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What do you wish you knew about making Disciplines?

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  • Korogra
    replied
    Rose, you’re a huge goofball and do silly things some times narratively, but you’ve got a good head for Vampire shenanigans xD

    Here is my question: how does Strix Vitae power Disciplines when it lacks a good number of the properties of Kindred Vitae, which does fuel Disciplines? The book makes it seem that the shadow-stuff Of The Owls is less mystically potent than the energies of their fleshbound progeny, so I’m curious as to what your take on it is.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rose Bailey
    replied
    Originally posted by ArcaneArts View Post
    More on Disciplines as Story Hooks.
    One thing I'm talking about, especially in the Auspex and Protean dev histories, is how Disciplines have a story arc.

    Leave a comment:


  • ArcaneArts
    replied
    More on Disciplines as Story Hooks.

    Leave a comment:


  • DubiousRuffian
    replied
    Ooh, this is a long shot - but guidelines for Threnodies. How central is the self-harming aspect? When should an effect be a Threnody rather than a Devotion? Any other info on them is always appreciated, cause I love the aesthetic of musical vampire hedge magic. I just want a character to excuse herself from a dinner to go to the bathroom, try to keep her singing under the sound of the faucet while putting cigarettes out on herself, and suddenly the host's teeth all fall out.


    Originally posted by Mateus View Post
    Rose, looks like you opened the flood gates!
    Hey man, any chance for more of that sweet sweet content.


    Last edited by DubiousRuffian; 06-10-2019, 10:46 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rose Bailey
    replied
    Thanks for all of the questions! I'm writing up answers.

    Originally posted by Mateus View Post
    Rose, looks like you opened the flood gates!
    I'm enjoying it! Dipping back in via Storytellers Vault is much more fun than I was expecting.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mateus
    replied
    Rose, looks like you opened the flood gates!

    Leave a comment:


  • DubiousRuffian
    replied
    Originally posted by Tessie View Post
    Every roll that affect someone else negatively is contested by default.
    Oh crap you're right. Don't know why I didn't really notice that...

    But I guess what I had in mind is something like Majesty 2 vs Nightmare 3. Nightmare 3 is a Contested roll -- totally binary -- either you become delusional or not.

    Majesty 2 on the other hand.... Succeed at a Contested Roll to impose the Charmed Condition. The Charmed Condition gives a bonus to Manipulate rolls and a penalty to detecting lies equal to dots in Majesty. It broadens the effects of Awe, but you don't have to roll to Awe someone. You just Awe them and then roll directly for the effects. The fact that you have to roll to impose the Charmed Condition before rolling for Manipulate ever so slightly lowers the overall probability of success. And it's just kind of a weird asymmetry.


    I'm pretty sure it's because the individual powers don't follow a progressive structure like a Discipline would. Compare to Cachexy in DEC where each dot thematically or practically build off of previous dots.
    Yikes, I got the Khaibit mixed up with the Kerberos, and for some reason was thinking that Obtenebration was implemented as Merits with Discipline prerequisites. Glancing over the original release, I don't believe that is the case. And I think you're probably right about the explanation.


    That said, the Devotions are based on Vigor, Celerety, and Obfuscate 2. That's a little weird right? the Obfuscate 2 Devotion lets you become shadow... is that just just because it's literally called "Touch of Shadow"? I'm not sure how Obfuscate 2 thematically relates to becoming a shadow. Seems more like a Cloak of Shadow to me :P. Also, one of the Vigor 2 Devotions lets you expel shadow from your veins. Why is that Vigor?

    Contrast the Celerity Devotion to King Katamba's Devotion based on Obfuscate 1 that lets him enter the underworld. Granted they were written by two different people, under (I think? Thousand Years of Night was Danielle's right?) a different developer, but that's a bit of a weird inconsistancy.

    Leave a comment:


  • PenDragon
    replied
    No questions, just popping in to thumbs up this endeavor.

    Designing the 2e Disciplines was a blast!

    Leave a comment:


  • Draconis
    replied
    Is there a conceptual reason why all Disciplines follow the same format, and would it be reasonable for some special Disciplines to break free of it?

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  • Tessie
    replied
    Originally posted by DubiousRuffian View Post
    Contested vs resisted?
    This is part of the underlying system and not unique to Disciplines. Every roll that affect someone else negatively is contested by default. Resisted rolls are exceptions and are only used if the roll has an effect based on number of successes rolled.

    I'm wondering why some Disciplines that aren't contested/resisted have dice pools while others can always be activated. Why does Beast's Hackles and Twilight Projection require rolls and why don't any of the Protean dots require rolls?

    Originally posted by DubiousRuffian View Post
    EDIT: what was guiding the design for Obtenebration as.... Deverits?
    I'm pretty sure it's because the individual powers don't follow a progressive structure like a Discipline would. Compare to Cachexy in DEC where each dot thematically or practically build off of previous dots.

    I'm wondering, why are they priced the way they are? Why not have them as a bloodline Discipline where each dot can be bought out of order?

    Leave a comment:


  • Griautis
    replied
    Originally posted by Marcus View Post
    Devotion linking Disciplines and BP, are they feasible and how are they supposed to work? I remember in 1ed they were a thing.
    In example: a discipline between VIGOR and BP 6+, would allow to consider effective Vigor level, up to BP level instead of 5? When BP should/could go in a devotion?

    I think that now the elder devotions are not about BP requirements, but about vitae costs, which are just not practical for weaker Kindred to pay.

    Leave a comment:


  • Live Bait
    replied
    How do you go from concept to rules? I’m in the process of converting the Sangiovanni to 2e and I know what I want each level to do but there are a few things that I’m worried about.


    Necromancy
    Dot o
    Detect dead things (ghosts, vampires, corpses etc) within range of your Kindred Senses. Dots in this discipline add to your Blood Potency for the purpose of determining the range of your Kindred Senses and also add to any dice pools to examine corpses. No further information is given at this level but the Kindred ability to identify other Kindred still applies.
    Use can hear heartbeat range as range for all powers in this discipline unless otherwise stated.
    Dot oo
    Can animate courses. Cost is Vitae equal to the sum of Size + Power + Finesse + Resistance. Maximum Size, Power, Finesse or Resistance is dots in Necromancy + Blood Potency, the ST may forbid stats deemed silly such as a Power 4 mouse. A Zombie requires an upkeep of one Vitae at an interval in nights equal to the number of dots required to “max out” the Zombie with a Maxed out Zombie requiring upkeep every night after the first, a Zombie that doesn’t get its upkeep loses one dot from its highest of Power, Finesse or Resistance chosen by the ST in the event of a tie.
    At this level you can tell different types of physical dead and undead apart including possessed living bodies if the possessing entity is dead within your Kindred Senses.
    Dot ooo
    Can heal dead things with Vitae as though healing themselves or spend one Vitae to inflict one lethal damage instead.
    At this level you can tell apart any non physical undead or spirits such as ghosts and astral projecting vampires.
    Dot oooo
    Can enter the underworld at appropriate places. Waiting for Sin Eaters before setting price but probably free for self.
    At this level you can identify such gateways and analysis their nature such as the key needed to open them.
    Dot ooooo
    Can summon ghosts from and banish to the underworld.
    At this point you can identify individuals within range of your Kindred Senses.
    This discipline can not distinguish between Kindred and Strix.

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  • Marcus
    replied
    Devotion linking Disciplines and BP, are they feasible and how are they supposed to work? I remember in 1ed they were a thing.
    In example: a discipline between VIGOR and BP 6+, would allow to consider effective Vigor level, up to BP level instead of 5? When BP should/could go in a devotion?

    Leave a comment:


  • Griautis
    replied
    What are the discipline requirements for devotions? especially physical disciplines which don't have specific effects to latch onto.

    Leave a comment:


  • Eldagusto
    replied
    Fluff and in character lore about learning disciplines and how Vampires experimented with them over the years, kind of like the Dr. Netchurch stuff from Masquerade.

    And stuff on how far you can push disciplines to extreme weird specialized angles as well as how narrow a vampire that specializes on a specific aspect can go.

    Like Ancients experimenting with what are their actual limits, as well as ground level cooperation to experiment on how clever vampires can get if they crowdsource discipline development and shared secrets.

    Leave a comment:

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