Active Mage Sight Question

[shkspr1048]

When the core book gives examples of using concealing magic against Active Mage Sight (P.92), where it mentions a clause allowing an Arcanum using the same "magical principles" as a concealing power a chance to see through said power, it says "a light-based invisibility spell would conceal a target from Mind Sight, but Life Sight could still detect the living being, with or without the assistance of photons". Now, this confuses me, because how does Life Sight use the same principles as a light-manipulating spell? Is this a typo, or am I just missing something? And if so, can someone please explain it to me?

[Zombiecakes]

It just means that the method to find a subject hidden by a Veiling Practice can be achieved through different Sights, the principle of Revealing That Which Is Hidden.

[Moinen]

Sometimes I feel that the writers were confused by their own rules. Other then that they are briliant. I'd allow for both sights to reaveal the target.
Also the sight doesn't need to operate on this same principle as veiling. If you veil light your life signs are not veiled, your mind is not veiled and your clothes are not veiled. Sights are metaphysical and can see those things with a little CoW.

[HardcoreHannes]

It is actually a little bit confusing, but gets more clear in the "system" section, following the quoted paragraph. Especially the part with Mind is a bit confusing.

You got three different kinds of interaction from different mage sights with any kind of concealing power: not interacting, clashing and circumventing.
Some examples:
Trevor has the mentioned invisibility power/spell, which interacts with the photons he is reflecting. Space Sight wouldn't help at all and he just stays invisible. Forces Sight works on the same principle and would clash with the power. Life Sight circumvents the power, the detection of life signs isn't influenced by the power, so Life Sight works as if no veiling power would be used at all. No clash needed here. Mind Sight would work "kind of", I think. With Mind Sight you would register, that there is a thinking mind present, but you would not be able to actually determin the form of the body connected to that mind. So while Life Sight reveals the form of Trevor, Mind Sight just reveals the present of a thinking beeing, but the body would still stay invisible to your senses.

The second power mentioned in the book basically influences the mind of the subject to ignor the user. Here, I think, Mind Sight would provoke a Clash of Wills, while all other Mage Sights would just fail. No matter how much additional sensory information you get, you are still convinced that there is no information concerning the user of the power and just ignor it. If the power is Awakened Magic, you might have a shot with Prime Sight to at least notice that something is at work.

Lets use a third example. Trevor uses Life and Matter to transform himself into a rock with an execptional succes and then veiles the spell with Prime. Without a clash, Fate Sight registers, that the rock just happend to have an exceptionally successful event, which might strike the Sight user as kind of odd for a rock. Prime Sight would clash with the veiling spell and if successful reveil that awakened magic is at work. Death, Mind and Life would work without a clash and reveil that the rock has a soul, a mind and life signs respectively, which is pretty odd for a rock. But none of the Mage Sights would actually reveil the actual form of Trevor.

[Flinty]

Hasn't it been very clearly mentioned somewhere that mage sight only works on that which you perceive? Forces sight would allow you perceive the unusual behaviour of photons, thus allow for a clash. Life or Mind sight would not see the life form (that contains the mind) and thus reveal nothing. Now a Life 1 or Mind 1 knowing spell to detect Lifeforms/Minds in the area of effect would however work, not even needing a clash. Life 'sight' might also tell you that it was a living being that produces a sound if the veiled target makes an audible noise.

[Justin Sane]

I'm also confused a bit between the things Mage Sight can pick up and what needs an Unveiling.

[Mrmdubois]

I'm also confused a bit between the things Mage Sight can pick up and what needs an Unveiling.

Mage Sight can generally pierce any level of supernatural concealment. Unveiling allows for a much more specific ability to do so without the risks or costs of Mage Sight, but also without the exhaustive level of information that Mage Sight can dig up. It can grant enhanced sensory information which isn't specifically a part of Mage Sight.