New to Mage the Awakening

[ImortalKiller]

Hey guys,

about Archmages and Imperial Practices in 2nd Edition. Should I consider a thing? I know the Corebook mention Archmasters, but a thought was more as a Plot Device. After that I discovered the 1st Edition Book and some people converting for 2nd Edition. But I think how splats interact in 2nd Edition is different in how they used to interact in 1st Edition. One example is Blood Potency, who use to go up just with diablerie and time, and now you can increase with experience.

I'm new to Storytelling in general, and I'm not saying is wrong or anything like that, I just wanna know. And sorry for any mistake, English is not my first language

[Falcon777]

First off, welcome!

I personally recommend that you don't bother with Archmages and Imperial magic for a while if you are new to Mage the Awakening. The themes and ideas of Mage are complicated enough without adding in the complexity and strangeness of archmages.

[Dave Brookshaw]

Even in first edition, having Gnosis 6 does not make you an archmaster. Even when a mage has Gnosis 10 the maximum level of their Arcana is 5.

Archmasters aren't, strictly speaking, mages any more. There's a transformation (called a Threshold Seeking) a very powerful mage can attempt to become one, but they have to figure out how by themselves.

The only reason you need concern yourself with the Imperial Practices for is if you insist on properly calculating the Merit cost of an Artifact that does something the regular practices can't.

[Isator Levi]

about Archmages and Imperial Practices in 2nd Edition. Should I consider a thing?

The sourcebook Imperial Mysteries is interesting, but a bit marginal as far as the game goes. Much of its more interesting ideas, like Emanations and Qliphoth, were made more accessible by the time the Second Edition core came up.

The main thing archmasters contribute is being something mages can seek out and make foolhardy deals with when all other options are exhausted, and shadowy background figures contributing to pushes in the events of a game for their own agendas.

One example is Blood Potency, who use to go up just with diablerie and time, and now you can increase with experience.

Nono, it was always possible to do that.

[ImortalKiller]

First off, welcome!

I personally recommend that you don't bother with Archmages and Imperial magic for a while if you are new to Mage the Awakening. The themes and ideas of Mage are complicated enough without adding in the complexity and strangeness of archmages.

Thanks for the welcome 😊 . Yeah, I'm already overwhelmed with mages haha. Was more a curiosity to be fair, I don't have plans to running it actually. I had the impression was more like a plot Device in 2nd edition like Rank 5+ entities

[ImortalKiller]

Even in first edition, having Gnosis 6 does not make you an archmaster. Even when a mage has Gnosis 10 the maximum level of their Arcana is 5.

Archmasters aren't, strictly speaking, mages any more. There's a transformation (called a Threshold Seeking) a very powerful mage can attempt to become one, but they have to figure out how by themselves.

The only reason you need concern yourself with the Imperial Practices for is if you insist on properly calculating the Merit cost of an Artifact that does something the regular practices can't.

So the only thing should be imported to 2nd edition are the costs?

[ImortalKiller]

The sourcebook Imperial Mysteries is interesting, but a bit marginal as far as the game goes. Much of its more interesting ideas, like Emanations and Qliphoth, were made more accessible by the time the Second Edition core came up.

The main thing archmasters contribute is being something mages can seek out and make foolhardy deals with when all other options are exhausted, and shadowy background figures contributing to pushes in the events of a game for their own agendas.



Nono, it was always possible to do that.

Well I don't remember any of this. I need to read more haha

About the 1st Edition, maybe I'm wrong, I read 1st Edition a Long time ago and never actually played it

[Isator Levi]

Well I don't remember any of this. I need to read more haha

To be a bit more accurate, Emanation Realms are described in the Second Edition core and again in some detail in the book Signs of Sorcery, while Qliphoths (mages who have been hollowed out by an Abyssal realm that wander the world aimlessly looking to suck other mages in) are described in Night Horrors: Nameless and Accursed. While First Edition had Qliphoths as the result of those who attempted to become archmasters failing within the Abyss (or the fate of archmasters who fall to Wisdom 0), they've now been made into something that any mage who has become properly connected to the Abyss may become, if they go too far in their replacement for Wisdom.

[Isator Levi]

Archmasters aren't, strictly speaking, mages any more. There's a transformation (called a Threshold Seeking) a very powerful mage can attempt to become one, but they have to figure out how by themselves.

Incidentally, my interpretation of the nature of Threshold Seeking in Second Edition terms (which may be based on something that Dave actually did once say) is that it entails pushing at the limits of normal mage power while also pursuing an Obsession for a subject that is beyond those powers to grasp, which can ultimately lead to an acquisition or epiphany of the nature of that limit and the beginnings of what is required to understand beyond it.

I regard a certain pathos to this in the idea that the kind of power one needs to possess to attempt to become an archmaster makes it difficult to come up with something to Obsess over that is not already within one's capabilities to handle. I would think that mages who set out to achieve the Imperial Practices for their own sake can often be frustrated with trying to conceive of something that they genuinely fixate on while also being beyond their grasp, and that the typical archmaster came to that Obsession as a natural outgrowth of a sequence of pursuits across their life.

[Michael]

I'd add Emanation Realms were moved/altered a bit in 2e, however, it's subtle enough to easily miss if you've already read Imperial Mysteries.

[Isator Levi]

It's even subtle enough to miss being brought up already in this very thread.

[Michael]

It's even subtle enough to miss being brought up already in this very thread.

Woops. Sorry about that.