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How do I feed twenty, rank four spirits?

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  • How do I feed twenty, rank four spirits?

    Hey there everyone! Just hoping on as a Storyteller to ask everyone here how my NPC Thyrsus Spirit Mage can keep her 20, rank 4 Spirits fed with the following Arcanum:
    Death 1, Fate 2, Forces 2, Life 3, Spirit 4

    In addition, what would the repercussions be if she were to do this your way?

  • #2
    Thats a lot of very powerful spirits. My first question is what kind of spirit are they? And why arent they feeding themselves in the usual ways?

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    • #3
      Yeah, Spirits that powerful are in charge of spirit courts of their own, they should already have enough Essence to sustain themselves. What I think a Mage would do is be in a position to provide them surplus Essence beyond what they normally can acquire on their own from their minions, or to provide other services.

      Like, they're not dogs, they're either kings in their own right and you're the emperor, or they're kings who treat you like an independent contractor.

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      • #4
        Agreed, as a fellow "pet hoarder", I have to warn you that those spirits should probably kill or enslave you. If you can even keep a few of them fed they'll want to boss you around. It sounds like you are gnosis 3 or at best 4. So you are considered Rank 3 or 4 to them. 3 is terrible. 4 means they'd still disparage you as an outsider and may enslave you as a pet or kill you as a threat.
        Depending on the spirits of course... theres a lot more details that could change all this.

        BUT, assuming that the spirits influences compel them to be, ah, "helpful" to you, or you modified them to be loyal, or if a rank 5 spirit made a deal with you to enforce your will over them, or ANYTHING really that justifies them wanting to negotiate with you instead of enslaving you....

        Then look no further than mass mass *mass* use of Create Fetish! In 1e its optional effect was a separate spell called medicine bag. Exploit this to gain "gruel" for your spirit allies. As an ST I'd even allow flavoring it by letting it ferment at resonant locations that exude the flavor you need.

        But again honestly you need to be rank 5 or allied with a rank 5 spirit to boss these things around. I love spirits and love interacting with them but they're single-minded practically sociopathic aliens that put themselves first and OCD on their essence needs and their bans and banes. You can't train them to stop acting like that. It sucks that you have to bully them around a bit, but thats how the Shadow works and spirits *expect* it of their lords. You need a way to control these things other than providing food. If yoj provide food they'll see you as a pantry to be fought over and *taken*, not an ally to trade with.

        You need Spirit 5 and Gnosis 5 to boss them around. That honorary rank 5 will go a long way. But still, 20 of them... and they won't be stupid either at that high a rank!

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        • #5
          Remember to keep your spirits free range instead of simply free run.


          Sean K.I.W./Kelly R.A. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Sean, Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
          The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.-Keiichi Sigsawa, Kino's Journey
          Male/neutral pronouns accepted, female pronouns enjoyed.

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          • #6
            To clarify to everyone, the Spirits have been changed and empowered from a series of rank 2 spirits by a couple of Combined spells. Other then that Sparrow has Gnosis 4 and has transformed them from what they were into Spirits of "Sparrow's Guardian Sparrow". If this is something that still shouldn't work out, the Cabals of the city will be having a fun time for the next little while. :P

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            • #7
              It works fine, but that means they get their Essence off guarding Sparrow and enslaving all the other local spirits they can to do the same so they can collect a tithe of Essence. Since there’s 20 of them they’ll compete against each other violently and cause a significant disruption in the Shadow. So yes, the local cabals will be having “fun.”

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Mrmdubois View Post
                It works fine, but that means they get their Essence off guarding Sparrow and enslaving all the other local spirits they can to do the same so they can collect a tithe of Essence. Since there’s 20 of them they’ll compete against each other violently and cause a significant disruption in the Shadow. So yes, the local cabals will be having “fun.”
                Rapid and unexpected environmental upheavals with resultant power struggles between existing and invasive food-web-cult-kingdoms are my idea of a great date night!

                Said no one remotely involved with the Shadow ever.


                Sean K.I.W./Kelly R.A. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Sean, Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
                The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.-Keiichi Sigsawa, Kino's Journey
                Male/neutral pronouns accepted, female pronouns enjoyed.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Hemo_Liadon View Post
                  Spirits of "Sparrow's Guardian Sparrow".
                  That's where they get their Essence. They have to guard him from something. Fortunately as Rank 4 spirits they can strongarm minor spirits and drive non-ephemerals into helping out the cause.

                  Otherwise, you can use Channel Essence to gather Essence and feed them (spirits need 1 Essence per day to stay active in the Shadow, and lose 1 Essence per hour in the physical world). Or you can make a locus, somehow.
                  Last edited by nofather; 04-22-2019, 11:01 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Well then, thank you all for the help in understanding Spirit. It is the Arcanum that I understand the least. :P I'll probely have to reduce the number by a bit to be honest as my players have not enciuntered her yet.

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                    • #11
                      I would reduce it by a lot. Five at most.

                      Like, four rank 3's are already a hell of a challenge for most play groups, even mages, and even Spirit mages are going to struggling against the reins of that. Five Barons are...a hell of a game.
                      Last edited by ArcaneArts; 04-23-2019, 02:00 AM.


                      Sean K.I.W./Kelly R.A. Steele, Freelance Writer(Feel free to call me Sean, Kelly, Arcane, or Arc)
                      The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.-Keiichi Sigsawa, Kino's Journey
                      Male/neutral pronouns accepted, female pronouns enjoyed.

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                      • #12
                        Since no one has mentioned it (directly):

                        Rank 3 spirits are little gods and Rank 4 spirits are an order of magnitude more powerful; even a single Rank 4 spirit suddenly being added to the spirit eco-system is a major disaster - think Category 5 hurricane disaster.


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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by proindrakenzol View Post
                          Since no one has mentioned it (directly):

                          Rank 3 spirits are little gods and Rank 4 spirits are an order of magnitude more powerful; even a single Rank 4 spirit suddenly being added to the spirit eco-system is a major disaster - think Category 5 hurricane disaster.
                          Also, Spirit magic normally can't manage the feat of raising a spirit's Rank twice; Sparrow has either made or started with a batch of lesser Jagglings, and the latter is substantially harder to swing without extensive legwork.


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                          • #14
                            It would also be 20 medium acts of hubris, under 'Forcing a sapient being (whether a Sleeper, spirit, or anything else) to act counter to its interests, altering its nature long-term, or binding it to a task all risk degeneration.'

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by nofather View Post
                              It would also be 20 medium acts of hubris, under 'Forcing a sapient being (whether a Sleeper, spirit, or anything else) to act counter to its interests, altering its nature long-term, or binding it to a task all risk degeneration.'
                              Or just one. Advance Scale factor. Probably modified to a lower rating, though. Or perhaps the mage is inured to using that spell.


                              Bloodline: The Stygians
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