Bloodline to Clan

[Baaldam]

No, should get that book?

Yes, brings up a series of options, ideas and alternate takes on the subject of blood-drinking monsters, blood & more, most definitely worth it.

[LostLight]

Perhaps one more question to close off this thread. The part neglected. You debated on what would occur if it happened, how does it happen? What should be the mechanics for the actual transition?

Like, the mechanics would probably a child being sired which instead of having the Discipline spread, attributes and Bane of the sire's original Clan, has the spread, attributes and Bane of the new clan instead. Reasons for why it could happen may be a) having enough members of the Bloodline within the Clan that they have either some metaphysical impact or just enough Embraces to cause a mutation within the Blood b) Diablerie (like always) c) divine/diabolical intervention, as some powerful entity gets involved and cements the powers of the Bloodline as a Clan.

[Baaldam]

Like, the mechanics would probably a child being sired which instead of having the Discipline spread, attributes and Bane of the sire's original Clan, has the spread, attributes and Bane of the new clan instead. Reasons for why it could happen may be a) having enough members of the Bloodline within the Clan that they have either some metaphysical impact or just enough Embraces to cause a mutation within the Blood b) Diablerie (like always) c) divine/diabolical intervention, as some powerful entity gets involved and cements the powers of the Bloodline as a Clan.

Hmmm, might Breaking Points and Bane formation play some sort of role on this? Now i'm thinking of a kindred that somehow ends erasing its clan weakness instead of a bane upon rising Humanity or some similar phenomena....

[Tessie]

Hmmm, might Breaking Points and Bane formation play some sort of role on this? Now i'm thinking of a kindred that somehow ends erasing its clan weakness instead of a bane upon rising Humanity or some similar phenomena....

Kindred don't lose or suppress Banes by increasing their Humanity. But there might very well be a relationship between Clan Banes and taken Banes since both appear when the vampire falls in Humanity, unlike Bloodline Curses that appear upon joining a Bloodline.

[Baaldam]

Kindred don't lose or suppress Banes by increasing their Humanity. But there might very well be a relationship between Clan Banes and taken Banes since both appear when the vampire falls in Humanity, unlike Bloodline Curses that appear upon joining a Bloodline.

So there's no way to undo banes once acquired? Will admit that 2e mechanics are far from my forte, partly due to lack of a group since late 1e.

[Satchel]

So there's no way to undo banes once acquired? Will admit that 2e mechanics are far from my forte, partly due to lack of a group since late 1e.

Bane acquisition is one of the Trait-agnostic markers for character progression in Vampire. (The other big one being elders' extra Anchor and tweaked relation to the Touchstone systems.)

[Baaldam]

Bane acquisition is one of the Trait-agnostic markers for character progression in Vampire. (The other big one being elders' extra Anchor and tweaked relation to the Touchstone systems.)

Goes to show how much i need to separate some weekend for a 2e reading binge/marathon of sorts i think.

[Baaldam]

My personal guidelines for "Bloodline to Clan evolution" are as follows-

As the Bloodline (the Child) becomes a different Clan from the original (the Sire), it loses one of the four Disciplines. Those Disciplines, as well as its favored attributes, will decide its final fate-

a) if the new Child maintains the same three Disciplines and have the same favored attributes as the Sire, it becomes their "sibling"- such as Hollow Mekhet and regular Mekhet, or the strange Mekhet subtype from Spilled Blood.

Kind of forgot to ask back then, who are those subtype you mean?

[LostLight]

Kind of forgot to ask back then, who are those subtype you mean?

Ayanada from Spilled Blood have a variant Bane which makes her more ghostlike than the common Mekhet, which is the subtype referred here

[Baaldam]

Ayanada from Spilled Blood have a variant Bane which makes her more ghostlike than the common Mekhet, which is the subtype referred here

Oh yeah, indeed. A condition that could make also a kind of bridge with the Jianshi too, i guess. Time to hit the book again for some creative fodder.

[Yossarian]

Ayanada from Spilled Blood have a variant Bane which makes her more ghostlike than the common Mekhet, which is the subtype referred here

If you look closely at Ayanda's powers in her stat block, you can also see what her clan Disciplines are.

[LostLight]

Oh.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh.

And now I wonder is that resemblance to the Khaibit's Discipline spread is a coincidence or not.

[Yossarian]

Oh.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh.

And now I wonder is that resemblance to the Khaibit's Discipline spread is a coincidence or not.

A little insider baseball:

My first draft of Ayanda included a lost clan called the Omoya. Possibly related to the Mekhet, they had a variant Auspex power called Umbono, which related to the dead specifically, but couldn't affect the living. This concept got redlined for a couple of reasons, mostly because the book ended up with more lost clans than expected / needed, and they weren't quite different enough from the Mekhet to really fit in the setting. Anyway, here's what they looked like:

The Ones Who Spoke for the Dead

Something dead approaches. If it ever had a heart, it fed it to Hell to lighten the load. Thus unburdened, it proclaims the wisdom of graves, and a promise that soon you’ll know it too.

Ayanda believes she’s the last of the Omoya, but she has little interest in continuing the line. The dead should remain so. A handful of elders may hide in torpor or among the Acolytes, but if they were to sire, most of their childer would end up Mekhet.

Most.

Nickname: Specters

Favored Attributes: Intelligence or Strength

Disciplines: Auspex, Celerity, Vigor

Clan Bane (The Taboo Curse): [as with Ayanda's bane in NH:SB]

[Baaldam]

A little insider baseball:

My first draft of Ayanda included a lost clan called the Omoyo. Possibly related to the Mekhet, they had a variant Auspex power called Umbono, which related to the dead specifically, but couldn't affect the living. This concept got redlined for a couple of reasons, mostly because the book ended up with more lost clans than expected / needed, and they weren't quite different enough from the Mekhet to really fit in the setting. Anyway, here's what they looked like:

Curiously, looking for Omoyo on Google led me to this.
Coincidence I Think Not.


Now, a little less tongue-in-check and more on topic, one of the rumors on Ayanda got me thinking if her own creation was wholly as planned, if her bane wasn't as much happenstance as much as her planned childer turning Mekhet, but revenants perhaps turning more spectral. Botched banes for botched embraces?

Could a secret of breaking from a strain of vampirism into another be hidden in something so simple?

[Yossarian]

Curiously, looking for Omoyo on Google led me to this.
Coincidence I Think Not.


Now, a little less tongue-in-check and more on topic, one of the rumors on Ayanda got me thinking if her own creation was wholly as planned, if her bane wasn't as much happenstance as much as her planned childer turning Mekhet, but revenants perhaps turning more spectral. Botched banes for botched embraces?

Could a secret of breaking from a strain of vampirism into another be hidden in something so simple?

Hmmmmmmm...

Others say it wasn’t a specifically Daeva and Nosferatu problem. The Embrace goes wrong sometimes, especially if given for the wrong reasons. With enough mistakes in a small space of time, patterns form. Perhaps the Kindred of New England were just as prone to hysteria as the humans. A Ventrue resurrects her last mortal grandchild to keep a grasp on her legacy, realizing too late what she’s robbed him of. A Mekhet sees an untimely death and tells himself he’s doing a kindness, that his curse is the least awful of all the clans, but soon he learns the price of lacking self-awareness. In that light, the Kindred of New England were covering up their own sins.