to you.

    Using the stats supplied by Hunter itself is absolutely the right call if these are intended to be beatable antagonists.
    I quote Inodiv. In Gauru, werewolves are pretty much inkillable without aggravated damages. But a specialized vampire is even worst.
    Furthermore, normal gauru form last just few turns without going in kuruth, but at that point it's a too big drawback cause he will attack his friends as well.

    Comment


    • #17
      Kuruth will not attack packmates. It will cause kuruth in pack mates. And it has huge benefits to several gifts.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by ArchonAres View Post
        Kuruth will not attack packmates. It will cause kuruth in pack mates. And it has huge benefits to several gifts.
        "When in Basu-Im, a werewolf suffers rage as though in Gauru, but everyone is a victim except other werewolves in Basu-Im. He will happily attack packmates, especially Wolf-Blooded and humans, until they join him or die."

        WtF p. 103


        Bloodline: The Stygians
        Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
        Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by ArchonAres View Post
          Kuruth will not attack packmates. It will cause kuruth in pack mates. And it has huge benefits to several gifts.
          Only other packmates in basu-im would not be attacked but, as far as I know Kuruth isn't a state where a werewolf would happly fall in.

          A werewolf in kuruth in a city......
          Last edited by Marcus; 09-21-2017, 05:26 PM.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Marcus View Post
            Only other packmates in basu-im would not be attacked but, as far as I know Kuruth isn't a state where a werewolf would happly fall in.

            A werewolf in kuruth in a city......
            If the option is death or Kuruth they'd likely choose Kuruth. Plus if another werewolf goes Kuruth or is forced into it, they may not have a choice.

            It's not as if werewolves are defenders of humanity, though. There's a reason hunters hunt them.

            Tessie

            They will attack packmates, but ArchonAres is two-thirds right, Kuruth is pretty infectious.

            'When an Uratha falls to Kuruth, the fire of the hunt rouses his packmates to a frenzy as well. Werewolf packmates within 10 yards who can see or smell the raging werewolf fall into Basu-Im after a turn. Each packmate can attempt to resist with a Resolve + Composure roll, needing one success per character in the scene currently in Kuruth — but he must make this roll every time a packmate falls into Basu-Im.'

            And the free Gifts are great.

            Comment


            • #21
              Tessie Marcus

              Originally posted by The Pack
              Directed Rage (••• to •••••)
              Effect: No matter how much Uratha care for their
              packmates, the risk of Kuruth is always present. Werewolves
              in Basu-Im will tear their packmates limb from limb without
              hesitation, and regret their actions afterwards. Packs with
              this merit have somehow found a way to help their Rage filled
              members direct their anger at foes rather than friends.
              How this works depends on the pack — intense meditation
              and hypnotherapy may work for one, negatively-reinforced
              scent-aversion techniques may work for another.
              At three dots, packmates suffering Wasu-Im act as if they
              were one step closer to Harmony 5 for the purpose of determining
              the time period they may maintain may control. They
              may also spend Willpower to extend this period, but the effect
              diminishes with use — the first Willpower point spent gives
              a period of control based on the character’s true Harmony,
              and each additional Willpower point moves her control a step
              further from Harmony 5.
              Example: Ivy encounters a trigger and enters Wasu-Im. Her
              Harmony is 7, which normally gives her one minute of control.
              With Directed Rage she has five minutes of control, as if she was at
              Harmony 6. After five minutes Ivy is still too close to people she wishes
              to protect; she spends a point of Willpower, gaining an additional
              minute of control, as per Harmony 7. If she spends another point of
              Willpower, she will only gain 30 seconds of control, as per Harmony 8.
              At four dots, characters in Basu-Im may roll Resolve +
              Composure to prioritize attacking non-packmates before pack
              members, even if those packmates are closer, or easier targets.
              At five dots, characters won’t target or pursue packmates as
              long as they’re no threat to the rampaging Gauru, and can
              roll Resolve + Composure each turn to ignore innocents and
              non-combatants while searching for foes to attack.

              Comment


              • #22
                Guess what we bought for our Totem XP.


                Bloodline: The Stygians
                Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
                Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Tessie View Post
                  Guess what we bought for our Totem XP.
                  My totem of Vengeance imparts Patience, Nowhere to Run and Defender.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    2e rules generally amp up the supernaturals' power compared to mortal humans, in my experience. So 2e Hunter will have to account for that somehow. Perhaps the "lite" versions included in the H:tV books will be closer to their 1e incarnations.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Since it looks like there's going to be a lot of 'create your own' tactics presumably it won't be long after it comes out until we see city-wide sunlight bombs, silver nanomachines and poison gases that do Aggravated damage for every point of Mana you have.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Hunters don't take monsters on in fair fights in the first place. They ambush monsters and use their banes against them.

                        You don't attack a werewolf in war form. You distract it, and then run away and come back with silver hunting rifles and shoot the monster from a safe distance.

                        You don't attack a vampire head on. You don't even use moltovs or flare guns unless they're really young/weak - resielence is common enough and can shrug off most easily accessable fire attacks. You stake them. With a crossbow if you're feeling adventurous, or more likely when they sleep. In fact, attacking a vampire head on tends to involve a few things happening rather than a fight - Majesty/Dominate/Nightmare/Animalism go off and now you're mind controlled and fight over or Obfuscate / Celerity / Protean comes into play and you can't find the vampire to attack.


                        A good hunter will know that attacking either of these supernaturals head on without a solid plan is a good way to end the vigil - either through death-by-werewolf, or as a vampire's new plaything.



                        Back in 1e, I remember once someone told me they could make a hunter that could stand toe-to-toe with a raging werewolf. So, they got an Aegis-Kai-Doru with several custom relics and fighting styles (lots of xp), and set up a white room brawl with a baby werewolf Ithaeur with abilities devoted to being a shaman, not a warrior. And, even then, the white-room combat ended up as a 50-50 shot with the Ithaeur hamstringing the hunter. Others commented that the shaman could have gone wolf form, ran away, and then summoned a spirit to kill the hunter too. And this was in 1e, when fighting styles were godly and before werewolves got a massive power boost, and lopsided xp gifts.

                        And then, someone jokingly made a TFV starting level character, and killed an experienced NPC werewolf (I think it was Roman) using the anit-shapeshifting grenade and regular gun using silver bullets. Tactics and banes are your friend as a Hunter, the great equalizers. Without them, the hunter loses. With them? They live to fight another day. Night. Whatever.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by MCN View Post
                          Hunters don't take monsters on in fair fights in the first place. They ambush monsters and use their banes against them.

                          You don't attack a werewolf in war form. You distract it, and then run away and come back with silver hunting rifles and shoot the monster from a safe distance.

                          You don't attack a vampire head on. You don't even use moltovs or flare guns unless they're really young/weak - resielence is common enough and can shrug off most easily accessable fire attacks. You stake them. With a crossbow if you're feeling adventurous, or more likely when they sleep. In fact, attacking a vampire head on tends to involve a few things happening rather than a fight - Majesty/Dominate/Nightmare/Animalism go off and now you're mind controlled and fight over or Obfuscate / Celerity / Protean comes into play and you can't find the vampire to attack.


                          A good hunter will know that attacking either of these supernaturals head on without a solid plan is a good way to end the vigil - either through death-by-werewolf, or as a vampire's new plaything.



                          Back in 1e, I remember once someone told me they could make a hunter that could stand toe-to-toe with a raging werewolf. So, they got an Aegis-Kai-Doru with several custom relics and fighting styles (lots of xp), and set up a white room brawl with a baby werewolf Ithaeur with abilities devoted to being a shaman, not a warrior. And, even then, the white-room combat ended up as a 50-50 shot with the Ithaeur hamstringing the hunter. Others commented that the shaman could have gone wolf form, ran away, and then summoned a spirit to kill the hunter too. And this was in 1e, when fighting styles were godly and before werewolves got a massive power boost, and lopsided xp gifts.

                          And then, someone jokingly made a TFV starting level character, and killed an experienced NPC werewolf (I think it was Roman) using the anit-shapeshifting grenade and regular gun using silver bullets. Tactics and banes are your friend as a Hunter, the great equalizers. Without them, the hunter loses. With them? They live to fight another day. Night. Whatever.
                          Oh, I know that. If my boys and girls come after a werewolf head on, they're going to expect to get shredded.

                          I was more just interested that, from a surface perspective at least, vampires actually seem more durable than werewolves, at least according to the simplified Hunter conversion systems. But that appears to not be the case after all.

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X