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Life vs. Vampires

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  • #16
    Originally posted by 21C Hermit View Post
    Time 4 can do it almost trivially, with the Rewrite History spell. You need to meet the +2 Reach option to affect supernatural creatures. And even if made indefinite, it can be dispelled easily and unexpectedly. If we go to Archmastery, then once again Time 7 should be able to pluck out the bit of past history where the vampire was Embraced.
    Corridors of Time (Time •••••)

    Originally posted by MtA 2nd Ed pG 191
    Practice: Unmaking
    Primary Spell Factor: Potency
    Suggested Rote Skills: Academics, Investigation, Persuasion
    Where less-advanced Time mages can only undo actions leading directly up to the present, a Master may choose any moment in her subject’s timeline and destroy everything after it, sending the subject’s present self back in time to the moment of the mage’s choosing. The subject arrives in the past at the specified time, inhabiting his own past body and is free to act, changing history by his actions, although the distortions to his timeline are visible under Active Time Mage Sight. He remains in the past for a time equal to Corridors of Time’s Duration factor, or until he “catches up” to the present. Once in the present, the new timeline sets and any changes the subject made to history become Lasting.
    Without temporal sympathy, the subject may only be sent back to a period with an Unchanged temporal sympathy to the present. By using temporal sympathy, the mage may allow her subject to revisit old decisions and make different choices. The subject arrives in whatever location he was in at the time chosen.
    By including the Sympathetic Range Attainment, the mage may send him somewhere else, but subjects cannot be sent back to periods outside their own lifetime. Such unfettered time travel is the stuff of legend, temporal Irises, and whispers about the powers of archmages.
    With appropriate Temporal Sympathy of a person able to cooperate in preventing whatever event lead to a vampire's embrace, (vampire themselves, bereaved Hunter relatives of the vampire, aged Masters who have access to Space that could affect the vampire via future Sympathies brought back in time with them, slightly older rival vampires, ect...) then the embrace can be prevented all together and made Lasting. Of course the alternate timeline may have a plethora of unintended consequences.

    May I point out because of their unchanging nature, Vampires make strangely suitable Time Travelers...

    Paternoster Seers of the Throne + Lancea et Sanctum Vampires, or Praetorian/HegemonySeers of the Throne and the Invictus/Carthian Movement Vampires are scary combos of time traveling partnerships towards maintaining an oppressive status quo.
    Last edited by Pale_Crusader; 02-20-2017, 04:42 PM.


    “Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.” ~ Aristophanes
    "Virescit Vulnere Virtus" ~ Stewart Clan Motto

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    • #17
      Unfortunately the Dev's have stated that without Archmastery there is no way to permanently remove a template from a person. They were very adamant about it when i was coming up with examples of how to do it.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Hardwire99 View Post
        Unfortunately the Dev's have stated that without Archmastery there is no way to permanently remove a template from a person. They were very adamant about it when i was coming up with examples of how to do it.
        Corridors of Time could probably do it, but I'd be interested in the dev quotes if you can dig them up. Theoretically, the vampire just has to be sent back to the time before it was Sired and then not make the decisions that led to being Sired in the first place. Side effect, never a vampire. Depending on the timeline though this would also mean your vampire buddy never existed.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Hardwire99 View Post
          Unfortunately the Dev's have stated that without Archmastery there is no way to permanently remove a template from a person. They were very adamant about it when i was coming up with examples of how to do it.
          I mean, wouldn't making it indefinite and relinquishing it "technically" solve the problem? Theoretically a mage could just dispel it, but it doesn't matter if they're never found because of "story reasons."

          Also, the whole "changes become Lasting" after a certain point seems to fly in the face of the Archmastery requirement.

          As read, I would understand it as certainly being permanent without Archmastery, but if you could also make it a huge plot point with lots of room for failure and missteps to make it a real trial.

          I would see it as a major no-no for one major reason. Someone brought it up earlier, but basically, doing it to the wrong vampire (to a higher-up, or someone that is connected to a higher-up) could get you a lot of attention you don't want.

          The mere act of a vamp having been sired and then suddenly not being is probably enough to draw serious inquiry from the community. You're either special, or someone/something is meddling in vampire affairs.

          I mean Life mastery allows you to create devastating contagions. What the heck is one or a couple of vampires at the expense of pissing off the whole nest if that is what you need to stir drama.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Mrmdubois View Post

            Corridors of Time could probably do it, but I'd be interested in the dev quotes if you can dig them up. Theoretically, the vampire just has to be sent back to the time before it was Sired and then not make the decisions that led to being Sired in the first place. Side effect, never a vampire. Depending on the timeline though this would also mean your vampire buddy never existed.

            Here Dave Brookshaw and GimpInBlack (Both Dev's) are the ones that stated it.
            Last edited by Hardwire99; 02-20-2017, 05:46 PM.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Hardwire99 View Post
              Here Dave Brookshaw and GimpInBlack (Both Dev's) are the ones that stated it.
              Originally posted by GimpInBlack View Post
              The reason Rewrite History works is because it's Time magic: it's not actually targeting the template, it's targeting the past itself. The name isn't just a fancy title, you are literally rewriting the subject's past so she never went to that goth nightclub and met that pale stranger with pointy teeth, or never got into that fatal car accident, or what have you. It doesn't cure vampirism, it retroactively makes it so the vampirism never happened at all. Time magic is weird that way.
              Thanks. This seems to be the most relevant text. This would be using Corridors of Time on the vampire (Or the Mage could do it if he felt it was really necessary and could go back far enough) to create Lasting effects to the effect that the "vampire" never contracted vampirism in the first place. Like he says here, you're not targeting the template, you're just retroactively changing the past. Agreed, targeting the template would be archmastery, but for an entity that undergoes a change at some point in time that causes them to become what they are Time magic would be sufficient, Corridors of Time being your surest bet for making it stick but having to deal with "alternate" history.

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              • #22
                Ok, so the take away that I get after reading all the comments is Life is useless against or for vampires, let alone "curing" them. It takes archmastery to even attempt such a thing. Even then, it might be a bad idea. Time 4 seems to be his only option. The problem is, the vampire he's in love with is over a hundred years old. 112 to be exact. If he attemps Rewrite History, she'll most likely die. As much as this whole thing pleases me, he's probably going to hate me for this.

                Thanks for your help guys.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Rahuman101 View Post
                  Ok, so the take away that I get after reading all the comments is Life is useless against or for vampires, let alone "curing" them. It takes archmastery to even attempt such a thing. Even then, it might be a bad idea. Time 4 seems to be his only option. The problem is, the vampire he's in love with is over a hundred years old. 112 to be exact. If he attemps Rewrite History, she'll most likely die. As much as this whole thing pleases me, he's probably going to hate me for this.

                  Thanks for your help guys.
                  Provided you can find one you might be able to pay off an archmaster to cure her vampirism. The services of an arch master do -not- come cheap though. The Aeons might also be an option, I'm not entirely sure on the limits of their power. Lastly, there's always the Abyss or the Lower Depths, all kinds of weird shit can come out of there, but you'll probably regret it.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Rahuman101 View Post
                    Ok, so the take away that I get after reading all the comments is Life is useless against or for vampires, let alone "curing" them. It takes archmastery to even attempt such a thing. Even then, it might be a bad idea. Time 4 seems to be his only option. The problem is, the vampire he's in love with is over a hundred years old. 112 to be exact. If he attemps Rewrite History, she'll most likely die. As much as this whole thing pleases me, he's probably going to hate me for this.

                    Thanks for your help guys.
                    Go into the Astral Umbra, travel until you reach the shores of the ocean ouroboros. Go and pay Typhon, the Aeon of Death a visit. There are rumours that he has granted true ressurection before (though in exchange for the death of the pleading party), perhaps he can make a deal. If that's a kind of story you want to tell anyway.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Rahuman101 View Post
                      Ok, so the take away that I get after reading all the comments is Life is useless against or for vampires, let alone "curing" them. It takes archmastery to even attempt such a thing. Even then, it might be a bad idea. Time 4 seems to be his only option. The problem is, the vampire he's in love with is over a hundred years old. 112 to be exact. If he attemps Rewrite History, she'll most likely die. As much as this whole thing pleases me, he's probably going to hate me for this.

                      Thanks for your help guys.
                      I said you can make a doppleganger body with Life 5 and transfer her mind over with Mind 4. You might also get away with Life 4 to shapeshift an already existing body into a copy of her. Make them both indefinite, relinquish, then torpor the vamp body and store it for safekeeping. If you want to be extra, store it in a pocket dimension or maybe drop it in the astral realm in a vault of your choosing? I'm less certain about the astral, but I'm aware that you can apparently discard things into the astral.

                      I believe you'd have to shift the body into a thought, though. So again, you'd probably need Death 4 and Mind 4.

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