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Blood and Smoke Bloodline Disciplines conversions

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  • #16
    What I think would be most helpful is guidelines for how to cost discipline powers. It's hard for me to get a feel for what costs 1 Vitae vs. 2, vs. Willpower, and why based on the updated disciplines. It kind of seems like the first dot is usually free, the second and third are usually 1, the fourth is usually 2 (sometimes in addition to the cost of a lower dot power it updates) and the fifth is usually at least 2, sometimes with a willpower as well, and often requires extended rituals if it affects a large area and/or lasts a long time. Is this more or less what the idea was? Are there certain types of effects that generally cost more? A rough guideline would really help.


    Going by Willow now, or Wil for short. She/Her/Hers.

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    • #17
      FWIW, years ago I wrote some Vicissitude replacement Devotions. They're still workable within the paradigms of B&S. Here they are, with the minor conversions necessary.

      Body Crafts

      Below are a series of traits specifically designed for the Kindred who aspires towards body crafting. All three require the student to be Kindred, ghouls simply cannot muster the creative energy required to change life. Do note that the below abilities are all very alien, and require deliberate atrocity on the part of the vampire. Under most circumstances, practice of body crafting is considered a breaking point to vampires at or above three dots of Humanity. Do note that with Body Craft skills, a vampire may be able to emulate certain Merits. These Merits need not be purchased, due to the high upkeep cost of the modification.

      Symbiotic Genesis

      Merit (3 Dots, Kindred Only)

      Through rigorous training, the vampire has learned to extend the power of creating ghouls and Embracing to a more rarefied level. A vampire with Symbiotic Genesis can invest a bit of vitae and Willpower into a piece of a mortal as it leaves the body, in order to prevent its death and freeze it in a sort of pseudo-stasis between ghouldom and vampirism. The body part, be it limb, bone, or even just a sample of flesh, will try its best to fuse itself to a Kindred as it instinctively knows that it won't last long detached.
      System: Upon removal of a body part from a mortal, the vampire must spend 1 Willpower point and one vitae in order to prevent the death of the tissues. This must be done within the first hour of removal, or else the limb simply withers. If the act is done correctly, the body part can remain living for one night per dot of Blood Potency possessed by the creator. By the end of that time, the part must be re-infused or it dies rapidly.
      When the detached part comes in contact with flesh, it will immediately attempt to fuse with the subject. The body part attacks with a dice pool equal to its Size, effectively a grapple. In all relevant grapple rolls, it uses its Size + the vampire's Blood Potency as a dice pool. If the subject is knowledgeable of the process, they can apply Defense as appropriate. The subject can also willingly allow the part to fuse.
      If the grapple is successful, the limb begins to fuse with the subject. Each turn, the part comes closer to a full bond. Once a number of turns have passed equal to the subject's Stamina, the two are fused. Removal of the part then requires the subject to suffer lethal damage equal to the part's Size.
      Once bound, the part drains from the subject a number of vitae equal to its Size every week. If this removes the final vitae from a sleeping Kindred, the Kindred slips into torpor and further feeding comes directly from the vampire's health in lethal damage. This can cause Final Death if left unmolested. Against mortals, a dot of Stamina is removed every day until a time when it reaches zero, then the mortal simply dies. Removal of such a part causes lethal damage equal to the part's Size. The function of this Merit relies on further Devotions to craft practical additions to the Kindred form. If the Kindred first harms himself, the attachment can be used to fill the space. The wound is effectively healed so long as the attachment remains. While attached, the part uses all relevant traits of the host body. Damage done to the attachment is done to the host, and can be healed with the host's vitae, just as any other part of the body.

      Flesh as an Mortar

      Devotion (Protean 2, Resilience 1, Symbiotic Genesis)

      Once Symbiotic Genesis has created an extension of the Kindred form, this Devotion can sculpt the flesh and muscle tissue of the addition as if they were a clay. This can serve cosmetic function or practical function.

      Cost: 1 Willpower

      Dice Pool: Intelligence + Crafts + Protean

      Action: Extended. Each roll represents one hour of work and costs one Willpower point.

      Upon spending the Willpower point, the flesh of the body attachment becomes malleable for one hour, allowing for sculpting and molding. This devotion does not allow for alteration of bone. After the hour is passed, the change is effectively permanent. Below are a few suggested modifications, roll modifiers for difficulty, and the successes required. Feel free to be creative with further additions, using the chart below as a guideline for suggested difficulty.

      Modification Modifiers Successes Required
      Generic appearance change (same gender) +1 5
      Gender change (cosmetic) 0 10
      Imitate specific person -2 15
      Add Striking Looks (1 dot) -2 10
      Add pocket for concealment (Size 1) -1 10
      Add pocket for concealment (Size 2) -3 20
      Add 1/0 Armor -2 10
      This devotion costs 2 Experiences to learn.

      Bone as Masonry

      Devotion (Protean 3, Vigor 1, Flesh as Mortar)

      As the previous devotion has started upon the path to crafting the body, this morbid power renders bone into a soft and viscid substance, allowing for more complicated manipulations including the addition of new limbs and subtle changes in facial structure previously not possible.

      Cost: Flesh as Mortar must be active, then one Vitae is spent for one hour of alteration.

      Dice Pool: Intelligence + Crafts + Protean

      Action: Extended. Each roll represents one hour of work and costs one Vitae, on top of the one Willpower needed for Flesh as Mortar.

      At activation, bones in the additions touched by the vampire become softer, able to be altered and shaped. After the hour passes, if further Willpower and Vitae are not spent, the changes are effectively permanent until further edited. Below are a few suggested modifications, roll modifiers for difficulty, and total successes required. Feel free to be creative with further modifications, using the chart below as a guideline for suggested difficulty. Note that weapons created with bone cause the same type of damage as the closest emulated weapon. Bone accouterments have Structure equal to the vampire's Stamina.

      Durability must be added with further development. A good rule of thumb is to require 10 successes per point of Merit or Equipment emulated.

      Modification Modifiers Successes Required

      Complex appearance changes 0 10

      Gender change (stands up to scrutiny) -1 15

      Add Striking Looks 4 -2 20

      Add Giant Merit -2 40

      Create bone weapon -2 10 per bonus weapon offers

      Create bone armor (2/1, concealable) -3 20

      Create bone armor (3/2, not concealable) -3 30

      Add Durability to modification (limit Size) (Total Durability) 10 per Durability
      Complex appearance changes 0 10
      Gender change (stands up to scrutiny) -1 15
      Add Striking Looks (2 dots) -2 20
      Add Giant or Small Frame Merits -2 40
      Create bone weapon (per 1 lethal damage of the weapon) -2 10
      Create bone armor (2/1, concealable) -3 20
      Create bone armor (3/2, not concealable) -3 30
      Add Durability to modification (limit Size, per point of Durability) 0 10
      This devotion costs 3 Experiences to learn.


      David A Hill Jr
      Freelance Writer
      Independent Game Designer

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      • #18
        Oh man, I need to use Symbiotic Genesis; that's fantastic. I'd probably use it as a devotion for the Translation Guide Vicissitude.



        Social justice vampire/freelancer | He/Him

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        • #19
          Okay so I've been updating my own version based on that Devotion and some other feedback I got. If anybody notices any problems, please let me know.


          I am no longer participating in the community. Please do not contact me about my previous work.

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          • #20
            Any thoughts then on how to go about converting Blood Tenebrous? I had a Bloodline made (unique one line the Sta-Au and Therion that can draw from all Clans) that use this. Of course in my own write up I got rid of the 4 dot (didn't like the idea of tagging others along) with an Essentia 4 like version. Seeing how the disciplines all extend from the theme of the previous dot before it I'm wondering if it as whole still fits or does it need a complete revision.


            "Things need not have happened to be true. Tales and dreams are the shadow truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot." Sandman (Neil Gaiman)

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Troller View Post
              Any thoughts then on how to go about converting Blood Tenebrous? I had a Bloodline made (unique one line the Sta-Au and Therion that can draw from all Clans) that use this. Of course in my own write up I got rid of the 4 dot (didn't like the idea of tagging others along) with an Essentia 4 like version. Seeing how the disciplines all extend from the theme of the previous dot before it I'm wondering if it as whole still fits or does it need a complete revision.
              I always felt Blood Tenebrous worked much better as a Coil, being all trangressive and transcendent. Up till now the Coil system didn't really support it, but no more!

              In fact, I already wrote it. I wrote it even before I'd finished the three main coils. Much of the Coil design process was honed through adapting Blood Tenebrous. Since it's unlikely to get reprinted there's really no harm in sharing...though the Coil still needs a better name (If anyone has a proposal I'm all ears). Anyway, here for all to peruse, the tentatively named Coil of Divinity.


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              • #22
                Awesome haha. How does Shadow Aura work though? What attribute is rolled with Blood Potency or does it roll the coil rank?
                Last edited by Rani Neferet; 11-07-2013, 05:55 PM.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Leetsepeak View Post
                  Okay so I've been updating my own version based on that Devotion and some other feedback I got. If anybody notices any problems, please let me know.
                  Looks good, but I'd change the rolls to Medicine, rather than Crafts. They made that change in the V20 version, and I think it makes more sense. Not a big deal, though.



                  Social justice vampire/freelancer | He/Him

                  VtR: Curses of Caine in Requiem 2ndTricks of the DamnedBtP: Secrets of VancouverCofD: The CabinActual Play: Vampire: The Requiem – Bloodlines
                  Podcast: The Breakup

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Rani Neferet View Post
                    Awesome haha. How does Shadow Aura work though? What attribute is rolled with Blood Potency or does it roll the coil rank?
                    Oooh, Coil Rank. Good idea, it uses that. Coil Rank + Blood Potency. Doc updated.


                    Onyx Path Moderator
                    Mod Voice is RED*
                    *All other colors should be read aloud in the voice of Don Knotts.
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                    • #25
                      Hmm, the Coil is cool but it wouldn't work for my game. Maybe I can convert it if you dont mind.


                      "Things need not have happened to be true. Tales and dreams are the shadow truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot." Sandman (Neil Gaiman)

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Troller View Post
                        Hmm, the Coil is cool but it wouldn't work for my game. Maybe I can convert it if you dont mind.
                        I'd be a terrible hypocrite if I got angry when people tweaked my work.

                        Might I ask what about it doesn't work for you?


                        Onyx Path Moderator
                        Mod Voice is RED*
                        *All other colors should be read aloud in the voice of Don Knotts.
                        Hacks and House Rules Hub Thread

                        CofD Hacks By Splat: Vampire | Werewolf | Mage | Mummy | Demon

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                        • #27
                          Probably it being a coil and restricted to the OD if I were to guess.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Yossarian View Post

                            Looks good, but I'd change the rolls to Medicine, rather than Crafts. They made that change in the V20 version, and I think it makes more sense. Not a big deal, though.
                            Hmm. I've thought about that, but I have to admit that I think the idea of crafting flesh and people like a tool or an object has a certain thematic appeal, especially because I'm intending to give this version of Vicissitude to a Bloodline of artists. Think sculptors but the chosen medium is flesh, and since the praxis of their discipline isn't particularly scientific.

                            That said, I was considering an additional Appendix of optional modifiers that might be used to provide bonuses. Maybe some optional merits too, include one which allows a more scientific approach to Vicissitude?

                            I'm thinking it'd be a one-dot merit that lets you substitute Medicine for crafts. It might come with an additional bonus of hiding a biologically unnatural origin for some of these changes.

                            I think that I feel comfortable with having Bloodform variant as the 5th dot, though any thoughts on something cooler or if it's inferior to the Ghoul version are appreciated. Also thoughts on the Altered Condition.

                            My big issue now is costs. Should I keep a standardized cost model across the board? Meaning that Regular Alterations cost 2 Vitae and 10 successes, while Superior Alterations cost 4 Vitae and 20 successes. I felt the heavy Vitae cost for non-masters helps for the fact that these changes are pretty permanent, barring a Vampire healing it or a mortal getting corrective surgery. (You could always go back to the Vicissitude user!...)


                            I am no longer participating in the community. Please do not contact me about my previous work.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Rani Neferet View Post
                              Probably it being a coil and restricted to the OD if I were to guess.
                              Bingo. I like its introduction in Book of Shadows as a Discipline available to all Kindred, free of Clan and Covenant since the Twilight world is so intense. But it needs also a a group to dedicate to it so that why I figured a Bloodline. I mean the idea of an Invidtus bargaining with spirits, Lancea summoning 'devils', even Carthian's literally trying to capture an ideal seemed much to cool to restrict it. However saying that the Coil you wrote up is good.


                              "Things need not have happened to be true. Tales and dreams are the shadow truths that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes, and forgot." Sandman (Neil Gaiman)

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                              • #30
                                I'd be interested to see Tenure and Mortualia conversions.

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