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Vampire vs Mages

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  • Lashet
    started a topic Vampire vs Mages

    Vampire vs Mages

    There are a lot "FurrVSFangs" threads. I want to broke the template a bit. Let's compare Vampires to Mages (both as 2nd edition). My own money for mages - bloodsuckers seems to be weak.

  • Lasombra
    replied
    Originally posted by Vent0 View Post

    Call it Evasion (or Improved Evasion) as a nod to D&D?
    I like it! Nerd style

    Leave a comment:


  • Vent0
    replied
    Originally posted by Lasombra View Post
    I really like the auspex + celerity combo, I'm already thinking about very neat devotions that might be useful for countering straight up time effects, area spells that influence matter or create traps. Super speed and super occult sight might allow the vampire to escape the mage trap
    Call it Evasion (or Improved Evasion) as a nod to D&D?

    Leave a comment:


  • Vent0
    replied
    Originally posted by Tessie View Post

    I think Vigor+Resilience works better. Vigor is often used in devotions when projecting self-affecting Disciplines on other subjects.
    Well, I was thinking borrowing the area of effect of either of the first two, and apply Resilience's conceptual "toughness" to the same area.

    Vigor + Animalism + Resilience?

    Leave a comment:


  • Lasombra
    replied
    I really like the auspex + celerity combo, I'm already thinking about very neat devotions that might be useful for countering straight up time effects, area spells that influence matter or create traps. Super speed and super occult sight might allow the vampire to escape the mage trap

    Leave a comment:


  • Tessie
    replied
    Originally posted by Vent0 View Post
    For the affects-the-area spells, you might be able to create a Devotion with Animalism or Obfuscate (for their area powers) and Resilience to project "your" defenses over the claimed area, and justify it having Withstand.

    That is a custom/homebrew method, though, not Core/RAW.
    I think Vigor+Resilience works better. Vigor is often used in devotions when projecting self-affecting Disciplines on other subjects.

    Leave a comment:


  • nofather
    replied
    A Celerity + Auspex Devotion might allow you to, providing it's within possible distance, get out of the way of an AoE spell.

    Leave a comment:


  • Vent0
    replied
    For the affects-the-area spells, you might be able to create a Devotion with Animalism or Obfuscate (for their area powers) and Resilience to project "your" defenses over the claimed area, and justify it having Withstand.

    That is a custom/homebrew method, though, not Core/RAW.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lasombra
    replied
    Originally posted by nofather View Post

    Frenzying and Riding the Wave should be enough at that point, you raise your Stamina by your full Blood Potency, drastically increasing Withstand that targets it.
    I wanted to give the vampires also a chance to resist all kinds of spells in general, regardless of the Whitstand attribute, but u have a point here.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lasombra
    replied
    Usually stamina whistand direct modifications to the body or direct damage inflicted by life spells.
    The infamous ban that can close a vampire or render the mage immune to anything is a space spell who cannot be whitstood.

    Time spells if they involve predictions and scryng in the past are whitstood by temporal sympathy, the relationship between the present and the target. Stamina only helps if I cast a time spell directly on the vampire to slow his time and paralyze him.
    If I want to predict the fate and future of a vampire for example, he doesn't have any special protection beside anonimity and the temporal difficulty of my casting.

    Direct fate spells that damage the body or cause tilt like arm wreck are usually whitstood.

    Mind spells that can control or modify the mind of the vampire are whitstood usually by resolve or composure. High mental attributes help against mind magic.

    Matter spells that can seal a vampire away in a prison made of any material are not whitstood, as suddenly turning the floor below the vampire into lava.

    Gravity spells that sends a vampire flying are not whitstood.

    Direct blast of plasma or fireballs are not whitstood.

    Generally speaking, anything that affects the environment around the vampire cannot be whitstood by any trait the vampire possess.

    That's what's scary about mages, they don't need to target u directly to kill u or win a fight.

    If a vampire possesses 5 in stamina 5 in vigor and resilience and he has the juggernaut devotion active, it won't save him from my ban spell that will simply seal him away with no possibility of return..

    Or maybe I can just teleport him out in space and let him witness the sun face to face...

    Yep, some spells are just broken, and things that usually save you from other means of arm are simply useless.

    Even a werewolf ability to regenerate all lethal and bashing damage each turn is basically only a minor problem to a mage that knows how to control the battlefield and play smart.

    In the case of elder mages, each and every single template from every tower will have at least one spell that allows them to trump against other enemies in one turn, or at least seriously hinder them and stop the fight.

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  • Tessie
    replied
    Mostly, but Withstand is specified when the spell is created. No hard rules for what Arcana are Withstood by what Resistance Attributes.

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  • Marcus
    replied
    Understand. So space, time or force spells should be affected by stamina as they affect the body? (I'm not sure about time)

    Leave a comment:


  • Tessie
    replied
    Correct. About half the spells also have free Potency equal to the Arcana rating.
    Also, direct damage dealing spells don't normally use Withstand. So if the mage casts your example as a damage dealing spell it'd deal 4 damage of some kind. Depending on how the spell works the damage might bypass armor, but probably never Resilience if that is used.

    Leave a comment:


  • Marcus
    replied
    So lets do an example:

    Mage with Gnosis 5 arcana 5 rolls 10 dice to have a spell with potency 1. He decides to take it at potency 4 so -6 dice on the roll.
    He rolls 4 dice and have 2 successes.

    I have lets say stamina 6 (Stamina 3 resilenza 3). The spell doesn't have any effect?

    Leave a comment:


  • Tessie
    replied
    No. Withstand ratings removes Potency from the spell. Potency is decided when the spell is cast. That can make it a bit of a guesswork to find the right Potency to make the spell go off at all since zero Potency means no effect. You can increase Potency by 1 by removing 2 dice from your dice pool.

    Leave a comment:

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