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  • Awe question.

    From what i am reading Awe gives the emotion of someone be really cool or in human terms a really cool important, influential or respectful figure.
    Although in many cases i have seen the Awe been treated like a "taunt". Many are the cases where for example someone uses Awe and the ST roleplays it as everyone in the room turns to your character. Thats legit i assume. But i have been involved in cases that a man walks on the road like 10 steps ahead of you and i use Awe and the walker turns to me. This i assume is not a proper approach. I feel that Awe is not "turning the head" to you if you havent even noticed the Kindred. For example if Madonna was walking behind me -and she has Awe passively active cause is her- and i just walk around paying 0 attention i dont find it eligible to turn to her even when she uses the Discipline.

    Also i wanted to ask how another person Kindred or not can understand the effects of the Awe. Assume that i am already talking to someone with whom i have a good standing with and he uses Awe on me, i still believe that i will not feel any difference towards him cause we are already in social terms "good friends". But still how as an ST you roleplay it and when you inform again as an ST the use of Awe in your players characters.

  • #2
    I aeree, awe dosen't affect someone not aware about you.

    About the second question it's hard to say. If you are already talking with someone and he active awe, you feel an improvvise and new good feeling about him. If you are a vampire aware of the majesty tricks you could understand and lash out.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Marcus View Post
      I aeree, awe dosen't affect someone not aware about you.
      I agree with Marcus, but I want to point out a funny thing. You need to be aware about someone, so if you don't notice, the Awe doesn't work, but imho making yourself blind doesn't help.
      Gangrel could make himself blind and deaf by harming himself, activate protean 360 visions (echolocation for instance), but it doesn't give Majesty level 5 protection unless you aren't aware the vampire is here. To sum up, it's about being aware not seeing of hearing, bio sonar will do.
      Last edited by Edgar McAlister; 02-28-2017, 08:53 AM.

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      • #4
        I agree. Awe enhance your personality so, your voice, your smell...not just your apparence.

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        • #5

          Originally posted by Montgomery Crobes View Post
          From what i am reading Awe gives the emotion of someone be really cool or in human terms a really cool important, influential or respectful figure.
          Although in many cases i have seen the Awe been treated like a "taunt". Many are the cases where for example someone uses Awe and the ST roleplays it as everyone in the room turns to your character. Thats legit i assume. But i have been involved in cases that a man walks on the road like 10 steps ahead of you and i use Awe and the walker turns to me. This i assume is not a proper approach. I feel that Awe is not "turning the head" to you if you havent even noticed the Kindred. For example if Madonna was walking behind me -and she has Awe passively active cause is her- and i just walk around paying 0 attention i dont find it eligible to turn to her even when she uses the Discipline.
          Awe shines a spotlight on the vampire even in a crowded room.
          When he wills it, all eyes fall on the vampire and nobody cares what he’s doing.


          Above are two lines directly from the Awe text. That being said, I treat it as some mundane thing draws your attention over to the user. No it's not a magical "everyone turn your head and look at me button" where it's forceful, but it's more like when you're at a bar and some laughs a little louder then the rest and you turn to look. Or when they walk in the door the breeze makes you turn your head. Natural logical subtle environmental cues "When the user wills it, everyone notices" Or even less subtle the metaphorical spot light, perhaps in the dark nightclub they are literally standing under a light that shines on them and darkens everyone around them. If you were walking in front of Madonna paying absolutely not attention to her and suddenly she activated Awe, the person walking towards her goes, "Holy shit! is that Madonna?" Or you hear a several clicking of cameras or You hear someone else whisper to their friend, "Did you see Madonna?" or you hear a familiar voice and you think it's Madonna. So natural human/kindred response would be to turn around and see if it was true yourself.

          I certainly have people go about their business in crowds where a vampire has awe on, but I do have everyone notice that vampire as well for whatever natural reason. The thing about awe is it mystically and subtly makes all the affected people aware of the user. I do not think there is a way to say. "Sorry, I didnt notice you" because as per the text, everyone is aware of the vampire.


          Another example of text that implies the "victims" don't have to be right next to you and paying attention to you, "With a word, he can summon anyone in the room to his side — not by any mystical compulsion, but by making her aware that he wants her to approach."



          Originally posted by Montgomery Crobes View Post
          Also i wanted to ask how another person Kindred or not can understand the effects of the Awe. Assume that i am already talking to someone with whom i have a good standing with and he uses Awe on me, i still believe that i will not feel any difference towards him cause we are already in social terms "good friends". But still how as an ST you roleplay it and when you inform again as an ST the use of Awe in your players characters.
          Majesty is subtle. and there should be no major shift in emotions when awe happens, but there might be a minor shift where they make excuses on why whatever you are doing is ok. If they are already friends, then they stay friends, but you just might make an excuse to hang out by your friend's side at the party vs splitting off to do your own thing.
          Last edited by Vitalis; 02-28-2017, 02:32 PM.

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          • #6
            Yes, but it also states that who is affected by awe dosen't care about anything the vampire did or is still doing. He could be covered in blood or just punched to death someone and still don't suffer of any social penalities. I can see a kind of magic in that.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Marcus View Post
              Yes, but it also states that who is affected by awe dosen't care about anything the vampire did or is still doing. He could be covered in blood or just punched to death someone and still don't suffer of any social penalities. I can see a kind of magic in that.
              All the disciplines are "kind of Magic"

              it means that you aren't going to go call the cops because some crazy guy is covered in blood. You are more likely to think "That's not my problem"

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              • #8
                In my mind, Awe is supernatural. It mind-fucks people, murders their sense of reason. It can literally overload a mind with open-mouthed amazement. It's the ability to approach a stranger, grab their hand, guide them into a dark alleyway, and feed on them without a single word. It's the ability to make all eyes fall on you, making yourself impossible to look away from. It's only subtle insofar as the victim is unaware that they're being supernaturally mind-fucked into awe-struck submission. It's like someone who idolises a celebrity suddenly turning to jelly. There's nothing outright supernatural in that reaction, but there's certainly something abnormal for a complete nobody to engender such a reaction. A person is simply likely to rationalise it as 'oops, I don't know what came over me'. That's all.

                As for your question, it's difficult to not notice a person using Awe in the same way it's difficult to not notice the most attractive person in a sparsely populated room. Your eyes will land on them as if by accident, you'll notice how attractive they are, and your eyes will have trouble looking away - they're always at least in your peripherals.
                Last edited by Jack; 02-28-2017, 03:42 PM.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Vitalis View Post

                  All the disciplines are "kind of Magic"

                  it means that you aren't going to go call the cops because some crazy guy is covered in blood. You are more likely to think "That's not my problem"
                  I don't belive "it's not my problem" is the right reading. Because awe deny any penalities in interaction with that guy.
                  Thinking a person covered in blood is not my problem and go for my way is not the same that talking with him with a great smile about stuffs as he would be the most important person in the world.
                  It is absolutely supernatural and someone could be aware of this. But this is just my opinion.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Vitalis View Post

                    All the disciplines are "kind of Magic"

                    it means that you aren't going to go call the cops because some crazy guy is covered in blood. You are more likely to think "That's not my problem"
                    No it doesn't mean they won't call the cops. It means they'll keep their mouth shut until he leaves. Then call the cops and be able to provide an above average description because they noticed a lot more specific detail that would have otherwise been overlooked.

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                    • #11
                      There's a scene in "Secrets of the Covenants" where the narrator is speaking with a Daeva who activates awe on him mid-conversation, and he acknowledges the effect it has on him - begrudgingly trusting the Daeva, while knowing full well he's BS-ing him. It's more or less the kind of situation where, even if you know what's going on, you compromise your logic brain with the power being used on you to think 'hey, even if he's fucking with me - and he IS fucking with me - I can probably deal with whatever he's trying to make me do.' So there's something regarding how one reacts to Awe when you know that you're being mind-fucked.

                      Secondly, I would permit Awe to be used as a 'taunt' move, but only for a very brief moment. Awe does not force someone to look at you and only you, only that it makes people notice you. So if somebody has a gun aimed at you, and your Daeva buddy activates Awe, the person is going to turn to look at your buddy for a split second, during which you might be able to grab the gun if you have fast enough reflexes. But he's probably going to immediately turn back to you after acknowledging the existence of your beautiful friend.

                      That's my ruling, anyhow. I do think Awe is kind of the most broken of the level 1 powers, due to the fact that it GETS RID OF ALL SOCIAL PENALTIES, PERIOD, NO MATTER WHAT, but it's also fun so I'm not holding any beef with it.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by RomulusGloriosus View Post
                        That's my ruling, anyhow. I do think Awe is kind of the most broken of the level 1 powers, due to the fact that it GETS RID OF ALL SOCIAL PENALTIES, PERIOD, NO MATTER WHAT, but it's also fun so I'm not holding any beef with it.
                        I guess it doesn't remove penalty due to low humanity since it's also about not understanding humans too well.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Marcus View Post

                          I don't belive "it's not my problem" is the right reading. Because awe deny any penalities in interaction with that guy.
                          Thinking a person covered in blood is not my problem and go for my way is not the same that talking with him with a great smile about stuffs as he would be the most important person in the world.
                          It is absolutely supernatural and someone could be aware of this. But this is just my opinion.
                          As per the FAQs, you would need a darn good reason to know that the user is using it. It's that subtle.

                          Second I think there might be a slight language barrier on "not my problem". I see this attitude with my students all the time. For example there might be a candy wrapper on the floor in the door way. They all see it, they all know it's there, but they all leave it there for someone else to pick up and throw away because they didn't put it there so why should they be the ones to pick it up. Same with when some one sees a shoplifter, so many think since they aren't the security guard, they shouldn't be the one to say something about it. Or if you see someone beat someone to death, ( with awe on of course... as I hope you wouldnt do this in real life ) you would just move on with your night because doing something like calling the cops, well.. that's not your problem. Someone else will take care of it. It's not your place to say something, who are you anyway?

                          Its the same reason that 100 people could witness a crime and not a single one of them calls the police because they all assumed someone else had done it and that they didn't need to.

                          It's more of a mentality of "not my problem" than actually saying "that's not my problem" if that makes sense?

                          Originally posted by tsusasi View Post

                          No it doesn't mean they won't call the cops. It means they'll keep their mouth shut until he leaves. Then call the cops and be able to provide an above average description because they noticed a lot more specific detail that would have otherwise been overlooked.

                          Why would you want to call the cops on the coolest dude that you literally moments ago did not even care that he was covered in blood? the whole time the vampire was in the scene you didn't mind he was covered in blood, you didn't mind he just beat someone to death. then suddenly he leaves and you know ever great detail about him and have this desire to call the cops? I think not. At least, I wouldn't play it out that way nor let my players play it out that way. That's not what awe does. It makes you over look faux pas, it makes you over look their nasty blood stained clothes and find excuses to think that they are the shit. perhaps you were too busy staring at their face and enthralled by their words to even notice that their pants and shoes were soaked in blood and they had a gun in their hand.

                          I am not a fan of playing where when a discipline ends you suddenly have epiphanies and know you were mind controlled so you go back to what you would have done in the first place. It to me, defeats the purpose of the powers. Especially subtle ones like Majesty.


                          Originally posted by RomulusGloriosus View Post
                          There's a scene in "Secrets of the Covenants" where the narrator is speaking with a Daeva who activates awe on him mid-conversation, and he acknowledges the effect it has on him - begrudgingly trusting the Daeva, while knowing full well he's BS-ing him. It's more or less the kind of situation where, even if you know what's going on, you compromise your logic brain with the power being used on you to think 'hey, even if he's fucking with me - and he IS fucking with me - I can probably deal with whatever he's trying to make me do.' So there's something regarding how one reacts to Awe when you know that you're being mind-fucked.
                          This is pretty much how I roll it. Your brain makes up logical reasons why you should hang with them and listen to them or talk to them... or really whatever. You make excuses. You know that the Daeva is a liar and they are probably bullshitting you, but you know what, maybe those other people were wrong, maybe he wont be like that this time. We will give him the benefit of the doubt....
                          Last edited by Vitalis; 02-28-2017, 04:24 PM.

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                          • #14
                            I agree with Vitalis. It doesn't mess with your memory. If you were fine with a person being covered in blood and waving a gun in the air at the time it happened, you're fine with it after the fact, too - that's the power of Awe IMO.

                            A person might recount the event, and a listener might question their reaction being a bit blase - but it's very likely the person will excuse it as an outrageous, humorous event that only that vampire got away with due to the way it all played out.

                            I know people who say some extremely rude, crude shit to people - the reaction is usually surprised laughter - because they're charismatic as fuck in their delivery. It works for them. It doesn't work for everyone, though. You can get two people doing or saying the same thing, and people will react differently, simply by the dint of the person's apparent charisma / force of personality giving them a free pass. It happens in real life, basically. It's relatable. That's why Awe can be very subtle (when used in a responsible fashion - beating a man to death and everyone being okay with it after the fact could very well garner attention from mortals looking for strange, unexplained events).

                            Originally posted by RomulusGloriosus View Post
                            Awe does not force someone to look at you and only you, only that it makes people notice you. So if somebody has a gun aimed at you, and your Daeva buddy activates Awe, the person is going to turn to look at your buddy for a split second, during which you might be able to grab the gun if you have fast enough reflexes. But he's probably going to immediately turn back to you after acknowledging the existence of your beautiful friend.
                            In my head-canon, Awe can force people to look at you and only you - depending on a few factors. To quote the book: "Anyone paying attention to him also subtracts his Majesty dots from any Wits + Composure rolls to notice anything other than the vampire." (VtR 2E, p. 133) In my mind, that means that a person who's witless or lacking in composure could very well be forced to zombie-stare at a vampire. They will literally just gawk at the vampire.

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                            • #15
                              Awe's duration is: Scene. It's literally that.
                              If you want to extend it beyond that then it's up to you. There is exactly zero in the description that even suggests it does, as far as I can see. But I'm not getting into an argument about what people WANT to do with it; that's up to you and your group.

                              As for removing Majesty dots from Wits+Composure I'm fine with that. It makes sense. But, as a corollary, it only applies for things that you'd have to make a roll to see.
                              I'd imagine you have people notice obvious things without rolls, and none obvious things with rolls. I wouldn't get people to make rolls to notice someone beating someone else to death, on the same bus they're on. So even your zombie stare does nothing there.

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