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[TYoN] Pijavica are unplayable?

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  • [TYoN] Pijavica are unplayable?

    I wanted to add Slavic vampires to my games, being Slav myself. I remembered then Tzimisce Clan from VtM that made Voivodate state, created flesh and blood experiments ( like Vozhd ) and made many other interesting ideas. Pijavica seems to work at least in flesh changing aspect to it. Until we look in to Thousand Years of Night and read they are some kind mutated ‘blobs of Blood’ until Blood Potency 4 and from Blood Potency 8. I thought they will be like maybe on BP 0 or BP 1 at max this Blood thing, not almost 1/3 of their unlife. It makes running characters like Dracula from Bram Stoker almost impossible till 3 centuries in to unlife of Pijavica. Or do I read it wrongly somehow.


    Conquest of Paradise - Fan Dark Era about Portugal and Spain conquests in XVI century - Mage & Beast ( & Hunter )
    My Hubs - VtR 2E System Hacks, MtAw 2E Legacies and System Hacks & WtF 2E Lodges and System Hacks

  • #2
    It only takes 150 years to get to blood potency 4, not 300.

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    • #3
      I haven't got TYoN but all the other clan banes don't kick in until you drop a humanity, I know this isn't great but it's something you could use.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Live Bait View Post
        I haven't got TYoN but all the other clan banes don't kick in until you drop a humanity, I know this isn't great but it's something you could use.
        Pijavica Clan Bane is also based on Blood Potency - I could understand it was somehow related to Humanity - like rest of Clan Banes - , but I think devs wanted to show how inhuman they are. Well, they made them so inhuman, that running them in human population is almost impossible.
        Last edited by wyrdhamster; 11-08-2017, 07:02 AM.


        Conquest of Paradise - Fan Dark Era about Portugal and Spain conquests in XVI century - Mage & Beast ( & Hunter )
        My Hubs - VtR 2E System Hacks, MtAw 2E Legacies and System Hacks & WtF 2E Lodges and System Hacks

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        • #5
          They went extinct for a reason, Wyrd.


          I'm So Meta Even This Acronym

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          • #6
            They're in an elders book with alternate chargen rules for starting at blood potency 5.

            They're entirely playable, as long as you start at blood potency 5.

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            • #7
              ​Well, I want to use them as 'nearly extinct Slavic vamps', not some blood ooze, over and over again.

              Originally posted by Elfive View Post
              They're in an elders book with alternate chargen rules for starting at blood potency 5.

              They're entirely playable, as long as you start at blood potency 5.

              Okay, so I got rules good that they need high Blood Potency to human-like. If that's the case, I may do alternative Clan Bane for them in my Clan Banes Hack topic.


              Conquest of Paradise - Fan Dark Era about Portugal and Spain conquests in XVI century - Mage & Beast ( & Hunter )
              My Hubs - VtR 2E System Hacks, MtAw 2E Legacies and System Hacks & WtF 2E Lodges and System Hacks

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              • #8
                They're playable at anything except blood potency 1. If you really want to play one, find a way to start at BP 3 and you'll be fine.


                CofD booklists:
                Beast I Changeling | Geist l Hunter l Mage | Mummy | Promethean | Vampire

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Second Chances View Post
                  They're playable at anything except blood potency 1. If you really want to play one, find a way to start at BP 3 and you'll be fine.
                  I look as ST here - I do not run Vampire for players, I run it as NPCs. Even if I like general idea of Clan 'coming from the Blood, literally', making vampire to hangs on and wait 100 years to become somehow human-like is simply... too long, I guess? I think I can 'wait' for those few days, maybe weeks. But come on - Who would created Pijavica neonate so he need next 100 years wait till he could DO something in human society? ( Yes, it's rhetorical question, cause I know I would not. )

                  Their Bane is just too stagnated - it changes once per 25/50 years, where most other Clan Banes are related to Humanity levels in direct manner - so they change with the rhythm of the story in chronicle, not just years clock of it.
                  Last edited by wyrdhamster; 11-08-2017, 02:32 PM.


                  Conquest of Paradise - Fan Dark Era about Portugal and Spain conquests in XVI century - Mage & Beast ( & Hunter )
                  My Hubs - VtR 2E System Hacks, MtAw 2E Legacies and System Hacks & WtF 2E Lodges and System Hacks

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
                    Their Bane is just too stagnated - it changes once per 25/50 years, where most other Clan Banes are related to Humanity levels in direct manner - so they change with the rhythm of the story in chronicle, not just years clock of it.
                    Diablerie and the creation of progeny are still things they can do, I'll note, as is spending Experiences on Blood Potency. The only clan Discipline they'll have any trouble with is Animalism and the nearest thing to a hard lockout on their ability to act in early nights is the corebook's mentioned forty-night larval stage.


                    Resident Sanguinary Analyst
                    Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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                    • #11
                      My solution would be to create a Cruac (or other ritual magic) ritual at whatever level (probably 4+?) that allows a Pijavica to possess a dead body for X time. It doesn't rot, so long as they spend a point of blood per night, etc etc. Would bind the kiddos pretty well to their sires (if indeed the sire is the one who performs the ritual for them) and would probably make whatever form of magic they're using very very important to them.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Satchel View Post
                        Diablerie and the creation of progeny are still things they can do, I'll note, as is spending Experiences on Blood Potency. The only clan Discipline they'll have any trouble with is Animalism and the nearest thing to a hard lockout on their ability to act in early nights is the corebook's mentioned forty-night larval stage.
                        Originally posted by Asaram View Post
                        My solution would be to create a Cruac (or other ritual magic) ritual at whatever level (probably 4+?) that allows a Pijavica to possess a dead body for X time. It doesn't rot, so long as they spend a point of blood per night, etc etc. Would bind the kiddos pretty well to their sires (if indeed the sire is the one who performs the ritual for them) and would probably make whatever form of magic they're using very very important to them.
                        Those are just in-game fixes for bad mechanics. I really wanted to make Pijavica main 'Slavic Clan', with Ventrue and Mekhet as 'imperialists coming to East Europe' in times of Rome. Clan to be playable should not need of Diablerie or Cruac Rituals ( which will not exist till those 1800's with Circle of Crone ) just to make vampires to work with human society in some way - even Nosferatu have easier times to work with humanity, for God sake!

                        I'm okay with idea of forty-night larval stage - I would probably short it to few nights, but's it's more 'a story dynamic' reasons than anything - but from that period neonate should more or less be able to come in relations with humanity. Other way around, we have Pijavica only as Clan to make animalistic undead antagonists, nothing more. And we have inhuman Gangrels for that, too, don't we?


                        Conquest of Paradise - Fan Dark Era about Portugal and Spain conquests in XVI century - Mage & Beast ( & Hunter )
                        My Hubs - VtR 2E System Hacks, MtAw 2E Legacies and System Hacks & WtF 2E Lodges and System Hacks

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                        • #13
                          Pijavica weren't written as the 'Slavic Clan' primarily though. They were written as the 'blood monsters that erupt from bloated corpses Clan'. Surely you can use something besides the Pijavica? Think of how the indigenous Mexican and Spanish vampires are portrayed in Shadows of Mexico.
                          Last edited by Spencer from The Hills; 11-08-2017, 07:42 PM.

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                          • #14
                            These guys are mentioned in the VtR2e corebook, right? I remember reading about them and thinking how cool and Mythos-like they were. Not every Kindred lineage should be human to begin with, as the Kindred themselves don’t have a common origin. And the idea they’re a twisted echo of Prometheans merely adds to their creepy coolness.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
                              Clan to be playable should not need of Diablerie or Cruac Rituals ( which will not exist till those 1800's with Circle of Crone ) just to make vampires to work with human society in some way - even Nosferatu have easier times to work with humanity, for God sake!
                              As Thorbes points out, they were a weird phenomenon with limits that kept them from becoming more prolific. As-written they're explicitly running on a deficit that proper Kindred are stable enough to avoid without rapidly boosting their Blood Potency and/or rolling Humanity very frequently.

                              I'm okay with idea of forty-night larval stage - I would probably short it to few nights, but's it's more 'a story dynamic' reasons than anything - but from that period neonate should more or less be able to come in relations with humanity.
                              The whole deal with the Pijavica is that they didn't have the starting flexibility to keep their numbers up. Converting them to a more typical clan without softening the impact of their condition is best suited by enabling them to raise their Blood Potency quickly through systems of diablerie and Blood Beats, by giving their sires a method like Jiang Shi have to create their progeny with higher starting Blood Potency, or by using weird experimental Devotions like the one Vlastislav developed.

                              Other way around, we have Pijavica only as Clan to make animalistic undead antagonists, nothing more. And we have inhuman Gangrels for that, too, don't we?
                              The Pijavica are distinguished from the Gangrel by their being alien on top of atavistic; the Savages' bane instead doubles down on feral behavior. The Gangrel are not vampiric versions of The Thing and do not present the same challenges to play. If you just want a clan of Slavic origins, there are less awkward options at your disposal than trying to make the Pijavica into a normal clan rather than one with such a close tie to the alienating aspects of vampirism.


                              Resident Sanguinary Analyst
                              Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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