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  • Originally posted by Masa View Post
    Hi wise ones.
    I was wondering about how to manage a Veiling Life spell to render a living veign "hidden" or undetectable, like Hidden Hoard (Matter oo). But I have some questions on this regard:
    Would only affect a naked person?, if the person has clothes, would the spell fail?, what happens if the subject grabs an object or moves?

    I would rule the spell provides full ocultation for a naked subject. If the subject wear clothes or grabs an item, the spell will begin to fade and the onlookers will detect the subject's presence, but they won't be able to tell who is. Mostly like a ghost presence. If the spell subject drops the item or undresses, he will become undetectable again.

    I will be happy to read how you would manage this spell.

    You have two options. First is to hide a living target from anything, which leaves everything else visible. Everything you carry, including clothes will be visible and will trigger a lot of breaking points before quickly dies with dissonance if your not naked.
    Second is to simply veil anyyything from life. You can veil, yourself, your clothes and possible anything you take in hand with some little Reach. No living organism will notice you or your belongings but cameras will register you.
    Third, secret option, is to hide life from specific subject. So when you have, lets say, a guard to pass you can cast it on him and make him not see your whole cabal stomping in front of him.


    [2E] Moinen's Homebrew Hub

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    • Originally posted by galivet View Post
      Interesting. That's not intuitive for me. For me, saying you can use Forces to create a computer program to grant skill bonuses without incorporating Mind is like saying you can use Matter to create a "lucky coin" or something that grants Boons without incorporating Fate. It really seems like you need the conjunction to bring in the benefit that's under the other Arcana's purview.

      Is there already a thread on this somewhere I can read to understand? If not maybe I'll start one so we don't continue this here.
      No, it like saying you can use Matter to make a coin that favors one side, like making both sides heads. Or more relevant saying you could use use matter to make a pair of sneakers and black outfit to help with stealth, or using Matter to make a poncho to help with survival.

      The point is equipment gives bonuses to skills, and Matter can make objects, and programs are equipment too, and are governed by Forces.

      Dice Bonuses reflect many different things, just because mind grants skills (which os mechanically reflected as dice rolled for a skill) doesn't mean it monopolies ways to add dice to that roll. In this system even having a well formed plan counts as equipment.


      “Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.” ~ Aristophanes
      "Virescit Vulnere Virtus" ~ Stewart Clan Motto

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      • Originally posted by Pale_Crusader View Post

        No, it like saying you can use Matter to make a coin that favors one side, like making both sides heads. Or more relevant saying you could use use matter to make a pair of sneakers and black outfit to help with stealth, or using Matter to make a poncho to help with survival.

        The point is equipment gives bonuses to skills, and Matter can make objects, and programs are equipment too, and are governed by Forces.

        Dice Bonuses reflect many different things, just because mind grants skills (which os mechanically reflected as dice rolled for a skill) doesn't mean it monopolies ways to add dice to that roll. In this system even having a well formed plan counts as equipment.
        I highly disagree with this, yes forces can make the bits in a computer turn on and off, but without a base knowledge of what order to turn them on and off in you cant make a program any more that sending electrical current down a line doesn't mean you are sending mores code. Mind gives skills, other Arcana can increase and already existing skill with equipment bonuses but not grant a skill that you do not already have. One dot in computers then go for the gusto forces can increase your ability with equipment bonuses.
        Last edited by Hardwire99; 03-28-2017, 07:09 PM.

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        • Originally posted by Hardwire99 View Post

          I highly disagree with this, yes forces can make the bits in a computer turn on and off, but without a base knowledge of what order to turn them on and off in you cant make a program any more that sending electrical current down a line doesn't mean you are sending mores code. Mind gives skills, other Arcana can increase and already existing skill with equipment bonuses but not grant a skill that you do not already have. One dot in computers then go for the gusto forces can increase your ability with equipment bonuses.
          Are we both talking about this post? Because it makes a digital piece of equipment via the Forces Arcanum, using Mind Arcanum to access actually data needed to fill in what the caster doesn't innately know. Also has the advantage of being able to hand the device off to someone who isn't even a mage. If we are talking about different spells I am sorry and hope this clears up the confusion by including the reference.

          Originally posted by galivet View Post
          Expert System (Mind 3, Forces 2)

          Practice: Perfecting
          Primary Factor: Duration
          Suggested Rote Skills: Computer, Expression

          This spell modifies a computing device by adding a program to it that provides the functionality of an expert system for any skill chosen by the caster. For the duration of the spell, if the device's user is able to use the device as a tool when rolling the relevant skill, the device provides a bonus to the roll equal to Potency. The device's user must have at least one dot in the skill to benefit from the expert system. At the end of the spell's duration, the expert system "uninstalls" itself from the device.

          +1 Reach: The mage may provide an additional expert system that benefits another skill for each additional reach, subdividing Potency among them.

          This spell provides benefits similar to Enhance Skill, but the benefit is not obviously magical in nature. On the downside, you're not going to be able to use it for combat rolls because your smart phone can't talk you through how to throw a punch when you're in the middle of a fight.


          “Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.” ~ Aristophanes
          "Virescit Vulnere Virtus" ~ Stewart Clan Motto

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          • Would Mind 4 be sufficient to grand a Sleeper one of the "psychic" supernatural merits?
            Fate 5 recognises the possibility for any individual to develop supernatural abilities, and ultimately psychokinesis and so forth would possible fall under the purview of Mind.

            Unlock Potential (Mind 4)
            Practice: Patterning
            Primary Factor: Duration
            Suggested Rote Skills: Academics, Occult, Persuasion

            The Mortal Mind is not quite so frail as many mages would believe, indeed those who investigate such things find it has incredible power hidden within, just waiting to be unlocked.
            With this spell, the mage can short-cut the Sleeper or Sleepwalker's mind to access these powers, stepping around whatever inherent blocks stop them from accessing them. For the duration of the spell, the subject gains dots in a "mental" Supernatural Merit equal to the spell's Potency. These can include such merits as Psychometry, Telekinesis, and Telepathy. Due to the Supernatural nature of the these merits for the duration of the spell the subject counts as a Sleepwalker, and does not trigger Paradox or Dissonance until the spell ends.

            +1 Reach: The Mage may grant the subject an additional psychic Merit, dividing Potency between them, this Reach option may be taken additional times
            +2 Reach: The Psychic Merits do not have their normal Drawbacks

            Additional Arcanum: Fate/Forces/Other 2
            The Mage may grant other supernatural merits which relate to phenomenon other than the mind alone, requiring the appropriate Arcanum at 2 dots.
            e.g. Forces 2 for Pyrokinesis, and Fate 2 for Thief of Fate
            Last edited by HerbertIsBestBert; 03-29-2017, 06:29 PM. Reason: Clarity

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            • Killer Eyes(Death 1*)
              Practice: Unveiling*
              Primary Factor: Duration
              Suggested Rote Skills: Medicine, Weaponry, Empathy

              Everything dies, sooner or later. This spell allows the subject to assess how effective would be an attempt at accelerating observed objects, persons, or phenomenas demise. For example, subject might realize that trying to destroy a vampire using weapons and guns are futile at best, and that their efforts should focus on fire and sunlight instead.
              +1 Reach: Subject gains Potency dots in Killer Instinct Merit for the duration of the spell.
              +2 Reach: As above, but Killer Instinct is Advanced.
              +1 Reach: Subject gains Potency dots in Demolisher Merit for the duration of the spell.
              1 Mana: Subject may ignore observation requirement of both Advanced and normal Killer Instinct.



              *I feel this should be at least 2nd dot spell, but hey, practices are practices.

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              • Granting Merits is generally two dots if I recall correctly. You could have the Demolisher Merit as the main effect and have the purely narrative effect as a Reach.
                Btw, where's Killer Instinct from? I don't recognize it and couldn't find it when searching MtA, CofD and Hurt Locker.
                Edit: Nevermind. I realized it had to be Beast since you mentioned an Advanced version.
                Last edited by Tessie; 03-30-2017, 09:42 PM.


                Bloodline: The Stygians
                Ordo Dracul Mysteries: Mystery of Smoke, Revised Mystery of Živa
                Mage The Awakening: Spell Quick Reference (single page and landscape for computer screens)

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                • How would you fluff the effect as a 2nd dot spell? I'm biased towards it being Unveiling or Knowing, and I can't see it as a Ruling / Shielding / Veiling spell. And I reaaaaaaaaaaally enjoy things that emulate Mystic Eyes Of Death Perception (honestly, I want to write this up as a spell so I can turn it into a Legacy attainment)

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                  • Originally posted by WHW View Post
                    How would you fluff the effect as a 2nd dot spell? I'm biased towards it being Unveiling or Knowing, and I can't see it as a Ruling / Shielding / Veiling spell. And I reaaaaaaaaaaally enjoy things that emulate Mystic Eyes Of Death Perception (honestly, I want to write this up as a spell so I can turn it into a Legacy attainment)
                    Could be a Ruling spell that grants you the merits while wielding the thing that's most likely to destroy your foe, the information becomes incidental at that point.

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                    • I don't think a conservative version of the effect is any more impactful than, say, Quantum Flux? If it merely replicated an effect similar to the Merits, would it seem unbalanced?

                      I'm avoiding the Advanced version of Killer Instinct (and working from the publicly-posted pass, as I don't own Beast, so I may not know exactly what WHW is trying to get from it) as I think its benefits may be too extensive to grant.
                      ----------------------------
                      Something Like This (Death •)
                      Practice: Unveiling
                      Primary Factor: Duration
                      Suggested Rote Skills: Medicine, Firearms, Survival


                      Everything dies, sooner or later. This spell allows a subject to assess how to best expedite that process. While it is in effect, when the subject focuses upon a person or object, an inkling akin to peripheral mage sight will emphasize any nearby objects or phenomena that threaten that target, with greater stress placed on more dangerous things. A subject might find that their gun feels lighter when trained upon a vampire, while a candle's flame pulses and roils with ill-concealed animosity towards the undead.

                      +1 Reach: The subject may take turns to aim hand-to-hand attacks. For each bonus die gained from aiming, an attack (ranged or melee) gains Armor-piercing (1), up to a maximum of (3).
                      +1 Reach: For each die gained from aiming, reduce the threshold for an attack (ranged or melee) to be considered an exceptional success by one, to a minimum of two successes.
                      +1 Reach: Each action spent aiming grants Potency bonus dice, instead of one, up to the character's limit on bonus dice from aiming.
                      +1 Reach: Increase the subject's limit on bonus dice from aiming (usually +3) by the Potency of the spell.
                      +1 Reach: If the subject scores an exceptional success on an attack, one level of inflicted damage is upgraded one step (bashing to lethal, etc.)
                      +1 Reach: If the subject scores an exceptional success on an attack, the Armor rating or Durability of their target is reduced by 1 until they heal or are repaired.
                      +1 Reach: While under the effects of this spell and using Active Death Sight, a subject is always considered as having spent the last two turns aiming prior to making an attack.


                      I attack people with giant insects both on and off the court.

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                      • The spell should be cast on the thing that's going to be assaulted in order to avoid breaking Scale by allowing the Mage to retarget in the same way that most spells that provide specific information do. I.e. Divination, Mental Scan, Know Spirit, etc. If it provided more general information it'd be fine using the Mage as a subject, but it doesn't.

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                        • Mmm I don't like straight dice manipulators. I picked Demolisher and Killer Instinct, because they offer non-dice options that fulfill the concept. I also don't want to make it cast at a scanned target, because I want specifically to make the core of the spell ability to perceive and interact with shatterpoints and (often hidden by the Lie) weak points of stuff around the subject.
                          Maybe I will redo it as a Weaving Spell, Weaving might work as a Practice for this kind of effect.

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                          • I think it would need to be made similar to Pierce Deception. So instead of revealing particular information it would tell you how far along things are to death, and reveal with a Reach, symbols that can be pieced together to discover more specific weaknesses without just telling you that you need to get your hands on some cyanide.

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                            • Mana Vine (Life •••••)
                              Practice: Making
                              Primary Factor: Duration
                              Suggested Rote Skills: Medicine, Science, Survival

                              Highly valued for producing wine, pastries, jams, or eating out of hand the cultivation of this plant is a large source of income in more rural Consilium. It's important enough that most are willing to turn a blind eye to the troublesome nature of the plant. The spell creates an infestation of thick thorny vines which grow outwards until they've completely encircled a Hallow. Afterwards the plant absorbs Potency points of mana per day up to the limits of the Hallow. The plant produces a single
                              fleshy fist sized fruit pod per day which can be consumed to restore mana equivalent to the amount absorbed. Harvesting the fruit will most likely require additional magic as the plant will violently defend itself from harvest or destruction. If the Hallow goes inactive the plant will wither and die.

                              +1 Reach: The plant is fertile and will spread it's seeds to other Hallows
                              +2 Reach: The spell is Lasting


                              Comments and critiques? I'm not sure if the should be a Prime conjunctional.

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                              • Would doubtless require Prime 3 conjunctional to Weave the Mana into Tass form, from whatever normal form its Tass would take.

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