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  • Petition For TRIBES OF THE MOON 2E (working title)

    We, the fans of WEREWOLF: THE FORSAKEN, would like to petition Onyx Path to create a Second Edition WEREWOLF book series about the various tribes (hereafter known as TRIBES OF THE MOON 2E, due to a similar function the 1e Tribes book performed). It would function similar to the Tribes of the Moon from 1e, but be far more in-depth about these groups and their relation to the New World of Darkness.

    As of September 26th, 2016, four writers for the New World of Darkness have expressed interest in undertaking this project: Chris Allen (a.k.a. Acrozatarim), Eric Christian Berg (a.k.a. eberg), Bunyip (RL name unlisted), Jim Fisher (a.k.a. strider1276), and Sean K.I.W. Steele (a.k.a. ArcaneArts). We also have one artist volunteering to do illustration for this series — Helur (RL name unlisted). The goals of this book series have been explained in detail by Mr. Allen, quoted from this post in the If You Could Make A Werewolf Book thread:

    Originally posted by Acrozatarim View Post
    My overall idea for how the books might play out would be:

    Kinslayers:- Blood Talons Tribe coverage; full new coverage for the Pure and their updated 2e mechanics; heretic and schismatic werewolf groups (weird wolf-cults, strange subgroups of Uratha who follow different ideologies, etc) for Blood Talons and Forsaken in general to clash and interact with; extensive rules for challenges and conflict between Uratha whether for dominance, battle or other things, from the individual level to packs clashing with each other all the way up to Protectorate-scale conflicts; an examination of the pure 'fluff' side of Uratha vs Uratha violence, the taboos, the implications, the different ways various regional Uratha go about these things and their traditions; new fighting styles, Gifts, Rites etc around clashing between Uratha.

    Shadow Hunters:- Bone Shadow Tribe coverage; definitive coverage of the Shadow, including Deep Shadow, all sorts of phenomena and weirdness, piles of hooks and descriptions of varied Shadow manifestations, more information about Resonance and the interplay between Flesh and Shadow, basically all the creative and mechanical support a GM needs to run the Shadow side of the game; a much deeper look at spirit organisation and politics than ever before to turn spirits into key characters and influences in a game; Totems, dedicating more wordcount to both the ideas and inspiration side of things, but also heftily expanding their mechanical side and offering a new framework to help cover the ascent and growth in power of a totem alongside its pack, the ways the totem and pack affect each other on even a subconscious level, etc; an examination of hunting spirits for the Uratha, with tools, tricks and traps that the Uratha can use against spirits and vice versa; and a section on some Big Names in the Shadow, going into more detail on some Lesser Incarnae, the Firstborn Totems etc, to help GMs with bringing such beings into the game rather than leaving them as distant entities that are never really interacted with.

    Sacred Ground:- Hunter in Darkness Tribe coverage; new rules for territory and the surrounding issues, such as shaping your territory, making territory a key element in clashing with other Uratha, more info on Loci, the role prey take in the territory, etc; more information on the Gauntlet itself, exploring how to bring it into a game not just as a basic boundary but as a place with strange phenomena, discussion of what lies *within* it, etc; full new coverage of the Hosts, with more detailed rules than are present in the corebook and a better examination of Host society, their goals and how they go about them, including coverage for what happens when the Hosts are successful and begin to regain the divine power of their progenitors; coverage of how Uratha interact with certain other peripheral realms (possibly including the Hedge and Underworld); and maybe new Hunting Ground write-ups or examples of specific Sacred Places that the Uratha and Hunters in Darkness hold as sacred ground.

    Watchdogs:- Iron Master Tribe coverage; more rules for humanity as prey, including specific prey-groups from cultists to corporations and how they can both be a threat to and be threatened by the Uratha; rules for human shamen expanded out of the Rites system; an examination of the difficulties of maintaining a human cover amidst society for an Uratha, the challenges of hunting in dense urban areas and amongst human communities in general, and how humans drastically shape the spiritual reflection of the world; changes in technology and science, and both the challenges Uratha can face from these, the challenges they faced in previous technological eras, and the ways technology and change contribute to the benefit of the Uratha and the Iron Masters; and coverage of Uratha trying to affect the human population on a much larger scale, like trying to shape the destiny of nations or enslave entire regions to the machinations of spirit-gods or whatnot.

    Heirs to the Hunt:- Storm Lord Tribe coverage; deeper coverage of Claimed with more mechanics, as well as new types of Claimed horror; an examination of other weird elements of possessions and otherworldy invaders, including new antagonist types; Forsaken politics, including on a wide scale, including traditions and cultures around thereof, how Tribes and packs and Lodges interact to affect the balance of power; more extensive coverage around Protectorates, including how and why they form, system support for Protectorates and their effects, etc; and wordcount and more mechanical support for high Primal Urge werewolves, the paths available for them to take, how they affect the world and how they, in turn, are changed.

    If you like these kinds of ideas and want to see them happen, then the best suggestion I have is to contact my corporate masters Let OP know that you like the notion. Can't guarantee that it will make these books happen or anything, but worth at least communicating to OP what you want to see in the line in future!


    With these goals in mind, I, myself, would recommend that the series is handled either as:

    1) A future Kickstarter project;

    2) A future Kickstarter tier;

    3) A holiday release once the corebook of WEREWOLF 2e has been published.



    LIST OF CURRENT SUPPORTERS:

    #1. Sikla Alkis
    #2. Seidrmadr
    #3. ZealousChristian24
    #4. Paradim
    #5. Aiden
    #6. Dessembrae
    #7. Lyrics of War
    #8. Llewyd42
    #9. BigDamnHero
    #10. Rahuman101
    #11. Flyboy254
    #12. ArcaneArts
    #13. Bunyip
    #14. evolved_lupus
    #15. Thorbes
    #16. Ephraim
    #17. blackheartz
    #18. Leliel
    #19. Phersus
    #20. wyrdhamster
    #21. Heu
    #22. batro
    #23. YeOfLittleFaith
    #24. Helur
    #25. Errol216
    #26. glamourweaver
    #27. Ephsy
    #28. Heavy Arms
    #29. saibot
    #30. atamajakki
    #31. Cecoyotl
    #32. FallenEco
    #33. Satchel
    #34. Xenorath
    #35. NateD
    #36. nofather
    #37. The young man in the cafe
    #38. Felipe
    #39. Barbrarilen
    #40. rx781a
    #41. Amravanti
    #42. NiceBrian
    #43. De_K47
    #44. Illuminated Minutia
    #45. Veddhartha
    #46.damoqles
    #47. grimjaws
    #48. Agentwestmer
    #49. Cravax
    #50. Schurchk
    #51. Second Chances
    #52. Deionscribe
    #53. BinAly
    #54. LokiRavenSpeak
    #55. EmanantVolition
    #56. Monghani
    #57.
    #58.
    #59.
    #60.
    #61.
    #62.
    #63.
    #64.
    #65.
    #66.
    #67.
    #68.
    #69.
    #70.

    (more numbers to be added
    as future supporters come on board)









    Additional ideas that could be added to the book series, whether as stretch goals or part of the overall writing, include:

    Originally posted by Nyx View Post
    I'd want to write something on the Ghost Wolves, tribeless, impure and in a world that hunts them. Just so much potential for awesome as it is the only "tribe" that really hasn't been explored in any great detail. Alternatively, I think a book of mechanical fluff, like how the senses would function post-change and other minor, overlooked details to add to the Uratha immersion.
    Originally posted by Lyrics Of War View Post
    I back this one hundred percent. And a tribe book for pure, and bale hounds aswell.
    Originally posted by YeOfLittleFaith View Post
    So I just heard about the Uralath being a thing now. And just heard that, despite being such a potentially huge thing, they only get a sidebar and a few other mentions in the 2e core.

    And I DEMAND MORE OF THE WOLF-BROTHERS IN ANY SUPPOSED ADDITIONAL BOOKS.
    Originally posted by glamourweaver View Post


    A possibility that crossed my mind was if Inferno got a 2Edition update, it could relevant chapters for different lines... not necessarily EVERY line, but the discussion of the Maeljin as the Werewolf view of what others call Archdemons, and the Bale Hounds as their pact-forming minions, would fit there. Could put Belial's Brood in the same book (bringing literal demons into the picture is a bit new for them, but with intentionally sinning to bargain for powers, it fits - I'm NOT saying do away with their ideology that they are enfleshed demons trying to achieve realization as what they truly are); a new Left-Handed Legacy for dealing with the Inferno; etc.
    Originally posted by Xenorath View Post
    Put my name on the list too. I think these are a great idea. I'm a little worried that there won't be enough room to cover some stuff in enough detail, but then again I'm a huge Shartha fan, so I"m willing to admit that I'm a bit biased. Also Balehounds, but I don't know how feasible an entire book dedicated to Balehounds and Wound spirits would be.
    Originally posted by Agentwestmer View Post
    Signed.

    In addition, crunch!:
    Tribal rites
    Tribe specific gifts and facets, including milestone gifts
    Tribe specific merits, preferable including a style merit matching each tribes particular area of expertise? (Dealing with Spirits for Boneshadows, leadership for the Stormlords, etc.)

    Can we can an example each tribe's sacred prey (a Host for Hunters in Darkness, a spirit for the Bone Shadows section, etc.)? Something off the wall, out of the ordinary and off beat?

    Following the same, can we discuss the complications of each sacred prey? In the main rulebook there was a section a about a pack of Blood Talons setting up a human farm, only for Destroyer Wolf to go into destroyer mode on them. What if Destroyer wolf didn't step in, and another pack now has to destroy the renegade, and then deal with the politics of passing judgement and then executing another pack of Forsaken, no matter how justified the cause? What if a Hunter cell makes its way into a position of political power and makes trouble for packs in the area, how does the Iron Master lead a Siskur-dur to hunt the threat and then the fallout? Stuff like that, things that really bring home the implications of having a sacred prey.

    Can we get the ways tribes conflict, what happens when the Stormlord and the Bloodtalon just refuse to see eye-to-eye? Besides a bloody mess, of course.

    And oh yes, a little bit, a paragraph or two, about wach tribe is dealing with the idigam. Not a codified view, of course. The Idigam a new, unknown threat, but just a little bit of how the square peg of a tribe's world view is likely to interact with the round hole of a cthulhoid per-historic nightmare thing.
    Originally posted by Paradim View Post

    A topic I would greatly appreciate seeing covered is advice and suggestions on how to present and utilize Tribes in your stories. I have to admit, approaching Tribes in how they factor into Packs and Lodges is something I don't quite grasp well.

    How does knowledge spread in a Tribe across members? How do Tribes recruit? What kind of problems are relevant to the different Tribes? What do Tribes offer to its members? Do the Firstborn interact with their Tribes? What's the difference between a multi-Tribe pack and a single Tribe pack?

    These are all questions I wrestle with and I don't have good answers for them. Seeing a book or books delve into these would be greatly helpful to me.
    Originally posted by BinAly View Post
    I seem to be a little late for this discussion. Just let me see if a get this right:

    Kinslayers

    Blood Talons Tribe coverage; full new coverage for the Pure and their updated 2e mechanics; heretic and schismatic werewolf groups (weird wolf-cults, strange subgroups of Uratha who follow different ideologies, etc) for Blood Talons and Forsaken in general to clash and interact with; extensive rules for challenges and conflict between Uratha whether for dominance, battle or other things, from the individual level to packs clashing with each other all the way up to Protectorate-scale conflicts; an examination of the pure 'fluff' side of Uratha vs Uratha violence, the taboos, the implications, the different ways various regional Uratha go about these things and their traditions; new fighting styles, Gifts, Rites etc around clashing between Uratha.

    Aside from expanding on the Blood Talon tribe, it would probably deal with Ghost Wolves, the Pure, and Bale Hounds. I hope to see playable Pure rules as well as a less black and white scenario among Urdaga and Anshega. As for Bale Hounds, they are my favorites, which would sell me the book just for them.


    Shadow Hunters

    Bone Shadow Tribe coverage; definitive coverage of the Shadow, including Deep Shadow, all sorts of phenomena and weirdness, piles of hooks and descriptions of varied Shadow manifestations, more information about Resonance and the interplay between Flesh and Shadow, basically all the creative and mechanical support a GM needs to run the Shadow side of the game; a much deeper look at spirit organisation and politics than ever before to turn spirits into key characters and influences in a game; Totems, dedicating more wordcount to both the ideas and inspiration side of things, but also heftily expanding their mechanical side and offering a new framework to help cover the ascent and growth in power of a totem alongside its pack, the ways the totem and pack affect each other on even a subconscious level, etc; an examination of hunting spirits for the Uratha, with tools, tricks and traps that the Uratha can use against spirits and vice versa; and a section on some Big Names in the Shadow, going into more detail on some Lesser Incarnae, the Firstborn Totems etc, to help GMs with bringing such beings into the game rather than leaving them as distant entities that are never really interacted with.

    Aside from expanding on the Bone Shadow tribe, it would give in deep information about Twilight, the Gauntlet, and the Shadow: Ghosts, Ectoplasm, Hisil Landscape, Spirits and even weirder things. Might overlap a little with Kinslayers as it should cover the Maeljin and Wounds.


    Sacred Ground

    Hunter in Darkness Tribe coverage; new rules for territory and the surrounding issues, such as shaping your territory, making territory a key element in clashing with other Uratha, more info on Loci, the role prey take in the territory, etc; more information on the Gauntlet itself, exploring how to bring it into a game not just as a basic boundary but as a place with strange phenomena, discussion of what lies *within* it, etc; full new coverage of the Hosts, with more detailed rules than are present in the corebook and a better examination of Host society, their goals and how they go about them, including coverage for what happens when the Hosts are successful and begin to regain the divine power of their progenitors; coverage of how Uratha interact with certain other peripheral realms (possibly including the Hedge and Underworld); and maybe new Hunting Ground write-ups or examples of specific Sacred Places that the Uratha and Hunters in Darkness hold as sacred ground.

    Aside from expanding on the Hunter in Darkness tribe, it would be our new Territories with the added subject of Hosts: Patrolling, territory mechanics like Damnation City, in deep Host rules and even new hosts. This also might cover Pagaeans, since Rat and Spider were those, and even give us new legends to seed our stories.


    Watchdogs

    Iron Master Tribe coverage; more rules for humanity as prey, including specific prey-groups from cultists to corporations and how they can both be a threat to and be threatened by the Uratha; rules for human shamen expanded out of the Rites system; an examination of the difficulties of maintaining a human cover amidst society for an Uratha, the challenges of hunting in dense urban areas and amongst human communities in general, and how humans drastically shape the spiritual reflection of the world; changes in technology and science, and both the challenges Uratha can face from these, the challenges they faced in previous technological eras, and the ways technology and change contribute to the benefit of the Uratha and the Iron Masters; and coverage of Uratha trying to affect the human population on a much largerscale, like trying to shape the destiny of nations or enslave entire regions to the machinations of spirit-gods or whatnot.

    Aside from expanding on the Iron Master tribe, it would give us information on how technology affects the Uratha, and how mortals become capable of harnessing the power of the Hisil and use it against the wolves.


    Heirs to the Hunt

    Storm Lord Tribe coverage; deeper coverage of Claimed with more mechanics, as well as new types of Claimed horror; an examination of other weird elements of possessions and otherworldy invaders, including new antagonist types; Forsaken politics, including on a wide scale, including traditions and cultures around thereof, how Tribes and packs and Lodges interact to affect the balance of power; more extensive coverage around Protectorates, including how and why they form, system support for Protectorates and their effects, etc; and wordcount and more mechanical support for high Primal Urge werewolves, the paths available for them to take, how they affect the world and how they, in turn, are changed.

    Aside from expanding on the Storm Lord tribe, it would give us deeper Claiming and Politics rules. It will clearly overlap with Watchdogs and Sacred Ground, but done right this might add a lot of info on those topics. I'm really curious about "new antagonists", I guess Spirits will receive a lot of new ways to transform flesh into monstrosity. I advise covering the Indigam here, since they are the threats that unite Forsaken, and thus generate the most "politiking" you will ever find in a chronicle of Uratha.


    Count me in, boys. If I got this right, I would buy every single one of those books, twice if needed for them to become reality.
    Originally posted by atamajakki View Post
    I'd honestly like to see a book on the Tribes (stuffed with snapshots of history, new Gifts, possibly a handful of Lodges, and rumors of lost Tribes or Tribes to come), a book of antagonists (give the Pure a pretty hefty chapter, then toss some wordcount at mortals, Bale Hounds, skinchangers, and the like), and then another book that devotes itself fully to Spirits and the Shadow (both describing possibly enemies and allies/totems/packmates, and what the Shadow is like when you roam it and partially live in it). I'd also love to see the Werewolf equivalent of Equinox Road, covering what happens at Primal Urge 7-10, extensive material on Idigam, and then some possible truths about Father Wolf, Luna, and the Firstborn.
    Last edited by Sikla Alkis; 09-30-2016, 10:02 AM.



  • #2
    I thought the idea was to have each one be its own book?


    Revlid wrote:
    Yes, hollowing out your humanity to become an utterly utilitarian asura is the exact suggestion I would expect from you, Aiden.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Aiden View Post
      I thought the idea was to have each one be its own book?
      I read it as "book", not books. Going to fix that.


      Comment


      • #4
        Signed, I'm totally in on this

        Comment


        • #5
          While I'm generally in favor, part of me wants to wait for 2e to actually get in my hands so I can see how the 1e material works with it. I have no idea if 2e is going to leave me wanting lots of other supplements to get covered first, or if I really want to see a new Tribes book off the bat.

          Comment


          • #6
            Tentatively adding my name to the list.

            Comment


            • #7
              Oh dear, what have I unleashed?

              Anyway, yes, my original idea for the five books was, well, as five books; there's way too much content in there to fit into just one.

              A small correction:

              As of this writing, two writers for the New World of Darkness have expressed interest in undertaking this project: Chris Allen (a.k.a. Acrozatarim) and Eric Christian Berg (a.k.a. eberg). The goals of this book series have been explained in detail by the latter, quoted from this post in the If You Could Make A Werewolf Book thread:
              The goals of the book series were explained by the former, ie me, rather than the latter. A minor thing but worth noting to avoid any confusion!


              - Chris Allen
              Freelance Writer, Deviant: the Renegade / The Pack / Dark Eras / Werewolf: the Forsaken 2nd Edition / Idigam Anthology / Fallen World Chronicle / Trinity Aeon

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Acrozatarim View Post
                Oh dear, what have I unleashed?

                Anyway, yes, my original idea for the five books was, well, as five books; there's way too much content in there to fit into just one.

                A small correction:



                The goals of the book series were explained by the former, ie me, rather than the latter. A minor thing but worth noting to avoid any confusion!

                Thanks! I sometimes get the two definitions mixed up. >.<


                Comment


                • #9
                  Id kickstart this.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I would definitely Kickstart this.

                    Either way I know I would spend money on this.


                    Revlid wrote:
                    Yes, hollowing out your humanity to become an utterly utilitarian asura is the exact suggestion I would expect from you, Aiden.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      In related good news. The core book, or at least Stew Wilson's, has finished its second proof and has been returned to the art director. Unless there's something horribly wrong as far as I know it goes to approvals next, then they publish the pdf.

                      Oh yeah obviously count me in.
                      Last edited by nofather; 03-08-2015, 04:38 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I would probably make a pact with the Maeljin themselves for this book to become reality. Would totally support

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I back this one hundred percent. And a tribe book for pure, and bale hounds aswell.


                          WoD-Dark Eras!! (Backed for Viking Age Werewolf)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Sign me up! I am down to throw money to this cause

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Lyrics Of War View Post
                              I back this one hundred percent. And a tribe book for pure, and bale hounds aswell.
                              The Pure and Bale Hounds are covered by the Blood Talon book, because they're werewolves and those are their prey.


                              Revlid wrote:
                              Yes, hollowing out your humanity to become an utterly utilitarian asura is the exact suggestion I would expect from you, Aiden.

                              Comment

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