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[Mystery] Supernal Alchemy & Philosopher's Stone

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  • #16
    If he's an archmaster then he doesn't need to worry about the Orders. He also doesn't have to hide in America since he has a Golden Road.
    They are rumours. Most magi don't know that.


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    • #17
      I thought about using the Philosophers stone in my future campain, but it wouldn't be an artifact. Or it would but not in the Mage sense, cause it was created by a sleeper alchemist. Makes a much more interesting mystery than "an archmaster did it".

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Michael View Post
        They are rumours. Most magi don't know that.
        What are rumors, most magi don't know what? About archmasters? About the Golden Road? Then that just proves my point, doesn't it? Not sure what you're getting at.

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        • #19
          Ok, let me rephrase here.

          If he's an archmaster then he doesn't need to worry about the Orders. He also doesn't have to hide in America since he has a Golden Road.
          Wrydhamster didn't actually say that. They're rumours, not facts. You or I might say think that they don't make that much sense, but your average mage doesn't know that.


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          • #20
            Ok, that's true. Still, I think even regular Mages would know that an archmaster is powerful enough to not have to worry about Order politics considering that their very existence is often considered semi-mythical.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Charlaquin View Post
              From my (admittedly limited) understanding, this is what real-world alchemists were doing, but they disguised it under language of physical science to avoid accusations of sorcery.
              Correct. Internal Alchemy is pure Mage. External Alchemy is for sorcerers, sleepwalkers, proximi and their ilk.

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              • #22
                arthexis let to post here his 2ED Alchemy spells ideas. Original are from this post:

                Originally posted by arthexis View Post
                More details on how I would implement these spells:
                Enchant Potion (Matter 2)

                Practice: Ruling
                Primary Factor: Duration.
                Suggested Rote Skills: Occult, Medicine, Survival.

                The mage prepares a potion-like drinkable liquid substance or a solid pill to hold a spell. That substance is the subject of this spell. While this spell duration is in effect, a mage can cast another spell into the substance to store it within (if the spell requires choices Mana, Reach, special factors, dealing with Paradox or something else, do all of those things now). Only one spell can be stored in the substance. If additional target factors are used, multiple potions or pills can be enchanted at once with a single spell, but the same number of target factors need to be used for the stored spell. When a creature or person drinks the potion or consumes the pill before the duration ends, the effect of the contained spell is released. Whoever drinks the potion or consumes the pill becomes the subject of the released spell. If the effects are not applicable to the subject, it has no effect. The stored spell doesn't count towards the Mage's spell control. The effects still invoke Dissonance as normal.

                +1 Reach: The substance can be a gel or oil instead of a drinkable liquid or consumable pill. When the gel or oil is applied or smeared on a subject, it releases the contained spell on that subject.

                +2 Reach: The substance can be a spray or powder. When a subject is directly sprayed or completely surrounded by the powder while it floats in the air around it, it releases the contained spell on that subject.


                Eye of the Alchemist (Matter 1)

                Practice: Unveiling
                Primary Factor: Duration
                Suggested Rote Skills: Investigation, Medicine, Survival.

                The Mage can immediately recognize a substance subjected to Enchant Potion with his normal senses. The Mage also knows how the substance needs to be applied to get its effect even if not originally evident.

                +1 Reach: The Mage can identify the spell contained within the substance.


                Absorb Potion (Matter/Life 3)

                Practice: Weaving
                Primary Factor: Duration
                Suggested Rote Skills: Investigation, Medicine, Survival.

                The Mage can immediately obtain the magic effects of a subject substance without actually consuming it in the manner specified by the spell that enchanted it. This ends the effect on the potion. The Mage becomes the subject for the effect.

                +1 Reach: The Mage can choose a different subject being touched by her to receive the effects of the potion. Reach and sympathy factors may be applied to choose other targets as if the Mage was casting the original spell.


                Create Potion (Matter 5)

                Practice: Making
                Primary Factor: Duration
                Suggested Rote Skills: Science, Occult, Medicine.

                Similar to the Enchant Potion spell, except this spell doesn't require to enchant an existing substance. Instead, it creates the substance ex-nihilo in its already prepared state to hold a spell. The mage can choose any of the presentations possible for that spell without spending Reach. Spells that affect substances prepared with Enchant Potion have the same effect on potions created with this spell.


                My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
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                LGBT+ in CoD games

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                • #23
                  I'm not sure about the practice for Enchant Potion, seems to me like it ought to be at least Weaving or possibly Patterning like Imbue Item.

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                  • #24
                    Since wyrdhamster was interested, I made a few more, perhaps I could do a Legacy using these...


                    Protection from Alchemy (Matter 2)

                    Practice: Shielding
                    Primary Factor: Duration
                    Suggested Rote Skills: Survival, Medicine, Subterfuge

                    The subject becomes immune to the magical effects contained within alchemically enhanced substances, such as those created with the Enchant Potion spell. Drinking, applying or being enveloped by the substance doesn't release its effect on the subject. If this spell expires while the substance is still in the subject's system, the effect will be released at that time.

                    +2 Reach: The effect of the substance becomes permanently nullified when consumed by the subject.



                    Awaken Substance Potential (Matter 3)

                    Practice: Perfecting
                    Primary Factor: Duration
                    Suggested Rote Skills: Science, Medicine, Occutl

                    The mage transforms a natural property of a subject substance into a supernatural one. The resulting substance is the same as one affected with Enchant Potion, except there is no need to add another spell onto it. Instead the substance receives a spell effect chosen by the Storyteller based on what the substance is already able to do. Typically this will be equivalent to a Ruling, Shielding or Veiling spell.

                    For example, mundane sleeping pills can be transformed into supernatural ones, mimicking a Life Ruling spell that induces sleep. An exotic perfume could provide a similar effect to a Mind ruling spell that makes the subject more appealing. Weight-loss pills could provide a Life Ruling effect that slightly adjusts the subject's weight.

                    +1 Reach: The effect can be as potent as a Fraying, Perfecting or Weaving spell. Alternately, you can add +1 Reach to the resulting effect.

                    +2 Reach: The effect can be as potent as an Unraveling or Patterning spell. Alternately, you can add +2 Reach to the resulting effect.


                    Elucidate Substance Potential (Matter 1)

                    Practice: Knowing
                    Primary Factor: Area
                    Suggested Rote Skills: Survival, Medicine, Science.

                    The mage knows what the resulting property will be when applying Awaken Substance to a substance beforehand. The mage chooses a substance within the affected area to learn this information about it.

                    +1 Reach: The mage instead decides what type of effect he needs and the spell tells her if such a substance can be found within the subject area, and which substance that is. If the effect cannot be obtained with any of the substances in the area, the spell lets her know this.
                    Last edited by arthexis; 01-19-2016, 03:05 PM.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Mrmdubois View Post
                      I'm not sure about the practice for Enchant Potion, seems to me like it ought to be at least Weaving or possibly Patterning like Imbue Item.
                      I left it at Ruling because so far we know that Time 2 is being used to hang spells still, so I wanted to mimic that spell. If later it turns out that a different Time practice is required, then I would change it to match.

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                      • #26
                        Yeah, but it's not the same thing as hanging a spell even if it has a nearly identical effect. It gets down to a thing Dave talked about earlier how it's possible for multiple arcana to achieve the same effect but some arcana are more efficient than others at getting the result.

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                        • #27
                          Yeah, I mean, Matter Weaving feels right to me as well, but I am waiting on the justification for the Time variant. If you want, just use Matter 3 for now. The main thing is that by moving it to Matter 3 it will only be available to Moros from the start. If that's the expected result, then Matter 3 makes more sense. If the intention is to have it more available (like for example, allowing Thyrsus and Acantus creating potions, which can feel appropriate in-path) then I think Matter 2 works better.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by arthexis View Post
                            Yeah, I mean, Matter Weaving feels right to me as well, but I am waiting on the justification for the Time variant. If you want, just use Matter 3 for now. The main thing is that by moving it to Matter 3 it will only be available to Moros from the start. If that's the expected result, then Matter 3 makes more sense. If the intention is to have it more available (like for example, allowing Thyrsus and Acantus creating potions, which can feel appropriate in-path) then I think Matter 2 works better.
                            Time 2 lets you slow or speed up time, or shield/hide something from the effects of time (I.e. Ruling , Shielding, and veiling). If you shield/hide a spell from time, it is hung till the shielding/veil is lifted.

                            Since Matter 2 can't make materials do something it can't do beyond what is within its own properties ( so water can run up hill with Ruling, but a gun can't be turned liquid till 3 dots), I really feel that to impart magical properties, you would need 3+ dots.
                            Last edited by Freemind; 01-19-2016, 08:25 PM.

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                            • #29
                              I will venture out a completely unfounded argument: having an Arcana at 2 dots can (or should) be used to create delivery channels for other spells. Space 2 allows sympathetic magic. Time 2 allows delayed magic. In 1e there was some antecedent that Prime 2 could be used to deliver spells through a Ley line. Spirit 2 can deliver spells to Twilight entities, etc. If this is the case, then perhaps Matter 2 alchemy can be seen as a sort of attainment? Although seeing it as a spell simplifies some things.

                              In general, I would say the practice of Ruling allows you to use the phenomena under an Arcana's purview as a transmission medium.
                              Last edited by arthexis; 01-20-2016, 05:57 AM.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by arthexis View Post
                                I will venture out a completely unfounded argument: having an Arcana at 2 dots can (or should) be used to create delivery channels for other spells. Space 2 allows sympathetic magic. Time 2 allows delayed magic. In 1e there was some antecedent that Prime 2 could be used to deliver spells through a Ley line. Spirit 2 can deliver spells to Twilight entities, etc. If this is the case, then perhaps Matter 2 alchemy can be seen as a sort of attainment? Although seeing it as a spell simplifies some things.
                                In general, I would say the practice of Ruling allows you to use the phenomena under an Arcana's purview as a transmission medium.
                                If there was a spell via leyline it would also include Space.

                                Anyways, I believe spell hanging has been removed as an attainment and become a spell. The Time 2 attainment will be the use of Temporal Sympathy, and Sympathy isn't exactly a method of delivering a spell as much as it is a manipulation of a target's metaphysical closeness.

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