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  • Originally posted by Adrasalieth View Post
    KageMCS

    ​Id' propose either one (or both) of these:

    A) Thirik-Harmathakhdul ("Extensive Traveller of the Fallen World")

    It mimics the distinction made by Werewolves and spirits between the title of Gurihathakhdul ("one that has extensively travelled the Gurihal, the physical world of the Flesh") and this of Hisithakhdul ("one that has extensively travelled the Shadow"), but emphasizes on the world as it is Fallen (thirik: to fall, to collapse, to disintegrate; Thirik-Harmatha: the Fallen World).

    The reason for this emphasis in the case of an almost-but-not-quite-Scelesti is evident, though its exact implications are not that clear. Perhaps it cynically implies that Pilgrims are the only non-Scelesti mages that have seen enough of the Fallen World to understand how irremediably sundered from the Supernal it was, which makes them lucid enough to deal with the reality of the Fall rather than keep up vain and delusional pretenses of avoiding anything Abyssal. Unless it simply underlines that this reality Falls even lower everywhere a Pilgrim treads.

    B) Yageken-Thun ("Travellers of the Void").

    (same construction as Illusah-Thun, "the Travellers of Watery Trails", aka Riverkin)

    While "Yageken" (hole, void) is simply the First Tongue term for the Abyss,"thun" can either indicate the notion of travel ("to move, to travel; to place elsewhere") or the idea of digging, rocking, or churning around. So Yageken-Thun could also be understood as "Those who Displace the Void" or "Hole Diggers".
    Oooh, both of those look useful. They have very nice implications built into them. I'm thinking I'll use Thirik-Harmathakhdul for most, while Yageken-Thun is used as a stealth insult to masters that hunt down students for beginning the Path of Befouling. Sort of a "digging yourself deeper" jab for those in the know. That's my thoughts right now anyways, I'll definitely be thinking it over more, maybe take more time to look over the dictionary more thoroughly. Thank you!
    Last edited by KageMCS; 10-08-2018, 09:56 AM.

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    • KageMCS

      Upon reflection…

      The ranks in the Scelesti hierarchy are not in First Tongue, but in various, more tardive Semitic languages: Rabashakim derives from Rabashak, the name or term used to designate the envoy of an Assyrian king in the Book of Nahum, while Aswadim comes from the Arabian word aswad (“black”). I think it’d be more fitting (and cooler) to maintain that stylistical continuity. (Also, it might be handy to have a word that is less of a mouthful than Thirik-Harmathakhdul...)

      Hence, while the First Tongue terms I give you may still be accurate to describe the Pilgrims (or even any kind of Befouler) from the standpoint of an Uremehir speaker, I’ve decided to submit to you a couple of terms in broken Akkadian.

      When speaking about Four Rules Pilgrims showing no interest in furthering their dealings with the Abyss, Scelesti refer to them as Nakrim or Nakarim (“foreigners, strangers, enemies”). The mere fact that an Awakened unbefouled could behold and make use of its dreadful wonders and get away with it, without paying the due toll in chaotic change and beautiful tragedy, is blasphemy without measure to them.

      Oppositedly, those who seem to embrace the tenets of the Scelesti and use their gifts to further their agenda receive the (slightly) less appellation of Ubārim (“visitors, guests; immigrants”). While it also indicates a level of foreignness, it also denotates some measure of acceptance. For her eagerness and deviousness, the Pilgrim is tolerated: the Abyss is not yet her home, but it may be, one day.

      Lastly. those with full understanding of the Four Rules probably earn themselves the title of Shanamzaqim (from the Akkadian ša namzaqi, "a doorkeeper, person in charge of keys"). Whether they gladly enter the building they spent so long to map and charter, finally merging with their Ziggurat, or simply swing open its gates without risking themselves in, Shanamzaqim are enablers to the Abyss, showering the world in its twisted blessings, and Scelesti respect that, however begrudgingly.

      Of course, the name of “Doormen” to qualify non-Scelesti unleashers and subduers of Abyssal Manifestations is not without reminding a certain Exarch of the Gate… (whistle gleefully in Parametric Language).
      Last edited by Adrasalieth; 10-08-2018, 10:15 PM.

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      • Originally posted by Adrasalieth View Post
        [USER="5467"]
        snip
        Wow, is it my birthday? Thanks for putting that much extra effort into this, it will do quite handsomely. All that detail you always put in really helps a lot. I think I'll hang on to Thirik-Harmathakhdul if only because the description you included spoke so strongly to me, I'll come up with some justification. Maybe a Scelestus learned in Spirit uses it as a sort of formal categorization, shared only with carefully selected fellow specialists. As for Nakarim and Ubārim, they follow very logically, fit well into what I was thinking, and dropping the number of syllables below six is certainly appreciated. And Shanamzaqim, well now that really made my day. Namedropping the Gate on me on the sly, thanks for that!

        And it only now occurs to me I maybe was a little rude re-posting your post in another thread without asking. Is it alright to share this in the Homebrew Mage Merits thread?

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        • Originally posted by KageMCS View Post

          Wow, is it my birthday? Thanks for putting that much extra effort into this, it will do quite handsomely. All that detail you always put in really helps a lot. I think I'll hang on to Thirik-Harmathakhdul if only because the description you included spoke so strongly to me, I'll come up with some justification. Maybe a Scelestus learned in Spirit uses it as a sort of formal categorization, shared only with carefully selected fellow specialists. As for Nakarim and Ubārim, they follow very logically, fit well into what I was thinking, and dropping the number of syllables below six is certainly appreciated. And Shanamzaqim, well now that really made my day. Namedropping the Gate on me on the sly, thanks for that!

          And it only now occurs to me I maybe was a little rude re-posting your post in another thread without asking. Is it alright to share this in the Homebrew Mage Merits thread?
          You're very welcome ! Your take on the Merit was very inspiring, and having this kind of clear and creative material often gets me going on nerdy stuff like this ^^

          Of course you can re-post this, don't hesitate to make my phrases more concise (English is not my mother tongue, and I tend to make really long strings of words to get my point across).

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          • Originally posted by Adrasalieth View Post

            You're very welcome ! Your take on the Merit was very inspiring, and having this kind of clear and creative material often gets me going on nerdy stuff like this ^^

            Of course you can re-post this, don't hesitate to make my phrases more concise (English is not my mother tongue, and I tend to make really long strings of words to get my point across).
            Thank you! I blamed all the multiple offered translations on the vagaries of the language differences. And I will continue to do so. You wield the English language with care and precision more native speakers should aspire to. Brevity may be the soul of wit, but don't look down on loquaciousness!

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            • I approach the great First Tongue thread seeking knowledge!

              I'm using the Forsaken tribes in an Apocalypse chronicle, and using the First Tongue for Garou language as well. I changed some tribe names, though, so there weren't duplicate name elements, that I would appreciate re-translations for.

              Blood Talons -> Blood Runners, based on the imagery of stepping in blood and leaving a trail of gory pawprints. I tied them to Sami/Siberian/North Asian cultures.

              Storm Lords -> Oncoming Storm, based on the imagery of a storm cloud being blown towards a mountain top. I tied them to eastern European cultures like the Shadow Lords and Silver Fangs.

              Bone Shadows -> Mor Rioghain, not based on, but inspired by, the imagery of a crow flying over a marsh. Obviously I tied them to Celtic cultures, but beyond the name they're closer to the Welsh/Bretons/what-have-you.


              Unrelated is an idea I've been playing with about an apocalypse for the Forsaken setting. It would involve an avatar of Mother Luna and a "second coming" of Father Wolf - Sister Moon and Brother Wolf. I wanted to ask the experts, would Ninidu and Sesur be the right translations?

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              • How would be translated Pangaeans as term? And singular Pangaean?


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                • Dhudhishgimudh-mushmah - single pangaean


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                  • That's perfect. It's complex enough that it seems mysterious, while also being so complex people should use Pangaeans.

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                    • What is the word "blizzard" in the First Tongue? I can't find it anywhere.

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                      • Shegh = snow; sleet; cold weather; frost, ice; burning, incineration; chills, shivers
                        Marru = stormwind

                        So, I'd probably translate "Blizzard" as "Shegmarru"




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                        • Was perusing the thread as I worked on deed names for NPCs, and the collection of Geist-flavored terms made me wonder if anyone has worked out what the First Tongue for Sin-Eater might be. I have a Wolf-Blooded in the same game that recently underwent the Bargain and knowing what any spirits he encounters might refer to him as could be helpful.


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                          • Originally posted by Caelene View Post
                            Was perusing the thread as I worked on deed names for NPCs, and the collection of Geist-flavored terms made me wonder if anyone has worked out what the First Tongue for Sin-Eater might be. I have a Wolf-Blooded in the same game that recently underwent the Bargain and knowing what any spirits he encounters might refer to him as could be helpful.
                            The word for Claimed is duguthim. Spirits, and any werewolves who care to make a distinction, might combine it with hissu (ghost). I think that might be the most widely used term for a Bound.

                            A Sin-Eater (which is just a descriptor for a Bound who actively helps ghosts) would have a more involved title name, but unfortunately it doesn't appear that it's been posted in this thread or in the document in the OP. Not that it's likely to apply to a Wolf-Blooded who's still part of a pack.


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                            • Originally posted by Caelene View Post
                              Was perusing the thread as I worked on deed names for NPCs, and the collection of Geist-flavored terms made me wonder if anyone has worked out what the First Tongue for Sin-Eater might be. I have a Wolf-Blooded in the same game that recently underwent the Bargain and knowing what any spirits he encounters might refer to him as could be helpful.
                              From the First Tongue Dictionary a few related terms and the one you asked for:

                              Namuskuzu - The Death Fleshed, a Sin-Eater
                              Dug-ús-thim - Ghost-Claimed
                              erenissu - A ghost (human)
                              gazh - Catch-all ghost term, ghost-like
                              Gazh-Aha - (ghostly treasures)
                              Gazhdum - (ghost touched items, items empowered by being linked to a ghost)
                              hissu - shade/shadow, spirit of a dead person

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                              • Originally posted by nofather View Post

                                From the First Tongue Dictionary a few related terms and the one you asked for:

                                *snip*
                                Missed some of those in my perusal. Thanks!


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