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  • Originally posted by FallenEco View Post

    Yes

    Still yes, but that feels like something outside an Arisen's power level. So would suggest trying to eliminate the Mage before archmastery. If only you could go back to before the Archmaster erased themselves from the timeline. Oh, look there is a storyteller chapter in this book...
    Fun fact about Awakened cosmology, it puts the Supernal outside our reality/universe. Though it does put forth the seperations as unnatural, so maybe they aren't walking violations of the First and Last Judge's respective laws...maybe.
    The Judges would not be fans of the Exarchs (who did tear reality a new one), though they may considered more 'tolerable' than Abyssal incursions/entities.
    Plus, the whole 'Duat is a Lower Depth' thing seems like it might not go over well.
    Thank you, I was wondering if I was just overthinking it. Thr separation with the Fallen and Supernal is due to the breaking of the celestial ladder by the exarchs correct? At least, that's what the silver ladder says

    Anyway, the perpetuating of Irem that mummies do. Is that more of a mission mummies have taken themselves? Or a sorta side effect of being slaves/servants of the Judges?

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    • Originally posted by Primordial newcomer View Post
      Anyway, the perpetuating of Irem that mummies do. Is that more of a mission mummies have taken themselves? Or a sorta side effect of being slaves/servants of the Judges?
      Kind of built into them by the Rite of Return, though they don't know if that's the intent or accident. 'purpose of the Arisen is to shepherd human civilization into patterns of rise, imperial phase, and fall, both so that no empire will overshadow the first and that the patterns of art conceived in Irem will continue to perpetuate.' Theoretically you could break it through Apotheosis.

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      • Originally posted by Primordial newcomer View Post

        Thank you, I was wondering if I was just overthinking it. Thr separation with the Fallen and Supernal is due to the breaking of the celestial ladder by the exarchs correct? At least, that's what the silver ladder says

        -snip-
        Given the separation occurred before any timeline that includes Irem (the "Time Before"), and we only have the rhetoric of the Orders to go on. So yes, it was the Exarchs separated the Supernal and the Fallen, but the hows and whys are contested. More on topic, Irem only exists in timelines of the Fallen World. Supernal intrusions, Imperial mysteries, verges, ruins of the Time Before are all things that aren't really compatible with the Judge's servants. Attempts to restore 'Atlantis', (the Silver Ladder's stated goal at times,) absolutely can qualify as something the First and the Last send Arisen to stop.
        Last edited by FallenEco; 02-23-2021, 07:21 PM.


        Thoughts ripple out, birthing others

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        • Last question. Where do I go for the errata? I know it's probably been done already, but I would like to see if it's an error that the Mummies refer to other immortals as "Timeless" pg 89-91

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          • Originally posted by Primordial newcomer View Post
            Last question. Where do I go for the errata? I know it's probably been done already, but I would like to see if it's an error that the Mummies refer to other immortals as "Timeless" pg 89-91

            When you downloaded the pdf there was a link to where you send in errata. If you aren't sure if it hasn't been reported, it's probably best to send it in as such.

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            • Originally posted by FallenEco View Post

              Given the separation occurred before any timeline that includes Irem (the "Time Before"), and we only have the rhetoric of the Orders to go on. So yes, it was the Exarchs separated the Supernal and the Fallen, but the hows and whys are contested. More on topic, Item only exists in timelines of the Fallen World. Supernal intrusions, Imperial mysteries, verges, ruins of the Time Before are all things that aren't really compatible with the Judge's servants. Attempts to restore 'Atlantis', (the Silver Ladder's stated goal at times,) absolutely can qualify as something the First and the Last send Arisen to stop.
              Caveat, though. While Irem existed in the Fallen Timeline, the Rite of Return, by mage standards, is an Imperial level mystery. It causes Aponoia, it retroactively and proactively changed reality and the timeline, and set mummies up as set and cemented into time. By mummy standards, their lives are uneditable portions of the Scroll of Ages, set in stone in lofty Aaru. By mage standards, each Mummy is a supernal truth that exists and the Rite cannot be undone. Much like whatever the Exarchs did, what the Shaniatu did changed reality forever backwards and forwards. And the Archmages can't argue that fact--the Judges tolerate them, and vice a versa, but nobody wants to break the Pax.

              Edit: Everybody WANTS to break the Pax, but nobody does so often, and as such Archmages messing with the Judges or the Rite is certainly a PC quest that has yet to happen. But I still wonder what Imhotep was up to...

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              • So, is it just me or does a Mummy lose a whole dot of Memory per descent? Because if that’s the case, and a player needs to worry about getting 15 Reminiscence beats per time active (or at least per changes in era) then I am... genuinely worried about actually getting past a starting state. I hate game mechanics that have it so you can permanently lose elements you paid with experiences of any kind, and this is one that players would regularly have to encounter.

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                • Originally posted by Cleverest of Things View Post

                  Caveat, though. While Irem existed in the Fallen Timeline, the Rite of Return, by mage standards, is an Imperial level mystery. It causes Aponoia, it retroactively and proactively changed reality and the timeline, and set mummies up as set and cemented into time. By mummy standards, their lives are uneditable portions of the Scroll of Ages, set in stone in lofty Aaru. By mage standards, each Mummy is a supernal truth that exists and the Rite cannot be undone. Much like whatever the Exarchs did, what the Shaniatu did changed reality forever backwards and forwards. And the Archmages can't argue that fact--the Judges tolerate them, and vice a versa, but nobody wants to break the Pax.

                  Edit: Everybody WANTS to break the Pax, but nobody does so often, and as such Archmages messing with the Judges or the Rite is certainly a PC quest that has yet to happen. But I still wonder what Imhotep was up to...
                  A bit of head-canon: there have been at least two iterations of the Fallen World: the first didn't have Irem, and coincides with the “new World of Darkness”; the second was brought about by the Rite of Return, introduced the Arisen to the setting, and on a meta level transitioned the setting to the “Chronicles of Darkness”. Though the God-Machine might dispute that point.


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                  • Originally posted by nofather View Post


                    When you downloaded the pdf there was a link to where you send in errata. If you aren't sure if it hasn't been reported, it's probably best to send it in as such.
                    Thank you kind sir!

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                    • Originally posted by Taidragon View Post
                      So, is it just me or does a Mummy lose a whole dot of Memory per descent? Because if that’s the case, and a player needs to worry about getting 15 Reminiscence beats per time active (or at least per changes in era) then I am... genuinely worried about actually getting past a starting state. I hate game mechanics that have it so you can permanently lose elements you paid with experiences of any kind, and this is one that players would regularly have to encounter.
                      A Descent is generally the span of a story and it is notionally fairly difficult to go through the Trials of Duat and not get at least one benefit from the list that includes "you get a dot of Memory."

                      It's "permanently losing" dots in the same way that Integrity, Humanity, Wisdom, and Cover do. As there, the point is to emphasize that many characters belonging to that template won't bother to regain lost dots, or approach that recovery in a sideways manner that leans into their being monsters. Much as most demons dealing with the Cipher aren't likely to try to slow-roll their way through Cover Beats, most mummies looking to keep their Memory up will do so by bringing relics to Duat and strengthening the Pillars of their soul rather than lean entirely on poking around places the Judges don't want them looking, cannibalizing relics, living up to their Decrees, and acting as a moral guide/enabler for their Touchstone.


                      Resident Lore-Hound
                      Currently Consuming: Hunter: the Vigil 1e

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                      • Satchel's plan works as long as you don't drink from Anpu's chalice; choosing to suffer rather find relief from the journey.
                        I liked that addition.


                        Thoughts ripple out, birthing others

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                        • Originally posted by Taidragon View Post
                          So, is it just me or does a Mummy lose a whole dot of Memory per descent? Because if that’s the case, and a player needs to worry about getting 15 Reminiscence beats per time active (or at least per changes in era) then I am... genuinely worried about actually getting past a starting state. I hate game mechanics that have it so you can permanently lose elements you paid with experiences of any kind, and this is one that players would regularly have to encounter.
                          I deliberately chose to have the “Gain a dot of Memory” as a potential benefit for the Trials of Duat so that those seeking to build their Memory up wouldn’t necessarily be set back in their progress by having a little something to drink while they’re there.
                          The reason why Memory is lost so easily is to maintain the theme that Memory is a struggle. Since Reminisce Experiences are only used to raise Memory, there’s no lost opportunities for losing a dot. Nobody’s going to curse wasting their Experiences on Memory only to have them vanish while their buddy keeps the sweet new power they learned. If Memory was easy to maintain, there’d be plenty of Arisen with damn good memories. A mummy trying to rebuild their Memory is swimming against the current. They struggle, life after life, to claw their way back, to resist the sands of time mercilessly scouring away their identity.
                          Of course, if you prefer to have it easy for them in your games, it’s a simple matter to just ignore the Memory drop in Duat.


                          Jason Ross Inczauskis, Freelance Writer
                          Projects: Dark Eras 2, Mummy: The Curse 2e, Book of Lasting Death, DtR The Clades Companion, Pirates of Pugmire, They Came From Beyond the Grave!, TC Aeon: Mission Statements, TC In Media Res, DtD Night Horrors: Enemy Action, C20 Anthology of Dreams
                          Masculine pronouns preferred.

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                          • I agree that it should be easier to lose Memory than to build it. However, I don't think that the mostly automatic nature of Memory loss presents it well as a struggle instead of an inevitability; the process is mostly passive. Even the retention of Memory post-Duat is a gift from the Judges (and ST) rather than reflecting intentional effort on the part of the PC, which is (imo) unusual given that they normally don't seem to like Memory.

                            Frequent righteous actions in line with your Declaration seem the easiest route to getting Big Memory, and sounds good, as far as actions you can purposefully take (finding out secrets and drainable relics are mostly at the ST's pleasure).

                            There is also getting your touchstones to indulge their Virtues and Vices frequently, but exhorting them to cram their willpower pools to the brim is still oddly passive and limited (imo), considering the text on how Mummy touchstones are all about helping you retain memories. It feels appropriate, to me anyway, if it was a breaking point. You could have it always be an Absence, given that that is better than an automatic loss, or better yet, EXTREMELY short Descents could be higher (say, a disturbance descent that only lasts a single scene). That way, touchstones can have a much more significant role in clinging to Memory, when as is, they seem to only have a slight influence.

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