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  • #76
    Paradox / White Wolf do have the right, as licensors, to ask for changes in a text. They have done so, sometimes controversially, in the past.

    They did not ask for a single word of Signs to be changed. No edits at all.

    This is not that unusual - they are, for obvious reasons, much more keen in shaping the oWoD.


    As for Assumption - the confluence of

    a) my keenness to reinforce that for mages, sex, gender, orientation, race, etc are strictly speaking optional as they’re all just a three dot spell away from being changed at most.

    b) the *piles* of real-historical magical groups who saw deliberately othering yourself as part of a path to power (Norse included, as noted above)

    c) every single Awakened mage in *this* game’s setting has deliberately constructed a magical identity for themself.

    Leads to the logical conclusion - first, that the same efficiency of the Arcana in giving trans mages the bodies they want will lead to some mages taking “vacations” as minorities. And second, that these mages are assholes.


    But we assume that you, the readers, are grown ups who can cope with us saying “characters who do this are bad people, and you should be mindful of your group’s comfort”


    Dave Brookshaw

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    • #77
      Just going through the Boons right now and I love this section - Supernal Summoning was one of my favourite part of the new core book. But holy frog Into the Pit is terrifying. One of the scariest thing I've yet to read in Onyx Path games. Kudos to whoever came up with it.

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      • #78
        And *furthermore*, this is the same as the line in the corebook about how some Legacies base themselves on outdated notions of transgender persons being seen as magical, and how they're looked down on nowadays.


        Dave Brookshaw

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        • #79
          I'm still confused about whether or not Peripheral MS will detect the presence of a Spell or Discipline on someone, not just as it's being cast or activated. I wish that both examples in the text didn't both imply that it was only at the moment of casting or activation, unless that is intended.

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          • #80
            Sorry, but I am not very familiar with the details. As far as I know, the oWoD was White Wolf's main seller for a very long time. But DTRPG seems to suggest both CofD and oWoD sell pretty well. So why are they more keen to shape that setting ?


            New experiences are the font of creativity, when seeking inspiration, break your routine.


            The Agathos Kai Sophos, an Acanthus Legacy of strategists

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            • #81
              Paradox is publishing oWoD stuff and trying to build it as a license. Might try a search for 'One World of Darkness.'

              There's probably better places to talk about it, but there's probably some threads about it already, it being fairly old news.

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              • #82
                Originally posted by KaiserAfini View Post
                Sorry, but I am not very familiar with the details. As far as I know, the oWoD was White Wolf's main seller for a very long time. But DTRPG seems to suggest both CofD and oWoD sell pretty well. So why are they more keen to shape that setting ?
                Video games, would be my guess. Bloodlines 2 is coming out soon, and I believe there's a Werewolf: the Apocalypse game on the horizon. The WoD IP better lends itself to videogamification due to its metaplot, whereas CofD's more toolbox approach makes for more work in laying the foundations.

                That's my guess, at least.


                Mentats - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Mind/Forces) built around being a human computer; Thaumatech Engineers - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Matter/Prime) focusing on the creation of Imbued items and the enhancement of Sleeper technology

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by nofather View Post
                  Paradox is publishing oWoD stuff and trying to build it as a license. Might try a search for 'https://www.geeknative.com/53951/one-world-darkness-white-wolfs-future/"]One World of Darkness[/URL].'

                  There's probably better places to talk about it, but there's probably some threads about it already, it being fairly old news.
                  Ah, right. After they changed from the confusing naming of classic and new WoD, they focused the vision of the lines into the current form. But I had forgotten that detail. Makes sense, thank you.


                  New experiences are the font of creativity, when seeking inspiration, break your routine.


                  The Agathos Kai Sophos, an Acanthus Legacy of strategists

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                  • #84
                    I really like the compromise that was reached on perfected metals.

                    If you want/need a perfected metal now then it's just a spell away,; but it can't be made Lasting, so if you want something immune to dispellation you still need to do it the hard way.

                    Part of why I like it is that it keeps some of the distinction between my Thaumatech Engineers and the Forge Masters, the latter are more inherently suited to creating perfected metals due to being predominantly Moros and thus having ruling Death.
                    Last edited by proindrakenzol; 06-22-2019, 08:34 AM.


                    Mentats - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Mind/Forces) built around being a human computer; Thaumatech Engineers - a 2e Free Council Obrimos Legacy (Matter/Prime) focusing on the creation of Imbued items and the enhancement of Sleeper technology

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                    • #85
                      Honestly, the part I love the most is the talk about Emanations and how they are their own realms with their own natural laws, unique spell-like abilities and even entire civilizations.

                      You can unironically play an entire Mage Chronicle as a high fantasy at this point.

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Omegaphallic View Post
                        Easy way to get Mana is to take a job at a slaughter house,
                        Ah, yes, the field of work notorious for its laissez-faire work hours, lack of Sleeping coworkers, and consistently high standards of mental health. This is a job environment the metaphysical one-percent will feel at home using for ritualistic activities while occupying a magical persona that exists in part to contain the spread of their magic.

                        and Sacrifice the animals there while casting create Tass,
                        Create Tass isn't a spell in this edition, to say nothing of how I'm pretty damn sure "sacrifice" doesn't just mean "kill any old way" and "cast spells that create objects in the operating space of your mundane job" sounds like a good way to chew through any Mana you'd gain mitigating Paradox.

                        the sacrifice will take the place of the mana cost, allowing you to mass produce both Tass and food.
                        The Act of Hubris for sacrifice is front-loaded to sacrificing living beings, not just humans. This is a good way to ping your way down to Falling and probably render that slaughterhouse extremely cursed in the process.

                        Alternately just use your familiar turn it's essence into mana and make sure it has lots of essence.
                        Requires having a familiar and being able to feed it, which is fairly limited on a day-to-day basis, comes out of a pool of no more than fifteen, and in practical terms loses two or more points from the nature of the transfer and the practicalities of keeping it active. "Have an appreciable understanding of Spirit and probably a particular rote" is a specified point of character construction just as much as building your magical life around Channel Mana is. These are not trivial opportunity costs.

                        Or just buy Tass, if there are Soul Dealers, I would think Tass Dealers would be more common.
                        Tass that is actual tass rather than a spell trying its hardest comes from Hallows, which are, again, pretty well-contested real estate on its own. There's an actual matter of scarcity and access at play here, so any illicit-goods market for the stuff is going to play off of the fact that you can't just yank Tass out of the majority of the population.

                        If your using the contigion chronicles as a member of the ship of Thesus, you can trade your create Tass spell to a changeling who can fuel the spell with plentiful Glamour to produce huge amounts of Tass.
                        Okay, I think we're done here.


                        Resident Sanguinary Analyst
                        Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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                        • #87
                          A consolium setting up a slaughterhouse staffed entirely by mages and sleepwalkers to act as a tass factory could work though...

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Elfive View Post
                            A consolium setting up a slaughterhouse staffed entirely by mages and sleepwalkers to act as a tass factory could work though...
                            There's no Create Tass spell in 2e and the closest equivalent is non-Lasting, which still doesn't address the fact that if something like this exists in your setting, it's because somebody was convinced (or, more worryingly, compelled) to commit themselves to it instead of something else. At least one mage in this equation is going to be hemorrhaging Wisdom and/or Willpower.


                            Resident Sanguinary Analyst
                            Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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                            • #89
                              Where does it say tass can be manufactured by mages? It seems to be a natural occurrence of Hallows, and the only mention of someone making it is a Supernal entity via boon, or something 'like' tass, like the Mana Batteries which would still take up a spell slot unless you also have a relinquishing section in your factory..

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by nofather View Post
                                Where does it say tass can be manufactured by mages?
                                It doesn't, really. Platonic Form and Eidolon are called out as being comparable (to the extent that one of the tag-along effects of Eidolon refers to the subject as being made of tass).

                                To the broader conversation - realistically, out of hundreds of hours of 2E played, I have never seen a single character that struggled with Mana after Gnosis 2-3 or so. But that's because all of the characters in question made sure they wouldn't struggle with Mana. The scarcity exists within the setting, and that several opportunities exist to obviate that scarcity at an individual level to varying degrees of effectiveness doesn't mean that it doesn't - there are opportunity costs involved in every instance.

                                The slaughterhouse idea is neat, I guess, but Satchel and nofather pointed out what I feel the chief problems would be - Wisdom and relinquishing. Signs of Sorcery adds some neat solutions for relinquishing, but many of those are going to exacerbate the Wisdom problem.

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