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Am I getting Majesty correct?

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  • Am I getting Majesty correct?

    I'm a little worried about Majesty and how it's making it very difficult to do some of the things I'm trying to do as an ST. It's a very cheap to use power, doesn't require eye contact like Dominate, and it basically allows you to pull all the information you want out of someone. All it costs is 1 vitae (if you even need to bump it up to Green Eyes) and you can have a villain, or one of his minions, spill his guts about their entire dastardly plan. Am I missing something about how Majesty is used and any restrictions there may be in how it's used? Is it more limited than I'm thinking it is? How is it really any different from Dominate?

  • #2
    Well, a big restriction is that you're going to need Majesty 4, not 3, for a lot of people since with just 3 anything that's a breaking point isn't going to work; and that ups it to need to win 2 rolls and spend 3 total vitae just to get someone to do one thing for you. So... Majesty 3 can do more, but for this purpose alone it's on par with just Dominate 1.

    The big effective difference from Dominate is control. Dominate takes control from people and makes them do what you say, so who they are is a lot less important than how well you phrase your commands. Majesty is about influence. It doesn't override people's personalities and is far more subject to interpretation. You might be able to enthrall someone into doing something for you, but you have no direct control over how they do it.

    Majesty also doesn't have any memory wiping powers, and it wears off, so not being careful with it means people will know what you did.

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    • #3
      So, lets say someone walks up to a character, the character successfully uses Majesty on this person, then the character asks if the person is secretly an assassin sent to kill them. If said person is in fact an assassin, do they have to instantly spill the beans and spoil the entire plot, or does Majesty allow the person to get creative with their answer so they don't give anything away? I can see how getting a Majesty victim to blow up a building full of people could be a Breaking Point, but what about telling plot-spoiling secrets?

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      • #4
        No, they don't have to reveal anything.
        They just out of the blue go up to someone and ask if they're an assassin? That level of metagame stupid is definitely grounds to make the character suspect some kind of wonky power is in use or their mission has been compromised. They can Lash Out to break Awe, if successful, means Majesty is worthless on that individual for the scene.

        And yes, they can get creative with their responses. Even come up with their own bullshit I'm a secret agent line said in order to "impress" the Majesty user.
        Last edited by tsusasi; 09-20-2019, 08:21 AM.

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        • #5
          All Awe does is remove social penalties and give a Majesty bonus to Presence rolls. And only Presence rolls. It also makes it hard to notice anyone else, so it works well as a distraction.

          Confidante extends that Presence bonus to include Manipulation rolls (Awe itself does not have this bonus) and makes it harder to detect lies from the user (Awe also doesn't have this bonus).

          It takes Green Eyes to start giving orders, but even at this point they won't risk their own skin for the vampire. It does let you manipulation emotions, which Dominate can't do.

          Loyalty gets you even closer, but it's still more "supremely loyal minion" and not "using someone as a puppet."

          Then Idol, which is nothing like Dominate at all.

          Majesty is about making people love you and want to do things for you. As such, it's more subtle, but you have to use a bit more finesse to get things done. You can make people want to do things to please you, but they otherwise generally retain their free will in how that's achieved.

          Dominate is about forcing your will on someone. It's like using a sledgehammer.

          A Majesty user is the Goddess you worship.

          A Dominate user is the King you obey.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Shadowdragon View Post
            So, lets say someone walks up to a character, the character successfully uses Majesty on this person, then the character asks if the person is secretly an assassin sent to kill them.
            "Majesty" isn't a power. Which powers are being used? Is the assassin just standing there while your character activates multiple powers in a row for no reason? Is the assassin a normal human? Ghoul? Vampires? Other? Worse?

            As well, I get that you're concerned about Majesty here... but Auspex and Dominate are considerably better at this for the price... so what's really the problem?

            If said person is in fact an assassin, do they have to instantly spill the beans and spoil the entire plot, or does Majesty allow the person to get creative with their answer so they don't give anything away?
            They wouldn't spill all the beans on the spot because you didn't ask them to. And "betraying my loyalties," is easily a breaking point for Integrity based characters (and a few others). It could also be seen as suicidal for an assassin to reveal themselves to their target (esp. a Ghoul or something to a vampire). So if it's really an assassin (thus ignoring all the people that aren't the assassin but would say they were just to make you happy, and why this is a dumb idea), it's that much harder to get them to say anything, or at least strip them of their ability to interpret their way out of things.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Shadowdragon View Post
              I'm a little worried about Majesty and how it's making it very difficult to do some of the things I'm trying to do as an ST. It's a very cheap to use power, doesn't require eye contact like Dominate, and it basically allows you to pull all the information you want out of someone. All it costs is 1 vitae (if you even need to bump it up to Green Eyes) and you can have a villain, or one of his minions, spill his guts about their entire dastardly plan. Am I missing something about how Majesty is used and any restrictions there may be in how it's used? Is it more limited than I'm thinking it is? How is it really any different from Dominate?
              As others have said, Majesty makes people love you and vie for your attention, it does not make them risk their lives for you until dot 4. It would assist in breaking down the assassin's Doors, but that requires multiple rolls and prolonged social contact. Even then one might argue that an assassin who is utterly taken with a vampire would do everything in his power to cover up their true nature, otherwise this awesomely cool super hot vampire might not like them anymore!

              That said, Vampire (and CofD in general) heavily favors the aggressor over the defender. If a vampire is suspects someone is an assassin and gets close enough to them to talk face to face that assassin is rightfully screwed, be it through Dominate, Auspex or a plain ol' ass-whoopin. Though, if your players are wandering around asking everyone if they are an assassin, that's probably cause for people to start treating them like dangerous lunatics. After all, what sort of person goes around asking everyone if they're out to get them?


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              • #8
                Originally posted by Shadowdragon View Post
                So, lets say someone walks up to a character, the character successfully uses Majesty on this person, then the character asks if the person is secretly an assassin sent to kill them. If said person is in fact an assassin, do they have to instantly spill the beans and spoil the entire plot, or does Majesty allow the person to get creative with their answer so they don't give anything away? I can see how getting a Majesty victim to blow up a building full of people could be a Breaking Point, but what about telling plot-spoiling secrets?
                Metagame or not, with Majesty 3 I'd say, you have 2 options:

                1. The victim is going to reveal everything: the victim would feel suddenly so guilty and sorry to have even just thought to kill or act against the Character. He will cry out all his intentions as a liberation to this weight
                2. He feel so guilty and sorry that, surely he would not hurt the character (at least during the time the power is ieffective), he will for sure avoid he to be hurt by somone else if he is aware of, but he could try to hide his previous intention as the moat deep secret he has. He doesn't want to be blamed by the object of his adoration after all.

                So u can play with thw nature of the NPC. But I'd also say that, of characters have reason to doubt and continue to query him, at some point he would fall revealing everything.

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                • #9
                  Keep in mind that Majesty 3 requires the target to be Charmed or Enthralled to work (which requires using other Majesty powers first). While Charmed normally lasts [Blood Potency] hours, getting them to go too far (not counting the stuff that is already off limits for getting a Charmed target to do) will end it early as well.

                  It's not that it doesn't work, it's just a fairly fragile method.

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                  • #10
                    Well Vampires are master social manipulators for a reason. Other Vampires can protect themselves to a degree( Lashing Out; Disciplines that help an assasine, knowledge about a Vampires capabilities) and a single mortal shouldn't pose any danger in most cases for a Vampire.

                    As for your example, either PC's are justifiably paranoid enough ingame to just use Majesty and ask someone who approaches them if he is secretly an assasine, in which case Majesty or not they probably wouldn't let strangers get close to them. Or there are other problems at work that aren't tied to Majesty( maybe only people who are secret assasines ever approach your PCs)
                    In addition, if they use Majesty on everybody all the time, it should have consequences on the world around them and also most Vampires should have reason not wanting to be the center of attention all the time( Awe is not a directed power. Literally all Eyes are on you now)

                    Also, Yes some stories wouldn't be possible, or play out the same as they would in a Mortals game. And they shouldn't. That's a feature not a bug. Playing a Vampire should be distinctly different than playing a Mortal, which should reflect in the stories and how they play out.

                    There is the real possibility that some of the things you try to do aren't suited for Vampire.

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                    • #11
                      If they really like you, they probably won't kill you. On the other hand, they'll probably want to lie about having been sent to do it, because who wants to tell someone they like that they came to kill them?


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