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The Cainites playstyle

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  • The Cainites playstyle

    As y'all know, cainites must use 3 willpower against non-undead for endowments, and I'm just wondering how y'all see this. i understand that their endowments are very good and lore wise make sense they are basically anathema to undead. However 3 willpower points is quite a lot as we all know. Are yall ok with this, especially when yall do mixed groups

    Personally, I'm fine with these rules as conspiracies for these supplements are supposed to be specialized, but my storyteller has been thinking about running a separate game of just cainites, as he does not know how he can make it feel fair when you are fighting werewolves and have the cainite have only 7 willpower go to 4 with a single move

  • #2
    Have them learn variant (possibly heretical, even if that exact label might not be appropriate here) Rites that are fully effective against Spirits (and get the tax against non-spirits).


    Malkydel: "And the Machine dictated; let there be adequate illumination."
    Yossarian: "And lo, it was optimal."

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    • #3
      You have a buncha options, depending on what exactly it is you want to do.

      1. In game R&D has some rules in the Hunter core, no reason they can't be used for the Cainites too. It is described as usually coming from the Sources, which can be an easy excuse to have quick access to new ones. You can make up your own, including choosing the targeted group. If you feel like it, you could also try out the new Endowment making rules from the playtest. If you want more IC development, you could always have a series of letters who's instructions they have to follow before getting the new endowment.

      2. "You have no power over me sidebar!", just ignore the rule. You can change up the rituals as a handwave if you want (for Werewolves, add silver flakes and wolfsbane to the blood) and have it work on whoever you feel like. If the group is entirely made up of Cainites anyway, it isn't like you are going to overshadow the other players.

      3. Demoted to conspiracy. Who needs fancy endowments to kill some wolves? Keeping the three WP dot cost for non-Vampires, giving you a harder game. Hunters who invested in their endowment would be slightly weaker, but if all the players know what the game is going to be going into it they can design them with that in mind.

      4. Have the players fight vampires near exclusively. If everyone is playing the vampire-obsessed vampire-focused conspiracy, it makes sense that they would be fighting vampires most of the time. So throw vampires at them instead of Werewolves, with the occasional supernatural alley or minion showing up to help if you want to mix things up.

      In the end, you just have to think of what you want from the group. What do you like about it, and how to best bring that out? If a group of Cainites is fighting a werewolf pack, why did the ST send them instead of vampires? If he wanted to make it a harder fight, then 3 would be the most logical option. If he just likes wolves more than vampires and wants to use them, 2 might be the best option. If he just picked an enemy with his eyes closed, he might reconsider and say that they are actually just Vampires with shape-shifting powers in a variant on 4. If you like the group but arn't crazy about the vampire focus, you can just drop it. If you don't mind the vampire focus, it would be easier to work with it.

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      • #4
        The question is- if you have a mainly Cainte cell, that is, why would a ST throw werewolves on them in the first place?

        Cainte hunters work following their Sources in order to hunt after vampires. They are specialized at hunting the dead. If you have an all Cainte cell, the chances your players want to hunt after vampires. Werewolves simply don't interest them. Sure, a ST could pull off "surprise, it's a werewolf!", and it could work from time to time, but if I'm playing a Cainte, then it is because I want to kill dead things, and I expect my ST to consider it- and in a case of a mixed cell, that my other cell mates would help me at my disadvantages, when I'll help them with theirs.

        In short, the way I see it, it is a feature, not a bug. You could always, of course, use the Red Rites (that is, the Ave Minerva's version of the Endowment in Paterfamilias), but working around your limitations is one of the things hunters should do, no matter what organization they belong to.


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        "And all our knowledge is, Ourselves to know"- An Essay on Man

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        • #5
          Thanks for the options guys. Speaking of R&D, do y'all have any idea on interactive versions, like the options given for the conspiracies in the core book? Also Ruger saying they add silver flakes and wolfsbane is a nice touch

          Just saw your post LostLight. Personally I agree completely, it's my storyteller who has trouble seeing how a mixed hunter group could go while having a good ratio of fighting undead and other monsters
          Last edited by Primordial newcomer; 09-08-2018, 08:55 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Primordial newcomer View Post
            Thanks for the options guys. Speaking of R&D, do y'all have any idea on interactive versions, like the options given for the conspiracies in the core book? Also Ruger saying they add silver flakes and wolfsbane is a nice touch

            Just saw your post LostLight. Personally I agree completely, it's my storyteller who has trouble seeing how a mixed hunter group could go while having a good ratio of fighting undead and other monsters
            Like I said, it would probably involve the Sources sending some kind of "quest" through their letters. They usually have their endowment handed to them, so it ends up being harder to have players involved in getting new ones.

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            • #7
              Good point, all it mentions of new endowments is that they shouldn't really be able to happen, but they always end up learning new rites of denial somehow.

              Perhaps I can just have the cainites try to convince the source somehow lol

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