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Help me understand Mask & Dirge

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  • #16
    Originally posted by monteparnas View Post
    I agree with Maina. The actions would really be the same. But the reasons, and the context, do change.

    On a practical level, we can add the following to make things more clear:
    - Being your facade before the sheep, the Mask only gives you willpower when you have reason to think there can be mortals watching you.
    - Being your hidden self, the Dirge only gives you willpower when you have reason to think there can't be mortals watching you.

    The Mask wouldn't apply if you have no reason to think you're being watched, because it is about the facade, it isn't really important to you by itself. The Dirge wouldn't apply under the possibility of mortal scrutiny, because you would be too worried of being caught to reassure yourself. Vampires never affect this, because they're already predators for you. Even if you do keep a facade from them, it wouldn't be relevant for willpower gain.

    With that you can see how things play. The actions, again, are the same. But the situations where the character tries to act that way are opposite.

    And, of course, you can make both similar or the same, to represent someone who are truer to itself even as a monster. In that case, the same actions always reward willpower because they are true and the character isn't restrained from showing the true self.
    Thanks, now i get it.

    So the important thing is what the action was meant to accomplish.

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    • #17
      I don't feel comfortable reducing it in any way. Every interpretation is valid and makes for some good characters. That's why I like to go right for practical rules, so each person can interpret them as best suited for the character.

      But I still see nothing on the rules stating that you benefit from the Mask in front of other Vampires. That is why I like to treat them as "for practical purposes on gaining willpower, Vampires don't matter". So it is ultimately up to you if you act in front of them as your Mask, your Dirge, or something else altogether. You can feel a lot of things toward your fellow Kindred, but their opinion on you isn't something emotionally reassuring for you to recover willpower.


      Sorry if I seem too straightforward, or if I don't get you. Autism isn't a forgiving condition.

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      • #18
        I believe there's meant to be a higher frequency of spending and gaining Willpower in second edition, so there's no real reason to be stingy about it.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by monteparnas View Post
          I don't feel comfortable reducing it in any way. Every interpretation is valid and makes for some good characters. That's why I like to go right for practical rules, so each person can interpret them as best suited for the character.

          But I still see nothing on the rules stating that you benefit from the Mask in front of other Vampires. That is why I like to treat them as "for practical purposes on gaining willpower, Vampires don't matter". So it is ultimately up to you if you act in front of them as your Mask, your Dirge, or something else altogether. You can feel a lot of things toward your fellow Kindred, but their opinion on you isn't something emotionally reassuring for you to recover willpower.
          That wouldn’t be my interpretation, but if it works for you and Loki, that’s all that matters.

          Me, I don’t see anything rules-wise suggesting the Mask actions wouldn’t grant Willpower when there are no humans around, nor Dirge when there are no vampires. If undeath is a ball, Mask is the clothes you wear to the party and Dirge is the song you dance to. You don’t take your tux off just because you think your crush isn’t looking at you, and when your favorite song comes on you dance like no one is watching, even if they are.


          Onyx Path Forum Moderator

          My mod voice is red. I use it so you know when I'm speaking in an official capacity, not as an indication of tone.

          Going by Willow now, or Wil for short. She/Her/Hers.

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