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Art of Witch Hunting [HtV perspective]

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  • wyrdhamster
    started a topic Art of Witch Hunting [HtV perspective]

    Art of Witch Hunting [HtV perspective]

    I run game of Mage and consider to use the witch hunters as antagonists to mine 6 PCs Awakened cabal - conspiracies of Division Six and Malleus Maleficarumspecificlly. I tired asking on Mage forum, but there consensus is that Sleepers ( "normal" hunters ) could not do much to mages without a very large outnumbering the PCs and massive firepower - at least from Mage line perspective.

    But I hope that maybe on Hunter forum some good soul will have idea or information on sucessful tactics for Sleepers to put down group of few reality changing individuals. Maybe very dirty tricks that most hunters would not use in normal circumstances?

  • Lord Jub-Jub
    replied
    Give those sleepers the Liar and that group sleeper merit from Mage 2e and they'll exaggerate paradox even more.

    Edit: and True sight can be cast on them if need be.
    Last edited by Lord Jub-Jub; 03-12-2017, 02:32 PM. Reason: Added information.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Thinking more on the topic of 'witch killing bullets' - There is no reason why Mage Armour bypassing Endowment cannot bypass also risen Defense. If Werewolves can have ability to use Defense in firearms, Conspiracies can have Endowment that bypass Defense in the first place, in the firearms combat also.

    And I run with idea that any Conspiracy member with 'inner' Endowment on him, is treated as Sleepwalker in the first place - that means that fully initiated Knights of Saint George, Malleus Maleficarum and Lucifuge are all treated Sleepwalkers for Supernal Magic. Still, Conspiracy use not fully initiated members ( those without special Endowments ) as 'Sleepers Cannon Folder' - best cell tactics is to have mixed party with high ranking 'Endowment casting' leader and few 'ground level' Sleeper hunters. Automatic and rising Paradox in combat quickly make Awakened sweat.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 03-12-2017, 05:21 AM.

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  • Lord Jub-Jub
    replied
    If you were using Aegis Kai Doru I could show off my "Thieve's Shroud" Homebrew relic to protect against scrying and Fate/Time magic. Get a bunch of Guardians with Eyes of Hubris, make the penalty stack and them being around Mages makes magic harder to cast. Status 5 in Aegis Kai Doru gives you unseen senses for either Mages or Werewolves which makes you a sleepwalker by default so you don't have to worry about the Sleeping Curse. Aegis Talismans provide some protection from magic, you could houserule that the Doru Talisman can penetrate shielding magic but that might be a bit too much. I would also say for the MM that the "True Sight Of St. Abel" benediction should protect them from the sleeping curse of you don't rule them as sleepwalkers already. "Casting Out Of The Snakes"(I think it's called) would be helpful too.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    On last Supernatural episode was great idea of 'witch killing bullets' - it just remind me about my Mage Shield Breaker Endowment. Consecrate with this your bullets, bypass Awakened Mage Armor all together, and you have nice dead witches!

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Watched today great film on topic - Last Witch Hunter with Vin Diesel - and it's greatly show complex relations between Hunter Conspiracies and Mage Consilium. It's really interesting how Malleus Maleficarum ( as Axe and Cross in movie ) can police, but also be clearly antagonistic to witches - I'm stealing whole idea to my games. Seeing how plot unfold in my play, I can clearly see the MM coming to some Consilia that do not grip their problems together and say "If you do not solve it yourself, we will come and resole this - with you on stakes".



    As to technical matter how Witch Hunters hunt the witches? They use magic.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    I made new Endowment to talk about and making restraining witches possible.

    Magic Warding

    When Hunters get the witch in the confinement of the Safehouse, they need to make sure he will not leave it. Or that magic from the outside will interfere with they safety. This Endowment make sure that spells will be outside of area or locked inside. When used on item touching the witch, it can even locked here magic inside. Using this Endowment needs marking the warded territory or item with symbols of some kind – destroying the markings, ends the effect immediately.

    Cost: 1 Willpower.

    Action: Extended; each roll represents one minute of marking area or item with symbols. The Endowment may be “rushed,” reducing the time per roll to one turn at the cost of incurring a -1 penalty on the roll. If used on the area, hunter must roll a number of successes equal to the number of square yards the blessing’s protection encompasses. If using it on the item he must accumulate items Size in successes,

    Dice Pool: Resolve + Endowment Merit

    Dramatic Failure: Warded area or item empower magic, not diminish it. Every power used on the target of Endowment gets Endowments Merit bonus to the spellcasting rolls.

    Failure: No progress is made toward warding the area.

    Success: The character makes progress toward warding the area or item from magic.

    Exceptional Success: Penalty to active magic in area or by the character touching item is thre times Endowment Merit.

    At successful usage of Endowment, warded area or item touching witch gives her penalty equal twice the Endowment Merit to all spellcasting and magic activation rolls.

    Suggested Modifiers
    +2 Item or area are connected to the idea of restrain – like shackles, prison cell or chain.

    Variants Example: Consecrate shackles marked with cross on inside ( Benedictions )

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Here are the new mechanics I work for my real Witch Hunters – those that fight the Awakened characters. I hope you like them and that I look forward for all your comments.

    New Conditions

    Key to fighting with witches is to not let her use magic. Character with Unfocused has problem with concentrate enough to cast spells in her mind – and by this, form any Imago. She could be drugged, mentally shattered by the events on her personal life or any other reason she cannot focus enough. Effect is the same – witch is powerless without her magic.

    Unfocused
    Prequistion: Mage
    Your character cannot think clearly and by this cast spells as long as the source of this Condition is not resolved. Until then any action of spellcasting is treated as Failure. If character still insist on this, she can spend Willpower point and roll the Chance Roll – however, all spells cast in this state are treated as vulgar magic and trigger Paradox Rolls.

    Possible Sources: Intoxination. Life shattering events, like close ones in real danger or seeing them dead.

    Resolution: The source of the Condition leaves your body or mind and she can focus on her spells once more.

    Beat: Your character takes an action that highlight her focus problems with magic.

    Witch Hunters Endowments

    Those new mechanics are templates for the new Endowments. Almost all Conspiracies have variants of this powers as the tech ( like Advanced Armory of TFV ), relics ( like Aegis Kai Doru ) or innate powers ( like Malleus Maleficarum or Lucifuge ), as they are central to hunting witches. If you got cool names for them in Conspiracies, do not hesitate to write them below.

    Notice: When text mentions Endowment Merit it means this particular characters support from the Conspiracy- like Benediction, Advanced Armory, Relics and a like ratings.

    Sympathy Dummy

    To make successful hunt and using other Endowments, hunter need to be able to resist witches spell. At least once, so he could take his strike on her. This Endowment is making some item on the hunter taking spells on to itself, instead of the hunter by the Law of Sympathy – or other magical nonsense like this. Most of the time, magic will do nothing to the Dummy, as it was not the part of Imago for spell.

    Cost: 1 Willpower - Automatic

    Action: None

    Mechanics: Sympathy Dummy automatically takes each casted spell on the user, up to number of Endowment Merit’s points in the scene. Each next magic goes straight on the hunter.

    Variants Example: Voodoo Doll ( Relics ), Consecrated Cross ( Benedictions )

    Mage Shield Breaker

    One of largest problems when facing witches – beside their using of spells – is that they are covered in mystical armors, like “thick air” or the luck is always guiding bullets away from it. This Endowment take out this advantage. Using this Endowment needs the direct contact the source of it with the witch ( item in case of tech or relics, hunter himself in case of innate powers ).

    Cost: 1 Willpower

    Action: Instant, Touch

    Dice Pool: Resolve + Endowment Merit contested with targets Stamina + Gnosis (if have )

    Roll Results

    Dramatic Failure: Instead of taking of witches mystical armor, the hunter is exposed. He lose the number of Armor points equal to this Endowment Merit for the next scene.

    Failure: Nothing happens

    Success: Witch lose the advantages from her Mage Armor and cannot invoke any other till the end of scene.

    Exceptional Success: As with success, but witch gets also Unfocused Condition.

    Suggested Modifiers
    +2 Hunter using the Endowment in the ways that simulates breaking the shield with weapon – like pricing “thick air” around the witch.

    Variants Example: Magic Stealing Rod ( Relics ), Arm of Banisher ( Taumatechnology )
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-09-2015, 02:42 AM.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Watching Bloodlines Society of Leopold I saw it could work better as Witch's Hammer chapter HQ idea - basiclly, it's monastery with vast cave system underneath it.

    Still, for modern London game lone monaster could be just to far from action setting. I think I will probably go with the Catholic Boarding School that has large catacombs underneath in that Malleus made their "confession chambers", on the corpses of the martyrs buried there.

    Originally posted by Michael View Post
    The offer to let Anglicans join the Roman Catholic church kinda requires the people in question to really care about the dogmatic elements of their religion, which I'd wager most don't.
    But the proposed Malleus Maleficarum new converts from 2009 apostole constitution would matter on this divide. They were all lifr Anglicans, but seeing just how Church of England "gone soft" with gay marriages and womens priesthood, they come back to the Pope. I can now envision character that were loyal Anglican all the life and then confronted with monsters thought - "Maybe Catholics had this right? We can officially be one." And character joins Shadow Congregation here, insted of original English groups.

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  • Michael
    replied
    Does not this days a lot of once Anglicans are officially the Catholics?
    Not really, though it's difficult to quantify because Britain generally has a very lax religious culture and the Anglican church is a part of the state. A huge percentage of people get baptised or married in churches (of which the majoirty of the nice old ones you'd want for your wedding are anglican), but they don't necessarily go to church regularly or believe in Anglican theology.

    The offer to let Anglicans join the Roman Catholic church kinda requires the people in question to really care about the dogmatic elements of their religion, which I'd wager most don't.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
    Question is - how will typical Hammer's chapter look like? Is this more like "secret base under the church"? Or maybe like Society of Leopold headquaters in Vampire: The Masquared's video games?
    Rewatching the Redemption's Society of Leopold Headquaters in London I feel they would not work with nowadays Mallus Maleficarum. ( But could work as Null Mysteriies site, probably ). In game, most of the site is basiclly the reaserch facility and Witch's Hammer is more cult-like organisation, devoted in "conversion or die" scenarios more ( or at least it's how they are porteyed in Hunter ). Much less lab workers ( and probably non on site ), much more "confesions room" ( torture chamber, really ). Am I getting good vibe of Modus Operandi of Shadow Congragation?

    Originally posted by Michael View Post
    I'd say there isn't much difference really between American views of it and those in Britain. It's not exactly a niche organisation, if you have a settlement with a big enough population for multiple congregations, one of them is almost certainly going to be Catholic; a lot of them rent out Anglican church on certain days.
    Does not this days a lot of once Anglicans are officially the Catholics?
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-08-2015, 05:38 PM.

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  • Michael
    replied
    It's probably about the same as the Eastern Orthodox Church is thought of in America.
    I'd say there isn't much difference really between American views of it and those in Britain. It's not exactly a niche organisation, if you have a settlement with a big enough population for multiple congregations, one of them is almost certainly going to be Catholic; a lot of them rent out Anglican church on certain days. Add to that, Catholic schools aren't exactly uncommon. I'd say the major differences in Catholicism between America and the UK are really the same as the wider differences in religious culture.

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  • The Kings Raven
    replied

    Originally posted by Flyboy254 View Post
    A bunch of asshole aristocrats who do as they please with the lives and bodies of others? That's not "very" British, that's quintessential British.
    Hey!

    You loud, poorly edcuated, gun nut yankie! ;p

    Originally posted by Flyboy254 View Post
    Well, I'm not sure how the Catholic Church is viewed in England
    Mostly we don't think of it that much. It's probably about the same as the Eastern Orthodox Church is thought of in America.

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  • Flyboy254
    replied
    Well, I'm not sure how the Catholic Church is viewed in England, but the main part of the Malleus in the modern day is simple; the laity (non-clergy Catholics) are the vital lifeline of the Malleus. So while you can certainly set their safehouse in the church or rectory basement, they also might have their gear stashed nearby in a member's small business or an abandoned school still owned by the Church. The primary issue is plausible deniability. When you have Catholic priests storing up shotguns, there's suspicion. When you have a local Catholic storing up shotguns, well the Church certainly has no idea about such things, no sir.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Reading more Witch Finders, I assume that Hammer on Witches(MM) want the "confessions" from characters. So they would point to the taking unconciess/dead to they chapter hous in London (taking the heal magic of MM in account ).

    Question is - how will typical Hammer's chapter look like? Is this more like "secret base under the church"? Or maybe like Society of Leopold headquaters in Vampire: The Masquared's video games?

    Redemption:


    Bloodlines:


    If not - How Hammer's bases would be different?

    Originally posted by Flyboy254 View Post
    1: Division Six
    While Division Six is originally written as unwitting pawns of the Seers Panopticon, you could easily switch it around and say that they're deniable assets of another conspiracy. They have no real way to stand up in a direct fight, but Division Six is instead to be treated as a sidewinder of a compact; they know that they can't fight one-on-one, even one-on-ten. They're noted as being more willing to use booby traps, sniper rifles, methods that a mage needs to be paranoid about but, unless they're really good at detecting the future, can never truly be prepared for. Division Six is also probably the best way to use the threat of attacks on family and friends.
    In my game London is very heavily Panopticon influanced - did you see how many CCTV there is in this city? I imagine Division Six could start as American thing in 70's, but after being connected with Abstergo Industries - multinational company that is front for the Knights Templars Methodolgy of Seers - they will become global arms devision of Abstergo to take care of "reality deviants". Only the best security or ex-merancyr contractors join this to take care of most troublsome of "problems" (i.e. Pentacle witches ) for the company.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-08-2015, 10:10 AM.

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