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  • Johnny Awesome
    started a topic Wards

    Wards

    So long-lasting Wards seem pretty effective now.

    +5 dice for an indefinite Ward with advanced potency seems pretty good to me at first glance:

    A beginning Mastigos could have Space 3 + Gnosis 1 + 5 = 9 dice

    A Master of Space with Gnosis 5 would have 10 dice.

    So there's definitely a bias toward defense.

    Anyone have any experience with using Wards in 2e they'd like to share?

  • Mrmdubois
    replied
    Originally posted by Falcon777 View Post
    Ok, I'm confused: how does increasing duration give bonuses to clash of wills?
    Page 118 bottom of the first paragraph.

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  • Errol216
    replied
    Originally posted by Falcon777 View Post

    Ok, I'm confused: how does increasing duration give bonuses to clash of wills?
    Page 118, top left. Basically, Advanced Duration spell factors give you more dice in a Clash contest, and the rules for Duration spell factors (p113, top right) indicate that even immediate-effect spells can have Duration.

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  • Falcon777
    replied
    Originally posted by WHW View Post
    Not really? You check what is the Duration of the clashing spells, give dice bonuses based on that, and that's all.
    Though it makes offensive casters have to split their dicepool between Duration and Potency.
    Ok, I'm confused: how does increasing duration give bonuses to clash of wills?

    Leave a comment:


  • nofather
    replied
    My players, more used to Requiem, are constantly expressing surprise at how different the mood is in between mages, then remarking on how it has to be, since it's so easy to kill each other.

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  • Mrmdubois
    replied
    Obviously. It's also for story consideration. An absolute defense isn't very interesting.

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  • Johnny Awesome
    replied
    I supposed on further reflection that it's by design that a determined assault can get through defenses. You wouldn't have a "cold war" Mage atmosphere if defenses were too strong.

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  • Satchel
    replied
    Originally posted by WHW View Post
    Here is a biggest deal, though: Dispelling Magic is ridiculously easy. As long as you have access to at least one dot of each Arcanum that was used to cast the spell, you pretty much can dispel any spell. How? Get a Praxis in Dispel Magic, accumulate ~10 dice, and just fish for a Exceptional Success. It will allow you to bypass Withstand, so it doesn't matter if it's a novice spell or master spell - it's gone.
    Mind you, the most viable means of having this produce a worthwhile result is to get the spell as a rote, which is mutually incompatible with the effects of a Praxis — both the dispellation spells are Potency-primary and suppression-oriented in their base effects, and getting around that costs Mana that you won't be getting back if you choose to circumvent Withstand.

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  • EvilSqueegee
    replied
    Originally posted by WHW View Post
    Here is a biggest deal, though: Dispelling Magic is ridiculously easy. As long as you have access to at least one dot of each Arcanum that was used to cast the spell, you pretty much can dispel any spell. How? Get a Praxis in Dispel Magic, accumulate ~10 dice, and just fish for a Exceptional Success. It will allow you to bypass Withstand, so it doesn't matter if it's a novice spell or master spell - it's gone.
    I am really disappointed in myself for not noticing this...

    Leave a comment:


  • nofather
    replied
    Also a drawback is it provides little-to-no defense against indirect magic. A Mastigos will have a harder time directly affecting your mind, but can still make a mob obsessed with attacking you, or opening a portal above you to a boulder-filled ravine.

    I always thought people resorted to indirect damage out of Ascension and held that tendency over to Awakening, but it doesn't seem to ever be brought up.

    Leave a comment:


  • WHW
    replied
    Here is a biggest deal, though: Dispelling Magic is ridiculously easy. As long as you have access to at least one dot of each Arcanum that was used to cast the spell, you pretty much can dispel any spell. How? Get a Praxis in Dispel Magic, accumulate ~10 dice, and just fish for a Exceptional Success. It will allow you to bypass Withstand, so it doesn't matter if it's a novice spell or master spell - it's gone.

    Leave a comment:


  • WHW
    replied
    There still can be BUT MY WARD moments. Get your party together once per month in a Demesne, spend all reach you need to make your defensive spells multiperson, and enjoy cabals that are prowling around with Withstand ~8 (Wards and Signs, multiple sources of Withstand probably too) and tons of long duration Clash of Will based defences. Your typical cabal will have 3-4 people; assuming that they are willing to invest one spell into Party Defence Project, you have at least 4 defensive spells running 24/7 on the whole party. At Gnosis 3, you can safely dedicate 2 slots to this, *and* make them combined spells. This will result in around 16 buffs floating around. There is, honestly, no particular reason to not do this and it seems like one of biggest draws towards being a Cabal member - having shielding measures from Arcana outside your own spread.
    Funniest thing, if one of these 16 spells is Suppress Aura, you won't even look like a Christmas Tree to magic sight.

    It isn't a perfect defense, but not a lot of people will be able to cast spells that can contest both ridiculous Withstand and pierce maximized Clash of Will reliably at the same time. In many cases, it will boil down to Clash of Will, and chances are Potency that was left in the spell won't be strong enough to do you that much harm.

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  • Axelgear
    replied
    CofD in general has always favoured offense. You can tweak that somewhat with houserules but, overall, a determined opponent can triumph over a passive defense.

    This is probably for the best, though; if it were otherwise, avenues for both players and STs would be cut off because of fairly absolute "But my Ward!" moments.

    Leave a comment:


  • Johnny Awesome
    replied
    So it seems that my original premise is flawed: That the system favors defense. It really favors offense, from what I'm hearing.

    Wards don't seem very effective.

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  • Errol216
    replied
    Originally posted by Mrmdubois View Post
    Gnosis Ritual Interval, at most he'd be teleported back once a minute. Also, distance is an illusion, he could theoretically appear anywhere he needs to while sustaining such an effect.
    The quote is, "Distance is a Lie."

    My favorite part of that quote is that it refers equally well to metaphorical distances, like the emotional distance between two people, or the distance you have to go to learn a new language.

    You want horror? Imagine "teleporting" across emotional distances once a minute. For a year.

    Leave a comment:

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