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A Possible Change To The Lucifuge.

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  • #46
    Originally posted by proindrakenzol View Post

    I have not read C&C and am somewhat loath to buy it considering 2e is somewhere on the horizon. Is it worth purchasing, anyway, and/or can you summarize "The Ancient Vow Made Manifest"?
    C&C is really awesome- it expands each of the core groups, giving some new plot hooks and optional mechanics to each of those. The AKD's expansion is really good, but it also has fun things about the Lucifuge and the others, and I personally really like the Ashwood Abbey's presentation as a pyramid scheme. The only reason I;m wary of telling you "go get it RIGHT NOW" is because we don't know how different the core groups will be in the new edition than how they are right now. I assume there will be some changes, but I hope there will be nothing too drastic.


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    • #47
      Originally posted by Borne View Post
      As someone with transhumanist leanings, I do not like the idea of a transhumanist Lucifuge. Before, they were about struggling to overcome what they were born into, and standing up for humankind; this seems to shift them towards "I am better because I was born better" powerfantasy. The ideal of transhumanism is lifting up oneself and others to overcome the frailties of what evolution gave us; being granted innately superior powers from birth, by circumstances outside your control, is the inverse of that. It is the aristocracy to transhumanism's meritocracy. What's more, the Lucifuges' humility, bordering on self-hatred, is what kept them from becoming superhero cliches. Hunter is about the worth of human life, and defending that candle against those that would snuff it out. Making a group about "being born better than humans, and getting more better" spits on that.
      You assume the Lucifuge are still Lucifuge by birth, instead of choice. From the Contagion Chronicles for example, it seems more based in a philosophy then bloodline.
      Last edited by Omegaphallic; 05-09-2019, 03:26 PM.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Omegaphallic View Post

        You assume the Lucifuge are still Lucifuge by birth, instead of choice. From the Contagion Chronicles for example, it seems more based in a philosophy then bloodline.
        Do you mean "choosing to be Lucifuge" as "choosing the Vigil", or "being a Lucifuge" by "having hellish powers"? Because if it is the former, that's the situation more or less right now (even though the Lady leaves little choice between "join" and "die"). If the later, well.. being the literal son of a devil is such a core part of the Lucifuge's identity that it is hard for me to imagine it changed into just something that you join, considering the backlash it would probably create with the fans- not to mention the vast inconsistency it would do with the already 2e published material and that it would invalid so much of the former setting. Not to mention that from the playtests which featured the Lucifuge nothing seems to suggest a change in that direction.

        I mean, other than Geist, most of the 2e revisions didn't changed the very nature of the splats to that level, and as Hunter 2e is written by people who probably love the line, I doubt it will happen here.


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        • #49
          Originally posted by LostLight View Post
          Do you mean "choosing to be Lucifuge" as "choosing the Vigil", or "being a Lucifuge" by "having hellish powers"? Because if it is the former, that's the situation more or less right now (even though the Lady leaves little choice between "join" and "die"). If the later, well.. being the literal son of a devil is such a core part of the Lucifuge's identity that it is hard for me to imagine it changed into just something that you join, considering the backlash it would probably create with the fans- not to mention the vast inconsistency it would do with the already 2e published material and that it would invalid so much of the former setting. Not to mention that from the playtests which featured the Lucifuge nothing seems to suggest a change in that direction.

          I mean, other than Geist, most of the 2e revisions didn't changed the very nature of the splats to that level, and as Hunter 2e is written by people who probably love the line, I doubt it will happen here.
          I remember what he was talking about from the playtest. Bringing it up, the "Cassidy Tate" character was used as an example of a character with zero dots in status but dots in the Endowment since the powers are something you are born with, as an example of a conspiracy where you can have more endowments then you do dots in status. The character herself was still a member without the status dot, so they are probably definitely keeping both the "You're born with it" and "Join or Die". There has been non-Lucifuge demonspawn who can use some of their powers, and they have been stated since Inferno.

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          • #50
            Actually, they have been stated even before Inferno (unless you mean mechanically, and even then Inferno doesn't really give a solid system other than general guidelines, and you could always use Castigations to model them). Non Lucifuge 7th Generations have been stated since the core, right at the Enemy section, together with a conspiracy theory about the subject. Inferno just developed the idea into the L'Enfant Diabolique.


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            • #51
              Originally posted by LostLight View Post
              Actually, they have been stated even before Inferno (unless you mean mechanically, and even then Inferno doesn't really give a solid system other than general guidelines, and you could always use Castigations to model them). Non Lucifuge 7th Generations have been stated since the core, right at the Enemy section, together with a conspiracy theory about the subject. Inferno just developed the idea into the L'Enfant Diabolique.
              I meant that as "stat-ed", as much as anything else gets stat-ed in this series. Point is it was always a combination between having the powers and joining the group.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Ruger View Post

                I meant that as "stat-ed", as much as anything else gets stat-ed in this series. Point is it was always a combination between having the powers and joining the group.
                The word you're looking for is "statted" with two "t"s.


                Mentats - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Mind/Forces) built around being a human computer; Thaumatech Engineers - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Matter/Prime) focusing on the creation of Imbued items and the enhancement of Sleeper technology

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by proindrakenzol View Post

                  The word you're looking for is "statted" with two "t"s.
                  🤦

                  Go easy on me. The forum's spellcheck tells me it isn't a real word!

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Ruger View Post

                    🤦

                    Go easy on me. The forum's spellcheck tells me it isn't a real word!
                    That's because the way you're using the word "stat" (i.e. as a verb) is a slang term, so the past participle of the slang term is also a slang term, and therefore isn't in all dictionaries (especially one as lackluster as this forum's).

                    Isn't English fun?


                    Mentats - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Mind/Forces) built around being a human computer; Thaumatech Engineers - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Matter/Prime) focusing on the creation of Imbued items and the enhancement of Sleeper technology

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Omegaphallic View Post

                      You assume the Lucifuge are still Lucifuge by birth, instead of choice. From the Contagion Chronicles for example, it seems more based in a philosophy then bloodline.
                      I wasn't referring to membership in the group, but rather the source of their powers.

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                      • #56
                        I've always thought castigation was a power that only born lucifuge (demon spawn whatever we call them) could use once taught. At the very least it would make sense that for them to have an easier time using castigations than people not born with demonic blood

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                        • #57
                          Since 1e I've been of the opinion that The Lucifuge needed to be something akin to the merit based templates from Hurt Locker, honestly as someone who's only read the core hunter book I felt there was too much content and wasn't enough to space (maybe time) to do justification to them all AKD is I believe one of the conspiracies that I felt needed a bit more work but I'm not sure what I wanted at the time. 2nd ed seems to be improving on first so I'm hopeful.

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