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  • #61
    The Storytelling Vows section suggests regularly challenging the player, so it might be interesting to tie the amount of mana gained at the end of the week to the number of challenges.


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    • #62
      Originally posted by Satchel View Post
      The rest of the means of getting Mana involve, for the record:

      1) drawing from magical real estate that produces a drip feed of it in a way that takes an hour without a spell of middling difficulty and is often under heavy political pressure as a valuable resource
      2) consuming the solidified byproducts of the aforementioned magical real estate if they happen to be normally edible or using the above spell if they aren't
      3) taking resistant lethal damage or lowering one of your Physical Attributes for a day to an absolute maximum of four times per day if you're the biggest possible wizard
      4) fulfilling a magically-oriented long-term Aspiration
      5) getting particularly lucky on a spellcasting roll and forgoing the other benefits that can get you
      6) or engaging in blood sacrifice!

      Mana isn't hyper-scarce, but "keep up a self-imposed challenge for a week and you get a point for free" is within spec considering that the closest comparable method requires you to alter your soul to do the first thing with a type of ritualistic behavior substituted for visits to a remote location, particularly given that breaking an Obligation offers its own rewards.
      Easy way to get Mana is to take a job at a slaughter house, and Sacrifice the animals there while casting create Tass, the sacrifice will take the place of the mana cost, allowing you to mass produce both Tass and food.

      Alternately just use your familiar turn it's essence into mana and make sure it has lots of essence. Or just buy Tass, if there are Soul Dealers, I would think Tass Dealers would be more common.

      If your using the contigion chronicles as a member of the ship of Thesus, you can trade your create Tass spell to a changeling who can fuel the spell with plentiful Glamour to produce huge amounts of Tass.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Omegaphallic View Post
        Most of the book is really good, but the obligations section is off. A single mana per week is not worth that level of sacrifice. Mages might not be as fuel stat rich as Changelings, but mana isn't so hard to come by to make that worth it. And the Obligation of Assumption is a disaster. I mean they basically warn players away from it in the book itself so why is it there? What does it add to the game except alienating all kinds of people from across the political spectrum and making your table uncomfortable? I'd suggest avoiding it all together, but so does Signs of Sorcery.
        Yes. Most of what is written under Assumption is factually incorrect. The author clearly had an axe to grind. It's a toxic section of the book IMO.

        I'd like to point out that overall the book is super fantastic. Very useful info, story hooks and mechanics. It was worth the wait.
        Last edited by Johnny Awesome; 06-21-2019, 08:23 AM.

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        • #64
          Originally posted by Dave Brookshaw View Post
          Yeah, it’s staying one per week.
          What about rolling your Gnosis at the end of the week, so 1 - 3 points typically? Mana is not hard enough to come by IMO for 1 per week to be worth it.

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          • #65
            Originally posted by Johnny Awesome View Post
            Yes. Most of what is written under Assumption is factually incorrect. The author clearly had an axe to grind. It's a toxic section of the book IMO.
            If you're going to criticise something, you could at least state your problem plainly rather than being vague. Also it can't be factual incorrect, the section is almost entirely dedicated to mages and how magic works.


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            • #66
              So are omphalos stones astras?

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              • #67
                The Vow of Assumption has got to be the dumbest waste of word count I have ever seen. The book itself even points out how stupid it is and that you probably shouldn't use it. What's the point of including it at all? Isn't this exactly the sort of thing that White Wolf doesn't need given all the controversy around the V5 supplements?

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by Quazar87 View Post
                  The Vow of Assumption has got to be the dumbest waste of word count I have ever seen. The book itself even points out how stupid it is and that you probably shouldn't use it. What's the point of including it at all? Isn't this exactly the sort of thing that White Wolf doesn't need given all the controversy around the V5 supplements?
                  This isn’t White Wolf and has nothing to do with V5. Are you trying to come across as a troll, because your comments here aren’t conducive to people engaging in conversation with you.


                  Writer. Developer. World of Darkness | Chronicles of Darkness | The Trinity Continuum

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                  • #69
                    Onyx Path has the license for Mage the Awakening from White Wolf/Paradox. Why do you think the book had to be sent over to them before being released? It's true that the tools who made the V5 supplements aren't connected to Mage. So what? All this shit adds up and stains the hobby.

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                    • #70
                      I think the only ways Vow of Assumption can work at mixed tables would be the tropes of a beautiful sorcerer/ess posing as an old, ugly person (such as many fairy tales like Beauty and the Beast) or a human posing as an animal (like Sword in the Stone, or the Frog Prince). Those seem like a harmless way of portraying that Vow. Otherwise, i agree that the wordcount on it and the sidebar couldve been spent elsewhere. I could see a Mulan situation going on that isnt offensive, but.. otherwise, yeah, i know most of my friends will be outright offended by it. If it were unlimited wordcount, itd be cool to keep as a niche idea. Or if it felt less like blackface or cross dressing, and more about finding your true identity and living it, thatd be nice! Imagine a transperson getting extra mana for becoming who they really are, and getting mana when they express their real gender. Thatd be pretty cool.

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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Quazar87 View Post
                        Onyx Path has the license for Mage the Awakening from White Wolf/Paradox. Why do you think the book had to be sent over to them before being released? It's true that the tools who made the V5 supplements aren't connected to Mage. So what? All this shit adds up and stains the hobby.
                        No, please explain your theory about what edits Paradox does to the person whose signature describes them (unsure of gender, sorry) as a writer. I'm sure Bunyip has no idea how their writing gets put into a book.

                        I'm a little head-tilting at Assumption too, but given how a significant portion of the write-up points out exactly how using that Obligation is done by in-universe edgelords and everyone can tell, I'm a bit more inclined to forgive it. To be frank, it has a basis in real mystical practices - see why male Norse magicians were viewed as inherently spitting on their own gender. It's honestly something that comes off like something assholes would honestly do - this isn't entirely a protagonist book, the Seers have a lot of wordcount too. And to be frank, it's also pointed out that a person who actually is the identity they assume is a valid Assumer as well; on some level, you're validating the status quo if you are a gay man dressing in drag, but on the other hand, the Stonewall riots involved a lot of drag too - and those were a catalyst for the beginnings of the gay rights movement. I can see a subculture of Assumers Of Their Actual Selves being accepted, if eyebrow-raising.
                        Last edited by Leliel; 06-21-2019, 10:48 AM.


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                        • #72
                          See, I was thinking more "Odin sacrifices his eye for wisdom" type stuff.

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                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Elfive View Post
                            See, I was thinking more "Odin sacrifices his eye for wisdom" type stuff.
                            I think that'd be a sacrifice, to be honest. Once the eye is gone, it's gone; it's only an Obligation if it's still functional, but covered in a patch.


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                            • #74
                              It fits the core's reference to the Joker Shadow Name, which can end up 'burdening you with a ton of cultural baggage and expectations.' And likely a face that wouldn't be accepted in public. Seems like it might be more popular for the Adamantine Arrow.

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                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Leliel View Post
                                It's honestly something that comes off like something assholes would honestly do - this isn't entirely a protagonist book, the Seers have a lot of wordcount too.
                                This is important, and it's not just a Seers thing either. Mages are assholes. I like that Mages are assholes, it's my favourite part of the game. The constant tension between following Wisdom and falling into Hubris is really interesting.

                                The Vow of Assumption gives Mages a chance to be assholes, calls them out on it in the text, and tells the Storyteller and the Players to be responsible about it.


                                [Ex3] Why Gods Need the Exigence - Plot hooks for Exigent characters of various gods.
                                [Ex3] Homebrew Solar Charms - I can see the future, and it is glorious.
                                [Ex3] The Glass Library - My Exalted Third Edition Blog (Updated 24/04/2016)

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