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torpor and damage

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  • torpor and damage

    A Vampire suffers serious damage. At the end of the turn the Vampire has: full lethal damage, 3 aggravated damage and NO Vitae. The Vampire falls to Torpor. When it wakes up, how many damages does it have? The Vampire has no blood to heal the damage. Does it wake up with zero damage - why? If it wakes up with all suffered damage can the Vampire function, i.e. hunt? Should it not fall to torpor again?

  • #2
    I think at that point you wouldn't wake up. You'd just be stuck there in torpor until you were accidentally killed or someone spilled enough blood that you might absorb it and heal, or another vampire fed you Vitae to wake you.

    A Willpower to stop Vitae from trying to heal those wounds might let you get active too.
    Last edited by nofather; 10-25-2018, 04:18 PM.

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    • #3
      It has no damage, the Cleansing during the Torpor seems to that. During sleep, small damage returns to the state of the Embrace, the same with grievous wounds while in Torpor. The body slowly heals on it's own. It will be very, very hungry, ergo 0 blood pool. And most likely have to check for frenzy at the slightest provocation. It would need to feed that first night, or slip back into Torpor again.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Poseur View Post
        It has no damage, the Cleansing during the Torpor seems to that. During sleep, small damage returns to the state of the Embrace, the same with grievous wounds while in Torpor. The body slowly heals on it's own. It will be very, very hungry, ergo 0 blood pool. And most likely have to check for frenzy at the slightest provocation. It would need to feed that first night, or slip back into Torpor again.
        Can't find this Cleansing rule. Where is it?

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        • #5
          You always wake up at the end of torpor time, even with NO vitae. You'll maintain all the damages you suffered and weren't able to heal and have a full night to feed/recover. If you can't, you fall back in torpor again.
          Last edited by Marcus; 10-25-2018, 04:57 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Marcus View Post
            You always wake up at the end of torpor time, even with NO vitae. You'll maintain all the damages you suffered and weren't able to heal and have a full night to feed/recover. If you can't, you fall back in torpor again.
            I cant find such rule in VtR 2.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Marcus View Post
              You'll maintain all the damages you suffered and weren't able to heal and have a full night to feed/recover. If you can't, you fall back in torpor again.
              This seems like a nicer way to handle it.

              But mechanically, the Cleansing attempts to heal you using Vitae. If you don't have Vitae, you don't heal, you don't just get up with full health. So if you wake up with full Lethal, the rule that suggests you look at is, 'when her last box is marked with lethal wounds, she falls to torpor.' Which implies brief waking from torpor only to fall back, or constant torpor, my suggestion.

              I think in the end it's Storyteller's decision here, but Marcus' explanation fits with the setting too. You still have your damage, you've probably been out a while (torpor duration is increased, mostly, if you have Lethal in your last boxes), but you're able to hunt for Vitae for a night. It also allows for some leniency among PCs, so you could come back from a defeat.

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              • #8
                It seems very reasonable that you wake up after a longer time then normal when you're damaged into Torpor. If you're still damaged in the last three health boxes you sleep for a bit longer. But as the last is also one of the last health boxes, it's very likely that you're able to wake after a longer sleep then usual. Otherwise Torpor would almost in every way equal final death if you're damaged into it.

                It's the same argument about "how does one wake without vitae when it costs vitae to awaken". The long sleep of Torpor fixes that is the short answer. I'm sure you could argue that some of the vitae/beast fixes that over a long time, even that the Cleansing fixes it, a small portion at a time, but it adds up.
                One might even say it's the Blood Potency that breaks down to fix the body, even if's just a fraction of a whole "dot".
                Last edited by Poseur; 10-25-2018, 08:11 PM.

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                • #9
                  Put simply: This is one of the many many reasons why it's a very bad idea to spend your last Vitae if you have any choice in the matter.

                  Falling into torpor from damage when you're simply running on low reserves is dangerous enough; if you've got allies who can feed you, great, but otherwise being beaten down past your safety margin means you're left to the tender mercies of your environment as a sitting corpse.

                  The way to get around that problem is to not put yourself in that situation to begin with.


                  Resident Sanguinary Analyst
                  Currently Consuming: Changeling: the Lost 1e

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                  • #10
                    Say for the sake of ease that a kindred has 7 health boxes, 5 in BP and 5 in Humanity.

                    Base Torpor duration is 5 months. So if you has some spare vitae, at least 3 of them, when you hit 7 lethal damage you sleep for 5 months.

                    However if you aren't so lucky then the rules say:
                    she still suffers a wound in her last
                    three Health boxes, consider her Humanity one dot lower for
                    determining how long she slumbers.
                    So if you take 7 lethal, has one or two vitae left you sleep for 5 years.

                    If you take 7 lethal and has no vitae left, you sleep for 5 years.
                    I do not think that damage in the last health box and no vitae equals to infinity-sleep.
                    I must agree that the rules do not actually say exactly what happens with the damage, only that you wake, and in this case it is after 5 years. I do consider the damage healed in torpor although one could argue otherwise. A more fit ruling would perhaps be, one health box healed.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Poseur View Post
                      I do not think that damage in the last health box and no vitae equals to infinity-sleep.
                      I must agree that the rules do not actually say exactly what happens with the damage, only that you wake, and in this case it is after 5 years. I do consider the damage healed in torpor although one could argue otherwise. A more fit ruling would perhaps be, one health box healed.
                      I think the reasoning for indefinite torpor is mainly because based on the setting and it's inspirations, it's more reasonable for a vampire to be so grievously wounded that the only chance they ever have of waking is someone accidentally or purposely spilling blood on the location they rest. Rather than them spontaneously healing and going about like nothing happened, especially considering they can't even heal without Vitae when active and at their peak but for, say, 1 Bashing damage.

                      Like I said before, factoring in that this is a game and you don't want to just kill everyone you can have them stagger from torpor in blurry predatory-minded consciousness, but that's something more done as a nod to the fact that it's a cooperative game.

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                      • #12
                        You could reduce the effective humanity by a further one for each a point of Aggravated damage. That would get your millennia of slumber if desired... Interrupted by spilled blood of course.

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                        • #13
                          In my experience it's generally been agreed that if you wind up in torpor with no vitae that you wake up with one health box healed but no more. IE just enough to get you up.

                          I was pretty sure that was actually in the book somewhere but I can't find it now.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Elfive View Post
                            In my experience it's generally been agreed that if you wind up in torpor with no vitae that you wake up with one health box healed but no more. IE just enough to get you up.

                            I was pretty sure that was actually in the book somewhere but I can't find it now.
                            Honestly I can't remember what you are citing but since the book states quite clearly that, whatevere is the situation in which you go into torpor, you are eventually always waking up from the torpor (while in masquerade and req. 1ed was stated the opposite) it seems really weird, as someone suggested, waking up for just a second falling asleep immediately after. So there are large room of interprtation here, but I definitely wouldn't go for a sudden wake up just to fall back asleep the moment after.
                            Maybe could you wake up in Frenzy???

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Marcus View Post
                              Maybe could you wake up in Frenzy???
                              Waking up in frenzy would be appropriate, or more precisely, waking up with a frenzy check immediately.

                              Look, Revenants provide a clear pathway for how to handle a zero-Vitae vamp on waking: they do that every night! The main question, and it's subject to table ruling, is whether the ex-torpic vamp rises fully healed or does so with minimum health. You can go either way as it's appropriate to the story and the level of consequence you want to foist on the characters (NPC or PC).

                              Suffice to say that regardless, you'll want to feed and the amount of feeding (and it's difficulty) is going to slide from "normal" through "frenzy" to "feeding to heal damage out of penalties while frenzying."

                              --Khanwulf

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